Suggestion - Auto-pop PS5 trophies should be removed from 'Fastest' leaderboards

[Helyx]

Imagine being upset because someone did a game twice and the completion time for one game was faster than yours.

[DaivRules]

Just now, ThatMuttGuy said:

 

Point to me where he's wrong?

 

Generalization:

Quote

 those who are really into their trophies won't be happy with this suggestion, as you strive off easy and quick trophies

Meaning all people who are "really into their trophies" strive off easy and quick trophies. Wrong.

 

 

Generalization:

Quote

 those who are actually proud of their trophy achievements, and spent the time playing the game to obtain them legitimately, must surely be a bit annoyed with this current trend of the leaderboards and stats being screwed up by auto-unlocked trophies

Claims: 1. Auto-popping isn't legitimate and 2. Only "actually proud" members don't auto-pop and 3. Auto-popping "screw up" stats. Again all wrong.

 

[Ac3dUd3-]

First 50 achievers is the only important one to me, the rest who cares lol

[ThatMuttGuy]

Many people on this site do have an actual unhealthy addiction to getting trophies/platinums which is why you see the rise of rat games/stacking/autopopping.

 

Autopop if you want, but I fail to see how you should still be eligible for the fastest times as opposed to someone that did it all from scratch. I understand it's still a legit way of earning trophies according to Sony, but I do think the leaderboards (most specifically, the fastest times) should reflect actual times and not 1 second for the top 50. 

[DrBloodmoney]

37 minutes ago, DenDigger said:

Unfortunately, the quickest method of obtaining X game's trophies, IS to cloud save transfer, so.. what you really want is a way to filter out the specific (fastest) ways people play their games, so you can look at how others simply played X game at their own leisure.. ?

Or I mean, you could just got to the next page, the button is surely there for a reason right?

I mean, yes, in a sense...

 

The fastest way to get to the end of a marathon would be in a Ferrari... I still think the fastest racer on foot would be a bit pissed if the driver got the gold medal though...

 

 

[audiopile]

If i cared about where i ranked among legit times I would simply do the math. Subtract the quick ones and then rank yourself.  
 

If that isn’t good enough for you then you aren’t looking at that stat for you, but for others to see you, which isnt a good reason. 

[willmill97]

Couldn't agree more with the OP.

[DaivRules]

If the proposition is to not allow auto-pop times on the Fastest leaderboard, but some games allow auto-pop, then the only real solution is to come up with some arbitrary fastest time for each game and just post that time as the fastest time without posting any achievers, because there is no way to police who used/abused auto-pop to achieve that time and who legitimately played it.

 

There is no efficient way to police who did and didn't auto-pop to achieve a minimum specific time once it's allowed in a game. Even eliminating people who have more than one trophy pop together only eliminates a percentage of people who could have used auto-pop and if people wanted to, they could always manipulate auto-pop to show whatever times they need to for the fastest "legitimate" (aka approved) non-auto-popped time.

[Mercenary09]

43 minutes ago, Helyx said:

Imagine being upset because someone did a game twice and the completion time for one game was faster than yours.

This guy gets upset over stupid stuff a lot. It's not surprising. Auto pop has been a thing for a long time and it only lasts so far into the generation. Really not worth complaining about

[starcrunch061]

51 minutes ago, ThatMuttGuy said:

 

Point to me where he's wrong?

 

Well, as someone who has autopopped trophies (Sound Shapes, e.g.), and stacked others, I would be delighted if they removed autopop times somehow. 

 

Autopopping is perfectly fine, but having every person on a leaderboard with a plat time of eleven seconds completely ruins the point of the leaderboard. Those aren't mutually exclusive opinions, and it doesn't point to some, say, unhealthy addiction one way or the other. I mention this in hopes that I can stop any potential soapbox ascension...

 

40 minutes ago, ThatMuttGuy said:

Many people on this site do have an actual unhealthy addiction to getting trophies/platinums which is why you see the rise of rat games/stacking/autopopping.

 

...ah, too late.

[Bos10George]

Just get rid of it. Fastest achiever, first achiever, but leave latest achiever so I can see who is still playing.

 

First means nothing as influencers, devs, and such get codes a month in advance. With autopop, hackers and other garbage the fastest means nothing as well. Just rely on speed running sites for that info as it's more honest.

