Disco Elysium: Final Cut

[Ashbo]

Proper looking forward to this one.

 

Looks really good. Fingers crossed it ends up being an absolute gem of a game.

[Jettaelas]

4 hours ago, Alderriz said:

edit: would be cool to hear the opinions of people who already played this game on PC here.

 

I played it on PC around when it came out and loved it, I do plan on getting this again on PS5. Looking forward to see how they've integrated the controller instead of mouse & keyboard, and the new additions in this version of the game.

[DoctorDrPepper]

I heard it was a fun detective game so that’s nice.

 

[Conor]

Friends of mine ranted and raved about this game back when it came out. Can't wait to finally see what all the fuss was about for myself.

Edited March 18, 2021 by Stan Lee

[Czajnikus]

8 hours ago, Alderriz said:

What is this thread turning into lol. I can almost see the "but it wasn't true communism" memes coming.

 

Why are people focusing on the communist influence so much anyway? As far as I know, communism is like one of the paths you can take in some in-game conversations. Just google something like "Disco Elysium politics" and you'll find out that "Disco Elysium has a robust alignment system, tracking your cop's alignment across four ideologies of the world: Communism, fascism, moralism and ultraliberalism."

 

So you can be anywhere on the political compass and enjoy the depth of the dialogue in the game. In fact, many people I follow on Twitter praised this game, and not a single one of them shares communist ideas. Haven't heard any of them say that the developers used this game to push one ideology. 

 

I guess I'll understand if somebody wants to skip the game because they're allergic to communism to the point where they can't stand it even being mentioned. Like, if your grandparents died in a gulag camps or something. Otherwise, give this game a chance. It's very rare that I see a smaller game like this be praised this much.

 

edit: would be cool to hear the opinions of people who already played this game on PC here.

It's about this thing, not ingame factions.
 

 

[Slava]

4 hours ago, Czajnikus said:

It's about this thing, not ingame factions.
 

 

 

Yeah, I saw this and the Stalin portrait too. I'm still not sure how serious they are about this.

 

But if they were legit communists, and if they aren't pushing the ideology in the game, then it's all about every potential consumer deciding if they are willing to "separate art from the artist" and support the people behind the project or not. Or in other words, vote with their wallet. 

 

(BTW, I'm not a fan of communism and our current communist parties, to say the least.)

Edited March 19, 2021 by Alderriz

[Cronopio--]

Yeah, I don't think I can support this, sadly ☹️

[Czajnikus]

1 hour ago, Alderriz said:

 

Yeah, I saw this and the Stalin portrait too. I'm still not sure how serious they are about this.

 

But if they were legit communists, and if they aren't pushing the ideology in the game, then it's all about every potential consumer deciding if they are willing to "separate art from the artist" and support the people behind the project or not. Or in other words, vote with their wallet. 

 

(BTW, I'm not a fan of communism and our current communist parties, to say the least.)

Same here, a bit to bussy to do a big background check and like I said to my friend - I hope it's only a gag tied to the game (I watched only ~20min of gameplay, liked it, didn't want to spoil any more). If not and it's another company that wants to bring politics into the industry I won't pay a penny for it. For me gaming (and books) was always about running away from everyday problems and other shit, don't want to have political wars here too, got enought of them in real life. Doesn't matter if the ideology is the one I hate or love, the story can be about anything as long as the authors won't try to raise it to another level and convince us to their belives outside - specially when spreading their ideology should be punished by prison in any normal country. I wouldn't be suprised if they were from west europe, they didn't live under the red party, but former Eastern Bloc nation giving a prise to communists? That is so disgusting I still can't get over it. I could write a book about how much my family suffered and how much stuff that happend decades ago still affect me or my friends (we are ~30 years old, so we were born at the time "comunism left Poland").

[Beyondthegrave07]

FYI, I took down quite a few posts that were solely related to politics that had nothing to do with the game and was off-topic. Nothing bad was said, but we were starting to get off topic and nothing was being discussed related to the OP. Probably better this way so we don't start having a left vs right argument in a thread about Disco Elysium. If you want to continue the discussion, feel free to in a PM or maybe create a thread about politics in gaming in general. I think there is a time and place to discuss these things but not here.

Edited March 19, 2021 by Beyondthegrave07

[StealthID]

Banned in Australia.

 

Was buying it on my US account anyway

[StraightVege]

I heard about that nonsense. Seems like it was because the game "heavily incorporates drugs/alcohol as a part of its core gameplay mechanic." This guy put it well:

 

 

[Conker]

Our fucking classification board sucks, this being banned... Can we actually get gamers or people who have some fucking idea

[G4Knight]

>Literally Stalin hanging up on the wall.

