Unknown_v2_0

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Posts posted by Unknown_v2_0


  1. 45 minutes ago, AJ_Radio said:

    All anyone does in the top 2000 on the leaderboards is try to one up each other. Nobody is playing stuff like Super Meat Boy or Street Fighter V because those are too much of a time investment. 
     

    I mean, you already played Mega Man 11 and Bloodstained, which many top hunters wouldn’t bother playing because again, too much time required.
     

    It sort of reflects the current social media landscape. Everybody is doing the exact same things on Instagram and Tik Tok. There’s no diversity at all. 
     

    If I ever get the time and resources, I’m thinking of doing a YouTube series of my own where I talk about trophies and my experiences.

     

     

    Yeah I got that bad mindset where I would weigh the games based on how fast I could plat them... Would skip out on things like MM11 or Bloodstained with its 100% list. 

     

    Yeah most social media now I think is lots of doing the same things. However I am thinking if someone does something unique at this point odds of it being found even are tremendously low. thinking the algorithms and such as just at the point that it just are just showing things to people that are super close in content to other stuff to keep people on the platform.

     

    I would be curious on your takes  via some vids

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  2. 22 hours ago, AJ_Radio said:

     

    People didn't accomplish anything. They're just flaunting their over inflated trophy count instead of taking the time to enjoy the games and actually.... sit down and have a great experience.

     

    Yeah I found that all I was doing was playing a check list even in the good games. I got so focused on that that it caused me to rush and not even take the time to enjoy the games or experiences. Unfortunately that mindset even carried over after I quit... it has gotten a lot better though and after a year I am coming back around to enjoying games more and more each one I attempt (or learn what I really like)

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  3. On 11/9/2021 at 2:21 PM, MAUSZX said:

     

     

    I think that is part of it, another is that people that really care about leaderboards and I mean people that REALLY CARE, are basically pushed to just play shitty games and their 8 versions. I seen some people pass me on the leaderboards (not that I care much, but I like to look here and there sometimes) and the people that passed many of us in just one week you look at their profile and is just a sad profile, I think in a way that's damaging, imaging buying a new ps5 to play Road Bustle 7 times, then go for the crossword thing and the 8 other region version and then go for the next one and the next one.... that's just sad, so I think that's why people complain, a lot of reasons lol.

     

    On 11/9/2021 at 6:27 PM, AJ_Radio said:

     

    Thankfully the Nintendo Switch and Steam on the PC still has a majority of people buying the good indie games as opposed to shovelware, which was made popular on Steam, giving developers excuses to release buggy products that were still in their beta stages.

     

    Since Sony made the move to California, we've seen endless amounts of garbage games with little to no quality control. Prior to 2016, trophy lists for the most part were more complete and it was a lot more difficult to find a game that you can wrap up in a hours time or less. Sony has even made AAA games far more accessible with big titles like Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart where you don't even have to grab all the collectibles. Contrast that with old games like Ratchet & Clank: A Crack in Time, which wasn't that hard of a platinum but still have some annoying objectives you had to do for trophies, including My Blaster Runs Hot.

     

    I understand why @Unknown_v2_0 quit, it was becoming too much of a chore to keep up with all the shitty games and when you're not having fun, then what's the point? A number of indies I've done such as Shovel Knight I wouldn't mind buying on the Nintendo Switch, because it's an actual good game that is enjoyable. The Switch doesn't have any achievement system, and people for the most part who mostly play on the Switch care only for the games they want to play and have fun.

     

     

    Yep a few of the reasons I quit trophies and moved to Switch. It was just an endless cycle of games I didn't enjoy or even need to fully play to plat and then rush on to the next one. I was at the mercy of the system and not gaming on my own terms.

     

    Also Sony benefits in other ways from making the plats easier in games like Ratchet for example and all the AAAs that have come out. If the plat is easier to get and sort of just naturally happens then more people will obtain them, even really casual gamers (might actually get them into trophy hunting too),  will post their plat to social media or share their psnprofile and this will get the word out more for the games as well as encouraging people to buy their systems. Also the more trophies and plats a person has on their profile the more sunk cost fallacy they will apply to which systems they buy in the future. Like when the next gen comes then a company like Sony can say all your trophies carry over etc. and this could say people from buying another company's system. Same with which platform they decide to buy the games on.

