Psychonauts 2 features an invincibility mode that won't disable achievements/trophies

[mcnichoj]

18 hours ago, Stardroid said:

This upcoming trend of devaluing trophies is why I am not motivated to complete my profile in the slightest and will stop trophy hunting completely if I do ever finish. For me, trophy hunting is about merit and achieving what the trophy description asks you to do. Yes, there are glitches, guides etc that help you with that. But none of these come from the developers themselves. The devs did not intend a Hollow Knight incivility for example. They are moot points to make and it's really an incredibly stupid argument. 

 

 Accessibility is cool but I hate how some people think it leading to free trophies is somehow a good thing. As a matter of fact, do you think that people who need the accessibility are stupid? Do you think they do not understand that achieving these trophies while being invincible is basically meaningless? I have a cousin who has a disability and he finds it degrading. 

One could argue that you never cared at all about the actual trophies and just how they made you look.

So your take is that it's okay for players to abuse game mechanics in order to go against the developers and make them easier when they were intended to be harder is okay and shouldn't be correlated to how you think developers can't just make games easier from the get go so you don't have to find loop holes in their code? Gotcha.

 

No one is calling anyone stupid. Bad strawman. All kinds of disabilities exist. Some people just don't have the same reflexes as others or the same amount of appendages.

I played through The Walking Dead by Telltale, was that pointless because it didn't have a hard difficulty mode? You have a lot of RPG games on your list. One could easily argue those aren't skill based completions but rather endurance based.

 

18 hours ago, Dreakon13 said:

I will clarify though, that whomever made the leaderboards (not me), and whomever cares about them (not me)... if the idea is total inclusivity regardless of ability, than step one would be to eliminate the competitive elements of it right?  Get rid of the leaderboards?  If everyone gets everything they serve no purpose.

 

Which I'd be totally fine with... but the fact they probably aren't going anywhere, demonstrates the competitive nature of trophies (whether intended to be that way or not) and gives a clear visual of how something once valued could be devalued if this became a trend for those who haven't been able to follow how/why that is.  You can argue that it shouldn't be valued that way, that it isn't intended to be valued that way, and I wouldn't disagree... but it is.  And that's something to be considered.

I assure you, people like Roughdawg and Hakoom aren't worried about getting knocked down the leaderboard by everyone that gets this plat.

In fact, that's the funniest thing about all the people in here arguing about the competitive nature and value of trophies are well below these guys who LOVE to rack up these plats. They are objectively the most competitive people in the trophy hunting community. All you guys complaining this is the worst day of your life, for them it will be a Wednesday/Tuesday.

 

17 hours ago, ExHaseo said:

Might as well just go the Nier route and let people unlock them all for free. 

Pretty sure you had to play through the game once before you could do that. Therefor you don't buy them all. It didn't just hand them to you, still had to play the game and yet only a 30% completion rate on Nier Automata. Compare that to God of War 1 on PS3 where you have to do two runs and complete a "challenging" trophy is sitting at a 20% completion rate. One is "harder" and requires more time but has only a 10% difference in people finishing it.

P.S. Have you tried out the Xbox adaptive controller? Apparently it can be used with the PS4. Might make a world of difference with your physical impairment, they are $100 though. Something to think about, could make playing games less painful.

 

16 hours ago, MMDE said:

 

Yeah, most people will take the path of least resistance. That's irrelevant to my point though.

 

What trophy in your collection do you value the most or is the most proud of? Even people who go for easy games and spam platinums tend to point to something that represent some challenge they accomplished. Everyone who gets it has been through the same thing as you as well. They tend to be more memorable.

But it's not irrelevant to mine.

 

I don't really value any one trophy. I enjoy all my completions collectively. My completion of BioShock is the same as Frogger Returns. I play my games to have fun and with the intention of doing my best to get from 0% to 100%. Some games are longer. Some games are harder. Some games I enjoy more. I play games to have fun, everything else is secondary.

[Dreakon13]

14 minutes ago, mcnichoj said:

I assure you, people like Roughdawg and Hakoom aren't worried about getting knocked down the leaderboard by everyone that gets this plat.

In fact, that's the funniest thing about all the people in here arguing about the competitive nature and value of trophies are well below these guys who LOVE to rack up these plats. They are objectively the most competitive people in the trophy hunting community. All you guys complaining this is the worst day of your life, for them it will be a Wednesday/Tuesday.

 

Not talking about any one or two individuals or accounts... one look at the dispute subforum, toxic as it is, shows people in the community care about the integrity of the trophies and the leaderboards.  The fact there's a cheater removal team period shows the staff cares about the integrity of the leaderboards.  People in this thread are saying they care.  You can cover your ears and la-la-la-la-la over everything anyone says and make these strawman arguments about Roughdawg and Hakoom like I'm worried about them (not even totally sure who they are) but point being, people care about the competitive element of trophy hunting.  You don't have to be on the top to care about it, people just want to know their place in it, wherever it is, is earned.  Legit games getting participation trophy lists changes that.  I won't argue whether it's for the better or worse, but it's something to consider.