 

>Game looks siiiiick.

Okay.

[DrBloodmoney]

2 hours ago, ScarecrowsFate said:

I heard about that nonsense. Seems like it was because the game "heavily incorporates drugs/alcohol as a part of its core gameplay mechanic." This guy put it well:

 

 

I’m pretty sure Australia heavily incorporate drugs/alcohol as a part of its core gameplay mechanic.

[DrBloodmoney]

 

 

 

On 19/03/2021 at 0:27 AM, Cronopio-- said:

Yeah, I don't think I can support this, sadly

 

I think this response is totally acceptable, and I wouldn’t try to force you or anyone else to try a game you are uncomfortable supporting due to the politics of the creators.

 

You have absolutely the right attitude- You aren’t calling for the game to be banned, or the creators tarred and feathered or publically shamed or cancelled - you are simply electing not to financially support them.

 

I personally was not comfortable buying or playing Shadow Complex, or Kingdom Come: Deliverance due to the right wing politics of the creators of those games - despite hearing some good things about the games themselves.

I avoided Undertale due to the anti-trophy hunter comments made by its creator, and Fez due to a dislike of it’s creator and his attitude and public comments, and from what I hear, both those games are great.

 

It would be rather hypocritical for me to get on a soapbox about how good Disco Elysium looks and try to coax you or anyone else put off by the Marxist politics of its creator into playing it anyway.

 

I just want to commend you on your attitude about the whole thing though.

?

 

In an age of outrage, you are simply doing the one thing that matters - voting with your wallet - and not all the nonsense that sometimes accompanies it.

No phoney outrage, no huffing and puffing on social media and no denigrating people who do wish to play it.
Just a firm “No”, and that’s it.

???

 

 

Edited March 20, 2021 by DrBloodmoney

[Doomed_Gary]

I'll vote for the communist game with my wallet. Please, move up the release date... Seriously, I want to play this sooner rather than later.

[Crispy_Oglop]

I played it twice fully on PC and I thought it was a fantastic game and an arguable masterpiece of narrative storytelling. These playthroughs were before I knew about the communist references made by the devs. Whether they are just making an elaborate troll, attempt at being controversial to artificially generate attention or an actual political statement, the optics are weird.

 

On a personal level - I generally don't really care what religious or political leanings a developer has unless they are actively out harming others with their own hands or trying to push an agenda with their material. I loved Disco Elysium when I played it before I knew about some of the developers political leanings, do I still love Disco Elysium after knowing about them? Yes.

Edited March 20, 2021 by Crispy_Oglop

[Darling Baphomet]

2 hours ago, DrBloodmoney said:

I personally was not comfortable buying or playing Shadow Complex, or Kingdom Come: Deliverance due to the right wing politics of the creators of those games - despite hearing some good things about the games themselves.

 

Huh, good to know. I'll definitely avoid Kingdom Come: Deliverance; it was on my "maybe someday" list.

 

2 hours ago, DrBloodmoney said:

In an age of outrage, you are simply doing the one thing that matters - voting with your wallet - and not all the nonsense that sometimes accompanies it.

No phoney outrage, no huffing and puffing on social media and no denigrating people who do wish to play it.
Just a firm “No”, and that’s it.

 

I think in an age of celebrities, social media, and internet fame, it's fair to say that social capital is important. Making a show of withholding, or deliberately mobilizing social capital against something, can in that regard be considered a form of 'voting with one's wallet' - voting with one's clout, one's attention, which companies spend millions on manipulating. Fame, public image, etc all come down to capitalizing on public opinion, and when you've built a livelihood on capitalizing on public opinion... well, it's a bit, shall we say, detached from reality to assume you're entitled to the public's good will forever, regardless of how deliberately that good will is rescinded.

 

1 hour ago, nyarLOLhotep said:

I'll vote for the communist game with my wallet. Please, move up the release date... Seriously, I want to play this sooner rather than later.

 

Times like these I really regret how clogged up my backlog is... that being said, I don't think I can justify paying 40$ for the game at launch - I think waiting until it hits 25$ is a reasonable course of action.

Edited March 20, 2021 by Darling Baphomet

[DoctorDrPepper]

I knew the developers had communistic viewpoints but I had heard the game was good enough to not care.

 

The fact they have a picture of Stalin though really makes me think twice now. As a Jew I have a personal problem with people who think it’s funny to idolize a man whose policies killed as many and if not more Jews via genocide just because their governmental political ideals are closer than the other guys, if you know what I mean.

