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Amazing Game, Crappy Trophy List


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I have heard there is some kind of mandate a few years ago with sony exclusive games where they are all r all going to have easy trophy lists. Every big exclusive they have these days are more casual for trophies which is funny to me because the majority of ppl dont care about trophies at all. Horizon zero dawn/spiderman and miles morales/god of war, days gone etc..all higher plat %'s. It wasnt surprising to me that R&C was easy as its probably the easiest of all the games I mentioned there but my god..it seems like they want this game to almost be a guaranteed platinum lol

 

Imagine if they had a difficulty trophy for God of War..it goes from 4.8% to maybe .5-1.2% 

 

Imagine if Horizon had the NG+ difficulty trophy on the base game list..plat goes from 5.3% to 1% for sure

 

I like trophies when there is a sense of accomplishment and i'm sure R&C is amazing(i'll start it here in the next few days) but from what I'm hearing from friends, there is literally none of that..you just play and have fun with the game which is great but there should be some kind of challenge if ppl want that but it's w/e, at least it's a good experience :)

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On 6/16/2021 at 0:06 PM, NathanielJohn said:

The difference with Rift Apart's trophy list isn't that it's too easy, but that it simply doesn't cover a ton of stuff that's in the game:

  • You only need to find 5 of the 25 gold bolts.
  • You don't need to buy a single one of the 20 Omega weapons.
  • You don't need to upgrade a single weapon to level 10.
  • You only need to upgrade 1 of the 20 weapons to level 5.
  • You only need to buy all raritanium upgrades for 1 of the 20 weapons.
  • You don't need to complete challenge mode.
  • You only need to collect 3 of the 12 Lorbs.
  • You only need to collect 3 of the 24 armor pieces.
  • You don't need to find or complete all of the pocket dimensions.

100% agree. In stark contrast, I felt that Uncharted 4's trophy list set a high, sufficient bar for what striving for a Platinum trophy should be like. You really had to do everything and then some, really getting the most out of the game. Platinums that make me do that are the ones I remember and treasure the most. As others have said, Rift Apart's platinum feels like a participation trophy.

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I agree that a trophy list should ask you to experience most of a game's content and also that this R&C could easily require a higher general game completion for the plat, BUT a few things bother me every time a thread like this pops up...

 

Most games difficulty settings suck. Hard mode often is basically the enemies having x more health and dealing x more damage. It's very rare to see any noticeable gameplay changes, so in these cases I honestly couldn't care less about the lack of a difficulty specific trophy, I'll actually be glad to play on a lower setting when I don't care and the platinum doesn't require it.

 

(most) Collectibles suck. I'd have a hard time trying to think of a game where collectibles actually added something besides pointless extra hours wandering around and sometimes having to strictly follow a guide so I don't end up playing the game multiple times because I didn't find magazine no.102 that a dude decided to put in some random corner. Even when collectibles add a few extra lore info, It's still a pain for me to clean ALL of them in most cases.

 

With that said, it should not be all-or-nothing. I think it's much better when a list requires collectibles but at least gives you some kind of resource (tracking and most importantly imo, giving you some room to miss a few of them. Control's AWE DLC is a good example, requiring 80% of the collectibles and not transforming a single piece of missing paper into a chore.

 

Also, I think some people put 100% of the value of their experience with a game on the platinum trophy. I can totally understand being a bit upset if you're waiting for a new release and the platinum requires less than half of what you wanted to, but again trophy lists are arbitrary and it's not like every new game has a bad list, imo. Yet personally, when I really enjoy a game but found that the trophy list requires me to do less than I would already willingly do, I just do it anyway. Cuphead's trophies only asking for an A- on each boss didn't stop me from doing all of them hitless, just because I enjoyed the learning process a lot. Same thing for both meat boy games, in which I wanted to implement some visually cool tricks and skips on my deathless runs, even tho none of those trophies have a time limit. This way I feel like my thing with the games I actually care about goes beyond the trophies and I end up never caring that people have the same completion on them as me, despite doing less stuff or even using some glitch/exploit in some cases.

Edited by LucasDiasC
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I haven’t played this yet, but the lack of effort you guys have described is a bit disappointing to me. Ratchet & Clank game are already easy enough as it is, it wouldn’t have been a bad thing at all for this one to have made players work for it a little bit. At least require them to finish the game, or play through the challenge mode or whatever.