     

    Switch has a crazy ton of the shovelware games (most of the ones that release on PS) however purchaser of games on switch would want to buy the game for the game and not just for trophies so while some shovelware might sell at least majority of purchasers are buying only the quality titles I would imagine and no region/system stacks.

     

    Does anyone know what the sales of these EZPZ games on Switch are compared to PS? I am curious

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  4. 14 hours ago, AJ_Radio said:

     

     

    These overly easy games I would compare with stuff my little nephew plays on my sisters iPad. Junk. Dumbed down. At his age I was playing Super Mario Bros 3 on the NES, which required a lot more skill and commitment to properly play it. The game my nephew is playing basically has most everything handed to them, he just sits there and collects stuff in his game. Whereas I had to struggle to figure how just how to get past the fourth and fifth worlds in Super Mario Bros 3. But I did it. So the standards have definitely gone down over time.

     

    Unfortunately I think all games are getting easier and easier.... Like I LOVED Kirby as a kid, recently played All Star Allies and stopped after 3 levels cause it  was so mind numbingly easy. Then we got these save states and rewinds added to games, check points every few rooms etc. Then all social media now is falling into what you are describing... I have noticed a lowered attention span and  concentration from dealing with stuff like that and trying to 'bounce back' I guess you could say lol. I remember those early years of MTV... yeah things very different now  I guess. Although I do think back to how our parents and grandparents saw what we watched at the time ( maybe felt very similar thinking 'what is this garbage' what will the youth of today's youth think and what will the state of things be like then..... lol)

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  5. 8 minutes ago, enaysoft said:

     

    Playing easy non effort games though, you learn or achieve next to nothing from doing that.

     

    Trophy hunting at a top level, is all about low skill, and no time limit.

    It is in comparison probably the easiest and most boring race you can ever think of, and one that lasts forever.

     

    Is it a really a proud moment to be in 1st place for several years but never actually win?

    The more easy trophies that are pumped into the system, the harder it is for people in this race to stop.

     

    Unknownv2 on the other hand, he wouldn't have bought a Nintendo Switch and be buying and playing games on that if he was still here collecting trophies.

    I wish as many people as possible and more people like him in the top of the leaderboards, they all need to wake up someday and stop this path they are on, as I genuinely believe almost none of them will be happy about it years down the line.

     

     

    Once you are up there its just a chore keeping it up really. And I would say not only is it possible to achieve nothing but it can have negative side effects (social media can have this too though and it was a part of why i stopped as well) . When others high up there retired from the leaderboard grind I actually used to think they were foolish of them  to do so. After I stopped I was actually thinking well I can see it and think they were smart to get out then. Plats are just coming faster and faster and so once you stop you will get passed faster and faster and then after a few years no one will even know your name. It was sort of cool at first to be up there but then it was negatively effecting me and it took me 3 years to quit. Very hard to quit due to all the work I put in already, feeling like it was my identity and other factors. It definitely wasn't all bad, I have a lot of good memories and have learned a lot of lessons along the way. Trophies definitely changed the way I gamed. Even in longer games that weren't purely for leaderboard climbing (although me rushing through them was a result of the leaderboards to an extent). PLaying on Switch was very weird initially as there was no trophy list 'telling' me how to play it. I was used to basically playing trophy lists you could say and it even dictated what games I would play.

     

    I can't say that quitting the leaderboards and possibly trophies is the right thing for everyone, as everyone is different and for them it may be right. I just know personally for me the negatives were out weighing the positives and hopefully others aren't experiencing what I was...

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  6. 15 hours ago, LC-Fraggers said:


    As I said before, climbing the leaderboards and gaming are two separate hobbies. 

     

    Yeah that's a way of looking at it. at a certain point the leaderboard just depends on how much 'non-gaming' you can do. How many 5 min plats you can stack , VNs you can kip through, games you can auto run etc. I think lower on the leaderboard even if you are playing just to climb you will be trying to rush through the games as fast as you can, potentially missing out on the experiences.

     

    I certainly felt my Trophy Hunting was just purely separate from 'gaming' so I started calling it on-gaming. was just like how many guides can i copy the movements from, using the vita trick to get additional stacks of games, setting up turbo controllers and just letting the system run etc. 

    15 hours ago, LC-Fraggers said:


    As I said before, climbing the leaderboards and gaming are two separate hobbies. 