[Japanime_Gamer]

Removing legitimately earned trophies on a website that is largely built around people earning those trophies would make no sense whatsoever.

 

It really would be like cutting off your nose to spite your face.

[DrBloodmoney]

24 minutes ago, DenDigger said:

In this analogy, the Ferrari would be provided to every contestant, would you not be intentionally handicapping yourself by NOT taking the Ferrari to the finish line?

So you would want a separate rewards/acknowledgement system that separates the runners from the Ferrari's, but what's stopping one of the contestants from just doing burnouts for the entire duration - wasting time - then going over the finish line, obviously in this analogy we know they did use the Ferrari, but going back to the leardboard suggestion, we don't know who has used save auto popping, so im going to treat the analogy as if we don't know who used a Ferrari.

if you still don't get the message, then clearly you can't be reasoned with, since you aren't even open to rational thinking towards the subject, there is no way to detect who has used save auto popping beyond the obvious quick completion times, unless you want to manually sift through everyones profiles and blacklist them from the leaderboard yourself?  are you volunteering?

I don’t think you get my particular point - my point was that the people using the Ferrari’s aren’t doing it to win the race - they don’t care whether their times are on the fastest leaderboards, they just want the trophies for the overall leaderboards - which is totally cool.
Auto-popping is a legit way of getting them - it’s built into the system by Sony.

 

I already made the point earlier that l think that the real issue with not including autopopped times on the fastest boards wouldn’t be that people would abuse it - I don’t think many would intentionally - it’s that it would be too difficult to impliment from game to game, to avoid different situations of accidentally ‘abusing’ it.

 

So, exactly what you’re saying - it would be manual, and therefore far too labour intensive.

Edited March 20, 2021 by DrBloodmoney

[B1rvine]

On 3/19/2021 at 5:27 AM, turniplord said:

So, what I'm suggesting is, can't the site be updated where games that auto-unlock can be flagged so that those who unlock all, or a bunch of trophies within a few minutes are not included in any of the leaderboards? I'm not saying flag the gamer or ban them, just don't include their 100% time or their position in the first 50 people to unlock the platinum.

 

I'm in FULL support of only counting only the first stack of a game for purposes of the leaderboard.

 

While there's going to be a few games where the stacks are slightly different, this is manageable in a number of ways. Manually setting up which stacks might count twice (e.g for devs/publishers that may try to get around this system), setting it up on a trophy basis instead of a game basis (e.g. Darksiders II having one different trophy in the PS4 list), and/or adjusting DLC to count on its own (e.g. Uncharted's remasters that have different DLC lists from the original.)

 

Implementing this would also, as a side effect, remove the autopop fastest achievers.

 

On 3/19/2021 at 6:30 AM, NamoPh said:

It would be unrealistic to want to differentiate the standard leaderboard from the way the PSN level is calculated.

 

Actually, it wouldn't. Two of the four major trophy sites use their own custom formula as the "main" leaderboard. The third has multiple leaderboard types. This site can easily make a "PSNP score" and display Sony's point values as a reference at the same time. 

 

52 minutes ago, DrBloodmoney said:

So, exactly what you’re saying - it would be manual, and therefore far too labour intensive.

 

It could be automated based off of series data somehow, which is largely completed.

 

Edited March 20, 2021 by B1rvine

[xIRockyRock]

If they would remove region stacks, I would be totally fine with the trophy system and all these easy platinum available nowadays. 
 

If I create a German account, there should be only German or in this case EU trophy lists be allowed for my account.

Edited March 20, 2021 by xIRockyRock

[NamoPh]

2 hours ago, B1rvine said:

Actually, it wouldn't. Two of the four major trophy sites use their own custom formula as the "main" leaderboard. The third has multiple leaderboard types. This site can easily make a "PSNP score" and display Sony's point values as a reference at the same time.

 

No no, I didn't mean technically unrealistic, I'm aware that it can happen, I just meant that by this point we've accepted that it almost certainly won't. I was assuming that changing the logic of the site's primary leaderboard would be one of the last changes that would ever happen.

 

I know the mod team wishes for new features as much as the rest of us, but it is what it is.

[turniplord]

On 19/03/2021 at 2:59 PM, Mercenary09 said:

This guy gets upset over stupid stuff a lot. It's not surprising. Auto pop has been a thing for a long time and it only lasts so far into the generation. Really not worth complaining about

I would say that I'd love you to back up that silly claim, but I honestly don't care tbh.