 

It seems this is now the norm for the big, AAA PlayStation exclusives to come with a really easy trophy list. I guess since those games are catered towards a much wider audience and far more casual gamers, they are designing trophies that are easily unlockable for these kinds of players.
 

I actually don’t really have a problem with this, as long as the trophy lists are enjoyable and they don’t completely phone it in. When I look at games like Days Gone, SpiderMan, Horizon Zero Dawn etc. I think they got it right. The trophy lists were easy and reasonable enough that you can just sit back and relax and fully enjoy the game and story without any tedious grinding or hair pulling difficulty. The trophy lists were also designed in a way where they encouraged fully exploring and completing the majority of the game. But they weren’t so easy as to the point of being completely effortless. The trophies were fun to unlock.

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Enjoyed the game and the platinum.

 

This is a game for everyone, and so is the platinum. The series never had any hardcore platinum entries and doesn't need to.

 

Trophy list is solid with some fun activities, and I am glad they avoided grinds, extra playthroughs or repetitive tasks.

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I've always been of the opinion that when a trophy list is enjoyable or engaging enough to complete then it is a success. If a list doesn't respect my time with one unreasonable long trophy, then I probably wouldn't bother, 

Also with the arguments that this list doesn't encourage exploration, I believe they do. For example:

  • Collect five gold bolts: You'll discover that these unlock hidden features, like new wrench colours and you may want to collect more just for these feature.
  • Collect 3 lorbs: You'll listen to them and discover an interconnected universe, and you'll want the rest to hear more PS related easter eggs.
  • Have one weapon reach Level 5: You'll see the weapon has become noticeably different and will want to upgrade the others anyway for a more powerful arsenal.
  • Buy all weapons: Since you can only do this in challenge mode, and from the previous point, there will be the Omega weapons available and you may want to see how those weapons change as they level.

To summarise, this list is to teach and invite you to get everything out of the game, not the demand that those more critical of it would prefer. 

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4 hours ago, LucasDiasC said:

I agree that a trophy list should ask you to experience most of a game's content and also that this R&C could easily require a higher general game completion for the plat, BUT a few things bother me every time a thread like this pops up...

 

Most games difficulty settings suck. Hard mode often is basically the enemies having x more health and dealing x more damage. It's very rare to see any noticeable gameplay changes, so in these cases I honestly couldn't care less about the lack of a difficulty specific trophy, I'll actually be glad to play on a lower setting when I don't care and the platinum doesn't require it.

 

(most) Collectibles suck. I'd have a hard time trying to think of a game where collectibles actually added something besides pointless extra hours wandering around and sometimes having to strictly follow a guide so I don't end up playing the game multiple times because I didn't find magazine no.102 that a dude decided to put in some random corner. Even when collectibles add a few extra lore info, It's still a pain for me to clean ALL of them in most cases.

 

With that said, it should not be all-or-nothing. I think it's much better when a list requires collectibles but at least gives you some kind of resource (tracking and most importantly imo, giving you some room to miss a few of them. Control's AWE DLC is a good example, requiring 80% of the collectibles and not transforming a single piece of missing paper into a chore.

 

Also, I think some people put 100% of the value of their experience with a game on the platinum trophy. I can totally understand being a bit upset if you're waiting for a new release and the platinum requires less than half of what you wanted to, but again trophy lists are arbitrary and it's not like every new game has a bad list, imo. Yet personally, when I really enjoy a game but found that the trophy list requires me to do less than I would already willingly do, I just do it anyway. Cuphead's trophies only asking for an A- on each boss didn't stop me from doing all of them hitless, just because I enjoyed the learning process a lot. Same thing for both meat boy games, in which I wanted to implement some visually cool tricks and skips on my deathless runs, even tho none of those trophies have a time limit. This way I feel like my thing with the games I actually care about goes beyond the trophies and I end up never caring that people have the same completion on them as me, despite doing less stuff or even using some glitch/exploit in some cases.

Collectibles in R&C RA do not suck in the least. They are actually few of them are and incredibly easy to find, plus they add to the lore (not much though imo) and add in-game cheats/bonuses which are cool. Asking the player to get them all would have been a good idea, and would not be grindy at all.

 

Not to go off topic but, I noticed that you seem to play lots of games that have multi lists and plat' them all. I don't understand your way of thinking, you say that a game that requires you to find each and every collectible "sucks" and it's boring, but on the other way, you seem to play 5-6 times the same game, do the same tasks all over again to earn an extra platinum trophy...