     

    Yeah that's a way of looking at it. at a certain point the leaderboard just depends on how much 'non-gaming' you can do. How many 5 min plats you can stack , VNs you can kip through, games you can auto run etc. I think lower on the leaderboard even if you are playing just to climb you will be trying to rush through the games as fast as you can, potentially missing out on the experiences.

     

    I certainly felt my Trophy Hunting was just purely separate from 'gaming' so I started calling it on-gaming. was just like how many guides can i copy the movements from, using the vita trick to get additional stacks of games, setting up turbo controllers and just letting the system run etc. 

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  7. Yeah just play for yourself. Don't earn trophies to try to impress others and don't compare your profile to others is my advice. Some, especially for leaderboard stuff and even things like rare trophies, have stuff behind the scenes you don't know about. You don't know if they even earned them themselves, bought the trophies, cheesed through their games somehow etc.. Or what their circumstances are. Some profiles can be thought of as akin to photo shopped Instagram posts. 

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  8. On 10/15/2021 at 11:52 PM, enaysoft said:

     

    While playing, was there ever a time much earlier in your game playing experience when you thought to yourself, why am I doing this?
    I'm old enough to remember a time when trophies didn't exist but even I myself have stacked platinums.
    For me I might be playing a game in Japanese, sold it and then get the western released some months/years later and then play it again.

    On your list I found

     

     FoxyLand 2 • AS
    All 20 Trophies
    7th February 2020 • Platinum in 40 minutes, 59 seconds

     

    I have not played the game but I looked on youtube just now, and it looks like a pretty decent platformer. Cute and well made.

    Certainly something I would have enjoyed on my Commodore Amiga back in the day.

    However also in that Friday of 2020, you went on to complete the game again two more times in the same afternoon, and then again the next day.

    Now my stacked platinums are almost exclusively 50+ hour Warriors stacks, which I might play a year or two later.


    I am just wondering what went through your mind, as you played the same game, three times in a row. I personally would be thinking, man, what am I doing, why don't I just play this game again next month, or so.

     

    Trophy hunting is a very weird kind of hobby, it's basically a race that you joined at some point without realising it, and the race never has a finishing line, nor does it have many rules.
    There's blatant legal cheating left right and center. Everyone does it. Signing up to Playstation stores all over the world despite only living in one. Getting a family member to play a game for you, looking at a guide on the Internet to look out for missable trophies, in many cases spoiling the experience for yourself but saving yourself time.

     

    Trophies and achievements are making all of us behave weirdly, I'm not innocent either. I remember back on PS3 playing the Japanese version of Yakuza 5 all weekend, and then afterwards feeling a bit sad because I didn't pop a single trophy. Although I am not addicted, even I at times, can feel that weird phychological pull that trophies give you.

    Everybody at least in the top 2000 or so, they're chasing that leaderboard number or the satisfying noise of a trophy pop. It's a sore point to mention that around here these days, to suggest that these people have a trophy hunting addiction and that they potentially have some kind of problem.

     

    Trophies are a form of money currency. In the real world, if you can get a high paid job, or a high paid job that requires very little effort, you'd aim for those jobs right?
    Easy platinums are no different, and just in the real world, if you pump more into the system using quantitive easing, having more trophies just reduces the overall value
    Why would anyone spent 2 days playing Yakuza 5 and earning nothing, when they can spent 2 minutes getting an entire platinum. If your goal becomes trophies, you'll play just about anything to get fast and cheap.

     

    Some people play one game and then pop an easy platinum every now and again, that's how it starts though.

    I think Ratalaika gets a bad rap, sure, their games are easy and short, and cheap. Many of them are nice little games though.
    Whether or not you stopped because you reached 3000 games, or you stopped because you saw the BreakThrough coming to market and just thought, meh I'm done, I don't really know.
    Either way though, you can certainly pat yourself on the back that you didn't lower your standards and start playing shit games.

     

    Trophy hunting is a weirdly selfish challenge anyway, everyone is too busy looking at their own stats to notice anyone else. At the time of writing this I noticed that Hakoom has dropped down to 3rd, when did that happen? Hakoom is arguably the most well known Trophy hunter since he was the first to be no1. Does anyone know who is in 2nd or 4th place, does anyone care? Does anyone care? If nobody cares about Hakoom anymore then they certainly aren't going to care about your trophy list, nobody is trying to get the top of the leaderboard to be noticed right? If they are, well, they are certainly in for a big disappointment.