 

For your information though, I wasn't 'upset', I simply pointed out an observation I had when looking at recent PS5 upgrade forums and trophy stats.

 

That's not being 'upset', it's seeing if others think the same and if there's anything that could be done about it to make the leaderboards valid and reliable again. 

[PS_Bowser]

10 hours ago, turniplord said:

I would say that I'd love you to back up that silly claim, but I honestly don't care tbh.

 

For your information though, I wasn't 'upset', I simply pointed out an observation I had when looking at recent PS5 upgrade forums and trophy stats.

 

That's not being 'upset', it's seeing if others think the same and if there's anything that could be done about it to make the leaderboards valid and reliable again. 

fastest and first achievers leaderboards are useless...matter as well remove all people who get the game weeks before release too with that logic.

[PS_Bowser]

On 3/19/2021 at 10:22 AM, Ac3dUd3- said:

First 50 achievers is the only important one to me, the rest who cares lol

that's pointless when people get the game weeks before release...

[Mercenary09]

11 hours ago, turniplord said:

I would say that I'd love you to back up that silly claim, but I honestly don't care tbh.

 

For your information though, I wasn't 'upset', I simply pointed out an observation I had when looking at recent PS5 upgrade forums and trophy stats.

 

That's not being 'upset', it's seeing if others think the same and if there's anything that could be done about it to make the leaderboards valid and reliable again. 

Cool let's remove people from the leaderboards who get games early as well then. But since you're one of those people I'm sure you'll have a problem with that. You like to brag about being the first about getting a Platinum when you got access to a game before most people.

[PS_Bowser]

10 minutes ago, Mercenary09 said:

Cool let's remove people from the leaderboards who get games early as well then. But since you're one of those people I'm sure you'll have a problem with that. You like to brag about being the first about getting a Platinum when you got access to a game before most people.

thats what I'm saying the whole thing is stupid lol people want to change the leaderboard so it benefits just them...the people who autopop earned that because they already played legit for another stack...I find it funny people think its unfair yet they can do it but don't want to put in the work so they create threads like these

[Startyde]

If you've been miracled with a PS5, lo, thou shall be blessed the easy free upgrade sacred auto pops. It has been written. 

 

Literally zero problem with this. If you care about trophies, this is a great bonus to getting a new PS5. If you don't care about trophies, stop caring. 

 

This free upgrade system has actually encouraged me to buy games I normally wouldn't. Take Avengers. I'd never ay $60. But it was on sale for $40, and with a free PS5 version, it averages to $20 a game with double plats. That's more my style. TLDR: Embrace the future. 

Edited March 21, 2021 by Startyde

[turniplord]

1 hour ago, Mercenary09 said:

Cool let's remove people from the leaderboards who get games early as well then. But since you're one of those people I'm sure you'll have a problem with that. You like to brag about being the first about getting a Platinum when you got access to a game before most people.

 

Yeah, because I brag about it all the time... I mention it when talking about how difficult trophies are, if other people are trying to guess how hard a game is without actually playing the game yet (which is silly, as they judge difficulty off the trophies alone)

 

But, I wouldn't say that's bragging. But sure, compare me spending 100+ hours playing a game with no online guides, help, or walkthroughs, to importing a save and unlocking every trophy within seconds.

 

Maybe we could flag that we got the game early, so people could pick to omit our stats from the leaderboards, as a choice? But, I still feel auto-unlocked should be instantly not allowed because - in terms of leaderboards - it kinda defeats the purpose. It's like submitting a speedrun which you completed with glitches as a time for a 100% no-glitch run. 

[Infected Elite]

There is never going to be a perfect leader board or firsts anywhere. It is what it is.

[BlackTorito]

What is the point on caring about stats that rely on who “sleeps less” or “have more free-time”.

 

I could plat a game with 20 hours less of gameplay and still be slower because someone stuck playing all day/all night. 

Still, I can see the appealing on the first achiever, but I wouldn’t care much with a game its already been platted on PS4 a long time ago. That stat is only appealing when nobody has a clue about some trophies when new games launches, even then, there is people getting their press copies weeks ahead and full strat books so... it’s not common to see that kind of game.