3 hours ago, Thrillhelm said:

Enjoyed the game and the platinum.

 

This is a game for everyone, and so is the platinum. The series never had any hardcore platinum entries and doesn't need to.

 

Trophy list is solid with some fun activities, and I am glad they avoided grinds, extra playthroughs or repetitive tasks.

This is not about being "hardcore" but about being a list that rewards players who actually explored every single opportunity in the game.

 

R&C RA is really fun, finding gold botls, spybots and so on is pretty easy and actually adds something to the game like I said above, and is not grindy in the least. Hell, R&Cs have always had the best NG+ I experienced.

Other R&C had this perfect balance when it came to trophies (except for the infamous 1M bolts in R&C 1 I agree). But this one... feels cheap.

Edited by bosstristan
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On ١٦‏/٦‏/٢٠٢١ at 6:31 PM, bosstristan said:

Am I the only who's completely disappointed by the trophy list?

 

Don't get me wrong, the game is truly amazing, and that what matters the most.

 

But when it comes to the trophy list, it's really... not there. You don't even need to finish the game in this or that difficulty, collect all spy bots, all orbs, all gold bolts (wtf), beat challenge mode, beat all the arena challenges, upgrade all weapons... It is a real shame, you can basically get the plat' with no effort whatsoever, leaving the game to not even 50%... I don't mean trophies should be excruciatingly hard, but just enough so it feels like you actually achieved something, you completed the game to 100% (especially when it's such a short game like this one, for games like Just Cause 2, 75% required is enough imo).

Plus, collectible are sh*t easy to find AND displayed on the map, what is this, Assassin's Creed?

 

Anyway, I've completed the game 100% (without activating the preorder DLC which seems to be quite game breaking btw)  and I'm now playing challenge mode in the highest difficulty. I find it really sad they wanted to make is so 'accessible', a platinum should not be too accessible, that's the point of a reward/trophy/achievement.

This is just the beginning Sony easy exclusive games plat 

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23 minutes ago, bosstristan said:

Collectibles in R&C RA do not suck in the least. They are actually few of them are and incredibly easy to find, plus they add to the lore (not much though imo) and add in-game cheats/bonuses which are cool. Asking the player to get them all would have been a good idea, and would not be grindy at all.

 

Not to go off topic but, I noticed that you seem to play lots of games that have multi lists and plat' them all. I don't understand your way of thinking, you say that a game that requires you to find each and every collectible "sucks" and it's boring, but on the other way, you seem to play 5-6 times the same game, do the same tasks all over again to earn an extra platinum trophy...

This is not about being "hardcore" but about being a list that rewards players who actually explored every single opportunity in the game.

 

R&C RA is really fun, finding gold botls, spybots and so on is pretty easy and actually adds something to the game like I said above, and is not grindy in the least. Hell, R&Cs have always had the best NG+ I experienced.

Other R&C had this perfect balance when it came to trophies (except for the infamous 1M bolts in R&C 1 I agree). But this one... feels cheap.

What does you stop to explore everything anyways?

 

The trophy list, like I said, is for everyone, and Sony/Insomniac had the casual gamer in mind. A game that has so many barrier-free controls as option should not go opposite way by making the game unnecessesarily hard.

 

I dont want to spend the time I gained with the lack of load times with grinding.

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46 minutes ago, Thrillhelm said:

 

The trophy list, like I said, is for everyone, and Sony/Insomniac had the casual gamer in mind. A game that has so many barrier-free controls as option should not go opposite way by making the game unnecessesarily hard.

 

I dont want to spend the time I gained with the lack of load times with grinding.

The game is for everyone. Trophies have always been a separate entity and can be hard or grindy or whatever despite the general feel of the game. A better list wouldn't make the game unnecessarily hard as you say, because they don't impact the game in any way. But trophy hunters like a lot of people in this thread have higher standards for lists and are simply recognizing that it's a disappointing list for a great game. If you don't want to spend time engaging with the hobby then don't, but it's a lazy list that isn't even in keeping with past R&C lists and that is disappointing to trophy hunters like those here

52 minutes ago, djb5f said:

This whole thread just tells me that too many people’s gaming habits are dictated by trophies.

 

Like they are prisoners of trophies and can’t continue to play after that.