     

    In this neverending race, the moment you stop, you get overtaken.

     

    So in that respect nobody in the leaderboards ever wins.

     

    At least for me I just care about having fun playing and games, and getting 100% on the games I love, whether it takes me 1 day or 1 year. No it doesn't affect me, however I do want to try and help people. Drug addicts or alcoholics, their addiction is bad their for your health, so of course you'd want to help them.

     

    Trophy addicts however, it's a very new kind of problem, you just waste a lot of time and money, and technically they aren't doing any real damage to themselves, so we just accept it and instead, pointing out the issue, you're the one in the wrong. It's a moot point around here

     

    I totally support these people and their right to play and do whatever they want. I honestly worry about where this is all going though and anyone with a slight amount of common sense should know that playing games ONLY for trophies, it isn't good long term.


    It's a strange deal that both these devs and users are all in on, you won't be finding CJ The Ball on Nintendo Switch anytime soon though, of which the reasons for that are quite obvious.

     

    All your points basically 'on point' with what I am trying to do with the V2 Crew and why I started it. I could write a novel answering and replying to your post lol. I remember gaming before trophies and I am trying to get back to that currently. Enjoying games for games and not just playing trophy lists.  I am recording a series of videos detailing why I quit and lessons I think others can take away from it. In regards to the Foxyland 2... yeah I really hated paying the same games 8 times and some might be fun but the trophy lists didn't even have you finishing it so once platted I would move on sadly. Your points of leaderboard are true... once you stop you are overtaken. I question too how many even care anymore about hakoom and anyone up there really...You need to game for yourself, once you start leaderboard chasing you are trapped on a hamster wheel, spending your time and money on questionable experiences. I had tried to quit for 3 years before I succeeded. lots of lost cost fallacy, trying to stay near the top so I could send a message (turned out to be very hypocritical though), and well its what i knew. Trophies really changed the way many of us gamed. They definitely warped me gaming and even life wise. I am not saying they are inheritently bad but they can be. I agree with you that many are addicted and @AJ_Radio is right in that even things like P&Cs we just copy guides and use youtube to get through stuff ASAP to churn through games.

     

    One of the reasons I moved to Switch was to get away from trophies. I also missed a ton of games  since i was only trophy farming for so long.

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  9. 3 hours ago, AJ_Radio said:

     

     

    If people feel miserable because they're playing cheap platinum games to chase the leaderboards, then they should stop.

     

    This was a main point of my post. I personally was miserable and people shouldn't prioritize farming trophies over their educations, jobs etc. If you are miserable please stop and realize where trophies are headed in terms of getting fast plats and such. Even if you climb the leaderboard now once you stop you can quickly be overtaken in a few years most likely in what? a day at that point? Like are you just doing it to post on social media or brag about your plat count? Don't make gaming into a job you are paying to have. If it is truly fun for you then that is fine, maybe its relaxing idk. I just want to spread some awareness incase people aren't realizing twhat they are doing with their money and time. Game on your own terms.

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  10. 15 hours ago, DaveMcDamage said:

     

    But in terms of easy plats. It all depends on the game itself. If its one of these indie things which is purely to sell a game due to having an easy plat, then I see that as being no different to a microtransaction being abused like so many companies do. But if its a AAA game which has had a lot of effort put into the game but an easy platinum to obtain then thats fine. The game was the point you bought it, not the trophy list. 

     

    End of the day though everyone is gonna have an opinion on this and its one of them where none of us are really wrong as its about what we want. Its all down to the devs/publishers on what kind of trophy list they want to make, be it for hardcore challenge or just used as a marketing too to sell the game. 

     

    Looking at the fast plats as a microtransaction is an interesting way to think about them... I like that analogy 

     

    Even the AAA games use trophies somewhat as a marketing tool I think.  Since posting plats on twitter etc. so easier they make it the more will post.

     

    I understand people can do what they want I am just trying to make others aware of this trend and where things are going and don't do beyond their means or prioritize this over their lives if they can't afford it or are doing it for other reasons like to compare to others etc. as its just gonna get easier and easier....