 

Besides, people with actual disabilities are in this thread saying invincibility isn't true accessibility anyways, as opposed to finely tuning features... so who are you arguing for exactly?  Other than just general high roading and waiting for someone to slip up and say something that sounds like disabled-bashing?

Edited July 15, 2021 by Dreakon13

[Stardroid]

27 minutes ago, mcnichoj said:

One could argue that you never cared at all about the actual trophies and just how they made you look.

So your take is that it's okay for players to abuse game mechanics in order to go against the developers and make them easier when they were intended to be harder is okay and shouldn't be correlated to how you think developers can't just make games easier from the get go so you don't have to find loop holes in their code? Gotcha.

 

No one is calling anyone stupid. Bad strawman. All kinds of disabilities exist. Some people just don't have the same reflexes as others or the same amount of appendages.I played through The Walking Dead by Telltale, was that pointless because it didn't have a hard difficulty mode? You have a lot of RPG games on your list. One could easily argue those aren't skill base

d completions but rather endurance based.

 

 

You could argue that but you would be wrong as I never bragged about any of my trophies and I rarely showcase them. It's about me and overcoming the challenge and feeling satisfied having pulled it off. 

 

Strawman 1: I never said it's okay to abuse game mechanics in order to go against developers (how do you even interpret that like such?). I said it's not what developers intended. So developers putting in invincibility modes is a whole lot different than players finding glitches and abusing them. One is meant as intended, the other one isn't. One is setting a trend, the other one isn't. 

 

Strawman 2: I never said that you are calling these people stupid. I posed the question, those are different things. It's also rhetorical as they aren't stupid. Stop pretending you even know what a strawman argument is mate. Personally I would like it very much is lists are more balanced. You have hard lists, you have easy lists and you have that in betweenI advise you to look at the recent games and AAA games. Developers know that easy lists sell more. They know that making crap games with easy lists will make them sell more. This is why I am stopping because we are clearly going towards these kind of lists and it just makes trophy hunting moot. May as well just enjoy the game without being tied to the checklist, right? It just ain't for me. 

[mcnichoj]

1 minute ago, Dreakon13 said:

 

Not talking about any one or two individuals or accounts... one look at the dispute subforum, toxic as it is, shows people in the community care about the integrity of the trophies and the leaderboards.  The fact there's a cheater removal team period shows the staff cares about the integrity of the leaderboards.  You can cover your ears and la-la-la-la-la over everything anyone says and make these strawman arguments but point being, people care about the competitive element of trophy hunting.  Participation trophies changes that.  I won't argue whether it's for the better or worse, but it's something to consider.

 

Besides, people with actual disabilities are in this thread saying invincibility isn't true accessibility anyways... so who are you arguing for exactly?  Other than just general high roading?

Yeah, integrity against people hacking or another way of phrasing it; cheating. Playing this or any other intentionally easy game is nothing remotely close to cheating. I'd argue doing exploits to make harder games easier could be considered cheating by some elitist people...

Pointing out the game this is a sequel to was laughably easy to begin with, is not strawmanning.

It's 100% another group of people covering their ears every time we mention not every game needs to be Dark Souls in difficulty and you can just skip games if they're somehow beneath you.

 

Fourth time I'm saying this I think, my stance was never really about those with disabilities.

 

6 minutes ago, Stardroid said:

 

You could argue that but you would be wrong as I never bragged about any of my trophies and I rarely showcase them. It's about me and overcoming the challenge and feeling satisfied having pulled it off.

Again, really not much challenge in most RPGs. Just means you didn't get bored, drop the game and move on like most people do. Which that aside, this one game doesn't effect your ability to keep playing whatever games you want and getting satisfaction out of completing them. You're gonna like this the second time; unless that's not really the reason you collect trophies.

One guy has 500 plats from trashy easy games, you get the completions from all 91 games you own. How does the way he chooses to waste his time in life have any negative impact on how you waste yours? If you're enjoying yourself, then it should have zero.

[Stardroid]

Just now, mcnichoj said:

 

 

Again, really not much challenge in most RPGs. Just means you didn't get bored, drop the game and move on like most people do. Which that aside, this one game doesn't effect your ability to keep playing whatever games you want and getting satisfaction out of completing them. You're gonna like this the second time; unless that's not really the reason you collect trophies.

One guy has 500 plats from trashy easy games, you get the completions from all 91 games you own. How does the way he chooses to waste his time in life have any negative impact on how you waste yours? If you're enjoying yourself, then it should have zero.

 

You clearly aren't reading what I am saying. I am saying the the making of easy lists over challenging ones is what is driving me away primarily. I couldn't give a damn about some ezpz spammer. 

[AJ_Radio]

Interesting conversation that I somehow missed. 
 

As someone who has a fair share of easy games myself, I cannot say I’ve only done good games as such trash as Albedo: Eyes From Outer Space and Orc Slayer will show I’ve played garbage. Games like The Little Acre were a pleasant surprise. 

 

I have yet to find any game on the PS5 that is actually challenging. But as we’ve seen dozens of times, this is another debate between the ‘casual, easy gaming crowd’, and the ‘dedicated, seeking a good challenge’ crowd who sees all the EZPZ titles as stains that pollute trophies.