Is that what this thread is telling you? Most people I saw in this thread who are complaining about the list are still going to play, or have already played, this game. In fact even the OP I believe said he's going to do everything the trophies don't cover anyway. 

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2 hours ago, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

The game is for everyone. Trophies have always been a separate entity and can be hard or grindy or whatever despite the general feel of the game. A better list wouldn't make the game unnecessarily hard as you say, because they don't impact the game in any way. But trophy hunters like a lot of people in this thread have higher standards for lists and are simply recognizing that it's a disappointing list for a great game. If you don't want to spend time engaging with the hobby then don't, but it's a lazy list that isn't even in keeping with past R&C lists and that is disappointing to trophy hunters like those here.

This is well said. Everyone prefers to stay in their comfort zones and rarely wanders out of it( you could apply this to any aspect of life) in all my lifes hobbies i always prefer the more challenging approach not only does it feel more rewarding but it helps you grow.

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Speak for yourself, please. Sorry, thats some elitism. Playing Ratchet and Clank and not getting a hard trophy list?

 

I don't want to spend my time with pointless grinding, which could have bern avoided if there has been any thought put into the trophy list.

 

Higher standards, ok. Weird flex.

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I don't understand why some here bring the argument that "it's better this way, I don't want to grind", who talked about grinding? Does completing the game on NG+ with brand new gameplay and weapons sound like grinding to you? Does collecting 25 little bolts, which are btw extremely easy to find with no effort whatsoever, sound like grinding? Does finding all armors and all 12 orbs sound like grinding?

 

I really don't get it, I think no one here likes stupid grinding, like it was the case in R&C 1 for exemple with its 1M bolts to collect. Grinding is nowhere near the point here, we are talking about a plat' trophy that unlocks after not even 8h of gameplay without experiencing the true experience of it (NG+ in this game like all other R&C is really good, maxing out weapons truly adds to the gameplay, and I can guarantee you that your experience was not as good as mine for not playing the game in NG+)

Edited by bosstristan
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So this is by far the easiest Ratchet & Clank game. Challenge Mode was practically half the fun, and I definitely don't see the trophy list telling you you need to do a New Game Plus walkthrough. Even Spider-Man: Miles Morales had you doing New Game Plus.

 

As much as I love Ratchet & Clank games, I'm sort of..... disappointed in the trophy list. Unfortunately I'm dead broke, and getting your hands on a PS5 right now isn't all too easy, unless you're willing to shell out $1000 for one, which I outright refuse to do.

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1 minute ago, AJ_Radio said:

So this is by far the easiest Ratchet & Clank game. Challenge Mode was practically half the fun, and I definitely don't see the trophy list telling you you need to do a New Game Plus walkthrough. Even Spider-Man: Miles Morales had you doing New Game Plus.

 

As much as I love Ratchet & Clank games, I'm sort of..... disappointed in the trophy list. Unfortunately I'm dead broke, and getting your hands on a PS5 right now isn't all too easy, unless you're willing to shell out $1000 for one, which I outright refuse to do.

I found Challenge mode to be quite good actually, I'm glad they kept the original concept of doing the game with all your previous stats, weapons, and also giving you the opportunity to earn up to 20 times as many bolts, provided you kill enough enemies without getting hit, as well as unlocking Omega weapons (from level 6 to 10), which once upgraded, really change the game (the RYNO VIII here is really impressive when maxed out).

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On 6/16/2021 at 9:35 AM, bosstristan said:

Yeah I understand, I guess we perceive the value of trophy differently from the devs, to us, it's a reward for an achievement, to them, it's just a marketing tool.

 

But in a broader sense, I find it sad that things become more and more devaluated, watered down. But that's a different debate.

 

On 6/16/2021 at 10:15 AM, Undead Wolf said:

Agreed. This has been a thing with all Sony first party titles as of late because they want to encourage normies to go for the platinum. Any hint of difficulty or commitment in a trophy list will scare these people off, so they make the lists as watered down as possible. It's pretty much just a participation award at this point, so for committed trophy hunters like us, these trophy lists are wholly unsatisfying to complete. 

 

On 6/16/2021 at 10:17 AM, sepheroithisgod said:

It's just a victim of the times.