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  11. 2 minutes ago, CelestialRequiem said:

     

    Part of it is I'm old, so I know what gaming was like before all of this. Trophy hunting can be fun, but again, engage with the software that actually interests you. 

     

    Yeah hard for us older crowd to understand I think too how newer players feel. We know what it was like but this state is all they know...

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  12. 2 hours ago, AJ_Radio said:

     

    Your first few trophies and platinums will always be significant. I'm at the point now where trophies sort of give me a 'meh' feeling. Unless they're something notable, like Max Payne 3, getting that platinum gave me a rush I haven't felt in several months. Perhaps I'm focusing on the wrong games, I need to challenge myself more.

     

    I no longer get much satisfaction from EZ games. The Bunker is one of those rare exceptions, enjoyed the story and the FMV of the game. I don't feel much if everyone else gets what I got. I try to some extent, be one of the select few who tries to challenge himself, I just don't overdo it.

     

     

    The standards got lower over time. I find it amusing that Hannah Montana is now considered a medium difficulty level game, because it's old and was released during the early days of trophy hunting.

     

    We went from Terminator Salvation to ZJ the Ball. Times have changed, and the trophy hunting community has changed over the years as well.

     

     

    I'm sure everyone at those high positions get peer pressure. But I don't understand why there are people at my ranking playing all those EZ titles. The only reason I would play all those games is to chase the leaderboards, otherwise I wouldn't bother.

     

    Yeah I am trying to make sure people are at least having fun with their gaming and aren't playing games or doing unhealthy habits just cause someone at top of leaderboard is doing it or cause others are ... they should consider if they are truly having fun  or its due to peer pressure etc. partly why I creating the V2 crew concept.

     

    Even the face of PS games has changed since the early years of trophies and trophies in many of the newer AAA games are easier. Have a vid recorded that i'll release soon showing the growth over time with some data and evidence to back it up and projections for the future....things gonna get even scarier ....

     

    Got to the point nothing was giving me much satisfaction finishing it , even great games.... they just turned into a rushed chore so I could move on to the next one.. rushed all dialog, tried to get through via glitches or fastest builds etc. completely warped gaming for me to the point i was just playing trophy lists and avoided many games...Yeah new community got in when there were already all these 10 min plats so that is all they know...wonder how many new people actually think the top leaders have high plat counts coming in seeing how easy it is to get a plat... not like years ago when 12 hours was fast....

     

    Bunker is medium diff now i think lol

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  13. 10 hours ago, pogo_loco said:

     

     I wondered what prompts a leaderboard competitor to abandon chasing easy plats, and [EDIT] how much peer pressure contributed to the decision.

     

     

    There are actually both sides to it. You have a group that does not like those fast plats but when you are high up you are in a peer group that encourages you to keep going.... whether they are secretly miserable or not who knows, maybe they are still having fun with it

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  14. 12 hours ago, pogo_loco said:

     

    Thank you for sharing your story and uniquely qualified perspective.  May I ask what prompted your decision to change?

     

    Many posts in these threads advise gamers to stop hording easy plats, and I wonder if they are effective or ignored.  Seems that a person only corrects an unhealthy lifestyle due to a traumatic moment of self-awareness, not because a stranger says "You should stop drinking so much/overspending your budget/cheating on your spouse/stacking EZPZ games."

     

    Rewind five years ago, before you decided to quit -- how would you have responded if people admonished you for region/platform-stacking Steins;Gate?

     

     

    I had actually started posting vids on my YT channel that may shed more light on why I quit (was debating on a series for that as well as some 'fun' looks at the state of trophies now and in the past. Its not all going to be trophyy content but trophy and achievement systems in general and more analytics on gaming and lessons I learned... Some might find it interesting but PLEASE don't bring drama posts.... Intent is to be helpful, insightful, get people to think... some are just for fun too. Like this latest one 

     

     

    Actually final years I was trying to tell people not to play those games but played them myself (was thinking then I could be noticed more and get word out buuuuut was just hypocritical. Many Reasons though including politics, feeling like all my efforts were continually getting devalued, competing with teams, OCD and compulsion, not wanting to promote it and many more. Also I was not having fun. Was a chore I was spending time and money on. Oh and it was making me super negative and I hated that feeling .... And at this point I sort of just want to make something positive and helpful.