[ShadowReplicant]

2 hours ago, Darling Baphomet said:

Huh, good to know. I'll definitely avoid Kingdom Come: Deliverance; it was on my "maybe someday" list.

 

You should definitely do a bit more research before you make a decision like that, don't just believe what one random person says on the internet.

[DrBloodmoney]

1 hour ago, ShadowReplicant said:

 

You should definitely do a bit more research before you make a decision like that, don't just believe what one random person says on the internet.

absolutely right ?

 

Those kind of decisions are personal, and nuanced from person to person.

 

My point was only illustrating my own point of view, and was specifically saying that each person has to decide for themselves where their particular lines are in cases like these.

[Darling Baphomet]

9 hours ago, DoctorDrPepper said:

I knew the developers had communistic viewpoints but I had heard the game was good enough to not care.

 

The fact they have a picture of Stalin though really makes me think twice now. As a Jew I have a personal problem with people who think it’s funny to idolize a man whose policies killed as many and if not more Jews via genocide just because their governmental political ideals are closer than the other guys, if you know what I mean.

 

I'd hope they merely have it for more surface level reasons, e.g. based on modern associations, since Stalin is not as immediately associated with that kind of bigotry as [a certain other person] is, but yes, it is definitely out of taste. Still, there's not many games made by people with leftist sympathies, so even if they're dreadfully ignorant, I'm still inclined to give them the benefit of the doubt merely because there's not many options on the table.

 

6 hours ago, DrBloodmoney said:

absolutely right 

 

Those kind of decisions are personal, and nuanced from person to person.

 

My point was only illustrating my own point of view, and was specifically saying that each person has to decide for themselves where their particular lines are in cases like these.

 

Well, from what I've gathered you're a lot more moderate than I am, and as such if something's too right wing for you it's almost certainly such for me; that being said I'd also read a lot of complaints about the game already (gameplay wise) so that comment was enough to push me over the edge.

[StraightVege]

So, I was actually curious enough regarding the portrait to have a cursory look around the Internet the other day—according to some Reddit and Twitter threads on the game, the developers keep the picture around as a joke (leftist humor can be quite edgy), and are probably libertarian Marxists or left communists. They're Estonians, who witnessed the fall of the Soviet Union, which obviously colored their opinions heavily. All in all, this likely explains why communism isn't presented uncritically in the game.

 

Not tankies, yay. I feel even better about buying this now; might even be one of the exceedingly rare games I purchase at full price. We'll see.

 

Here's a couple of the most interesting threads I came across:

 

(Some spoilers) https://www.reddit.com/r/DiscoElysium/comments/ehx04o/is_disco_elysium_really_supposed_to_be_a_leftwing/

 

https://twitter.com/icyjiubnext/status/1372945356753928198

[Darling Baphomet]

2 hours ago, ScarecrowsFate said:

So, I was actually curious enough regarding the portrait to have a cursory look around the Internet the other day—according to some Reddit and Twitter threads on the game, the developers keep the picture around as a joke (leftist humor can be quite edgy), and are probably libertarian Marxists or left communists. They're Estonians, who witnessed the fall of the Soviet Union, which obviously colored their opinions heavily. All in all, this likely explains why communism isn't presented uncritically in the game.

 

Nice research! I still find the choice a bit strange - why not go with someone less jarringly awful, but still having the leftist connotations, e.g. Marx? - but I suppose it's understandable given their affiliations. The company being a co-op is a nice touch, too. Definitely putting this game on my wishlist. There's another leftist game, albeit outright communist, called Tonight We Riot that's produced by a worker owned co-op and I wish it'd come to PS4.

 

I do find people who have that sort of perspective interesting - my egg donor grew up in the USSR and had a lot of insight into it and few bad things to say; I wish I'd gotten more of that kind of perspective, since you can't beat someone actually having lived experience.

Edited March 21, 2021 by Darling Baphomet

[Slava]

1 hour ago, Darling Baphomet said:

I still find the choice a bit strange - why not go with someone less jarringly awful, but still having the leftist connotations, e.g. Marx?

 

USSR did this "cult of personality" thing for a long time where there were portraits of Stalin and/or Lenin everywhere: schools, factories, government buildings, etc. Maybe it has something to do with that. Maybe the Disco Elysium devs recreated that atmosphere to inspire them during the development. To set the mood. As for Marx, I don't think he was idolized to that extent. 

 

Maybe some of that tradition still remains in Russia, because I remember that in my school days we used to have photos of our current leaders (Putin, then Medvedev) in classrooms. Not sure if other countries do the same ?.