 

Let's face it, the trophy hunting community has changed and developers are cashing in on it. The average AAA gaming experience has a trophy list that offer's little in terms of difficulty. Most games even lack difficulty trophies to help make it a hobby accessible to everyone. This is taken a step further when you look at all of the accessibility options they are adding to modern games that can even be used to cheese higher difficulties.

 

Should Ratchet and Clank be a 10/10 in terms of difficulty? 

No.

 

Does that mean every trophy should be a cakewalk?

No.

 

I personally took the time to get every collectable the game had and still only had 13 hrs of game time by the time the plat popped. I think asking players to beat challenge mode and max out all the weapons would have balanced out the list.

 

On 6/16/2021 at 10:15 AM, aZombieDictator said:

Imo clearing 100% trophies/achievements in a game should mean you've done everything in the game. Really disappointing barely any games require true 100% for all trophies anymore. Platinums are basically participation awards now.

 

I have to say all you guys are right on point here.

 

I'm not asking there to be a Wolfenstein II Mein Leben like trophy, or something as challenging as doing all those no death levels in Super Meat Boy. But given how even Ratchet & Clank 2016 asked you to do a lot more for the platinum, whereas Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart has you doing maybe 20 percent of the actual content, this is definitely a sign trophies in general are becoming more like participation awards.

 

It's a sign of the times. The games that really offer any real excitement and challenge for me anymore are those indie games that offer up some challenge and have more original ideas. Housemarque games in recent times have helped filled that gap of being actual challenge. Nex Machina I've been playing a little lately and it is a fucking blast. Accessible enough for modern audiences, but has enough challenge to where only the truly committed will go for the platinum.

 

As much as I want to play Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart, I'm definitely going to wait for a discount.

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5 hours ago, bosstristan said:

Not to go off topic but, I noticed that you seem to play lots of games that have multi lists and plat' them all. I don't understand your way of thinking, you say that a game that requires you to find each and every collectible "sucks" and it's boring, but on the other way, you seem to play 5-6 times the same game, do the same tasks all over again to earn an extra platinum trophy...

 

It's quite simple actually, whenever you see a person with a ton of platinums and stacked lists, it just means that person is trying to climb up the leaderboards, it's a  different perspective to be looked at. It doesn't mean we are anxiously waiting for the next game from Our Church and Halloween RPG. In this type of competition you basically have to follow the meta, which has always been about playing the easiest/fastest completions to get trophy points faster, and publishers like Ratalaika and EastAsiaSoftware started using it to their advantage with multiple and dull trophy lists. I began my trophy hunting a few years before this trophy spam started, and like everyone who still cared about keeping up with the rankings, simply had to adapt to it. I already long ago stopped directly supporting this kind of publisher, but as far as playing and stacking goes, it is actually the only way of making the actual hard earned platinums stick out and give you some advantage, leaderboard-wise speaking, since every trophy list nets you around the same amout of points. 

 

I'd have no problem if I had some good hundreds less platinums and that the trophy system was just better organized overall, but we're unfortunately not there. (Sony could somewhat easily fix this by disallowing region stacks and only keeping the platform ones - even tho I enjoy stacking nice games aswell). I'm pretty sure most people on the first page of the leaderboard more than anyone would want the current meta to change so they have more time to play better games instead of stacking ratalaikas over and over. Unfortunately to keep it up you need to stick with whatever way is the most efficient to score, or just quit this specific type of competition, which has been understandably happening with a lot of people for the past years and probably will be more often from now on, since we're at the current peak of trophy stack spam.

 

tl;dr players as well as publishers will always take advantage of a system's 'flaws' for different reasons (competition x easier money) and it should be up to Sony to put up some reasonable standards to their own system

Edited by LucasDiasC
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35 minutes ago, LucasDiasC said:

 

tl;dr players as well as publishers will always take advantage of a system's 'flaws' for different reasons (competition x easier money) and it should be up to Sony to put up some reasonable standards to their own system

This I agree with. Sony has seemingly no QA to speak of, they just know people will continue to buy the stupid games that show up and they'll continue making money

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11 minutes ago, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

This I agree with. Sony has seemingly no QA to speak of, they just know people will continue to buy the stupid games that show up and they'll continue making money

 

I'm sure you're aware, but for those who aren't, we're referring to Breakthrough Gaming Arcade and shameless trophy whore games that offer no real value, neither in gameplay nor in trophy lists.

 

Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart is still a high quality game through and through, but it received a less than adequate trophy list.

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