    2 hours ago, AJ_Radio said:

    I can sort of see where Unknown is coming from. Five years ago the easiest platinums were those Japanese visual novels for the PS Vita that you had to physically import from Japan, which was very costly and only people who had lots of money could afford them.

     

    The trophy hunting community is noticeably different now than it was five years ago. I can understand people at the top stacking easy games, but I don't understand why people at my world ranking are doing it.

     

     

    Yeah everything is soooo different now. Guides, plat times, just everything really. I sort of feel that way too... like unless you are like #1-2 no one is going to see your profiles (or very few) you have to game for yourself and not compare to others. Unfortunately I think many see those at the top and do it cause they are...but I understand to a point as I used to LOVE trophies and that is probably the feeling newer players still have in getting fast plats. But my favorite trophy memories were not doing the EZ ones but games prior to me skipping VNs and the bigger JRPGs and such

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  15. 13 hours ago, Lava_Yuki said:

    I know a lot of people do that with VNs and otome games. When I saw otome games like shinobi koi utsutsu only taking 4 hours to plat on your profile, I figured you must have skipped through as that game took me 20 hours to plat reading everything and only skipping parts I already read.  I play a lot of Japanese otome games and VNs but I read everything as I find them very interesting, however it takes up a more time, all the ones I've played were at least 20-30 hours minimum :) 

    Actually reading them should be the way to play them (at least fist playthrough). Glad you enjoy them :)

    Skipping through is really just non gaming lol. you are buying the game just for the trophies at that point......

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  16. On 10/3/2020 at 4:13 PM, Lava_Yuki said:

    Looking at your profile, you have tons of trophies! That sound like a great idea, as it's easy to fall into a trophy hunting rut. 

     

    I mostly game for fun and get trophies if I can, but if it's too difficult or time consuming for certain trophies I don't bother. I;d much rather enjoy playing games, the story and the characters than blitz through tons of boring or easy games just for trophies. I'd say I'm a moderate trophy hunter, where anything over 130 hours or 8/10 difficulty or more, I don't bother. But it would not stop me from playing a particular game, like I enjoyed the KH games but never was able to platinum them except KH3. So I know I will never have 100% completion percentage, as it keeps going down whenever I pick a game like KH or Disgaea where the plats are so challenging and long. 

    yeah having fun is way more important then stressing over trophies. Sounds like you are enojying yourself so that's awesome! For me unfortunately i have been focused on trophies and getting them as fast as possible that its causing me to rush through even good games and not really enjoy the experience like i should be....skip all dialogue, go direct to objectives etc.... it's like a bad habit at this point :(

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  17. 2 hours ago, ninjamonkee9900 said:

    HI Unknown!  I appreciate all of this so much and agree with the sentiment that you have to do what is fun for you (and you might need to find that again). 

     Best of luck as you find your joy in gaming again and know that I am in your corner!

     

    Thanks!

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  18. 19 minutes ago, PalaceOfLove706 said:

    Dude, you’re level 76 with a 98.99% completion rate. You don’t care about leaderboards or goals? Sounds like a perfectionist in disguise

    If you look at his list though he has very few short trashy plats.... its games that have decent lists/fun games

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  19. 57 minutes ago, BeautifulTorment said:

    I read about this sort of thing quite a bit on these forums.. something I've never grappled with myself.

     

    I enjoy the games I play for the most part and finish them to completion best I can. I don't particularly worry about trophy count or goals and the like.

     

    I think the common denominator in the cases of people who feel the way you do... is the "trashware" and a lust for ranking up in the leaderboards fast. I think the "sense of pride and accomplishment" (lmao @EA) comes squarely from games that take at least a bit of effort.

     

    Anyway, I hope you can rediscover your passion for gaming.

     

    Thanks. Yeah one of the problems is having spent soooo much to get on the top of the boards and then it just feels so invalidated now.... like leaderboard rank is entirely dependant on trashy plats and then most of the top not being solo is another issue that goes through my mind..... and then there is maintaining the 100% so if I start something i must finish it, worry about glitched trophies, sometimes replay multiple times since something glitched..... 

     

    yeah i'll figure things out just gonna take time and reflection i think

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  20. yeah i just get this feeling every time I start some longer game too .... like I have to rush .... its such weird effect trophy spamming has on you after many years.... like gaming ain't the same... I have to experiment around i guess... but I am going to keep on with my experiment and see what happens at the end of it...if i don't crack lol

     

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