Why isn’t auto popping trophies classed as cheating?

[gernboes]

2 hours ago, THE DARK KNIGHT said:

no, that's no what I'm saying, at all, that's what he's saying, you need better reading comprehension skills, first of all, your comparison is nonsense, slight movement of fingers vs hundreds of body subsystems functioning at human peak, no matter how much you want to argue, gaming never was, isn't, and never will be a physical sport or even 5% that, so your point is invalid either way, but I'll adress it this one only

 

what he's saying is that if you win a medal in a sport competition, ex swiming speed, and you happen to get best record there in his generation, and some other athlete in another generation later looks at it and says, hmmm, I want to beat that, the guy says that, that shouldn't exist, because that original person might not be able to do it again anyway, so you don't need to bother recognizing his achievment for later generations

what I'm saying is that, that is nonsense, he got that record, doesn't matter when if he can do it again, as long as it's legit, after that, 100 years later, it can still be recognized

 

same with trophies, you can get a hard trophy on PS4, you got it, if the PS5 or PS6 has a legit system feature that recognizes that, nothing wrong with it

 

the only persons that have a reason to be upset at the autopop ps5 features are the people that don't have a ps5, which is weird because are you planning on never having a ps5? you will have a ps5 at some point, you can do it too, unless you plan on stopping gaming, in which case, what do you care anyway?

 

You said him saying people shouldn't get a second platinum because maybe they couldn't earn it a second time is the same as him saying that if they cant earn it a second time invalidates the first time.

Quote

then you should hide that game from your profile

 

And you talk about invalid comparisons and then try to do one where he says another person isnt allowed to break his record? What? How is beating a record a comparison to getting a trophy? You could maybe compare being first on the fasted time with having a record, but not getting the platinum, A record can always only be held by one person at a time. But there can be any number of medal winners/trohpy achievers...

 

You win a competition once/do a task in a game once - do you get one medal/trophy for it, or more than one?

Thats the single question. not if you achieved the best time ever - that would be a record.

[Tsundokuist]

Taking issue with autopops implies that you think all trophies otherwise have an equal value.

 

I have 100% in 21 games that don’t have a platinum, none were particularly easy, (Capcom Arcade Stadium for example has a 100 hour trophy and is all bronze trophies, Mega Man Legacy Collection is a bitch of a game to 100% and also has no platinum). Conversely, I have a platinum trophy from Gleylancer, a game that hardly any of the 95%+ of players who platinum’d it have taken over an hour to do so.

 

There’s just no rhyme or reason to any trophy’s value. Why even care given we all have the ability to do the same thing if we were bothered about losing out on leaderboards or whatever.

Edited February 2, 2022 by Tsundokuist

[Titanomachy_75]

20 hours ago, KenjiCBZ said:

WTF

I completely disagree, but ok, to each their own

Its a feature so all that needs to be said  IF it was a hack then we can talk

[KenjiCBZ]

15 minutes ago, Titanomachy_75 said:

Its a feature so all that needs to be said  IF it was a hack then we can talk

I know, in fact, I never said that autopopping should be labelled as cheating, I actually agree with most of the replies here (I still consider it kinda cheap, like stacking ezpz, but everyone is free to do what they want, since it is allowed).

 

What I meant with that post ("I totally disagree") is basically that the requirement for any trophy is to satisfy it just once, it's not that somebody should hide an hard trophy because they believe they may not be able to do it again. It was a reply to THE DARK KNIGHT, not to the OP.

[audiopile]

Why would fastest achievement and other metrics that are created by 3rd parties like PSNP change how Sony awards their trophies? 

 

All of these additional metrics are just ego stroking garbage numbers. Stop worrying about other peoples stats about how much or little time they waste on playing games for FUN. If this is a concern for you then you are too invested.   

Edited February 2, 2022 by audiopile

[parkerdip]

Its not cheating as its a feature that Sony implemented

 

However I think its stupid and shouldnt exist. Games are supposed to be played and enjoyed and part of the fun is earning trophies. Sometimes I get remasters of games I have already played just so I can earn the trophies again from scratch as its FUN. If remasters didn't have trophies then I see no point in replaying. 

 

I just don't get it. The absolute only time where I would consider auto popping is multiplayer as it can't be helped with it being relating to the servers like level up trophies. 

Edited February 2, 2022 by parkerdip

[Helyx]

8 hours ago, Arcesius said:

It's the same way around, too, though... If we think that an autopopped list looks like shit on any profile, and think it is weird to autopop a game, it's our right to express that opinion.

 

Don't forget y'all, you also have the right to

[starcrunch061]

I find this thread amusing.

 

Firstly, there's absolutely nothing wrong with asking why auto-popped trophies count for leaderboards. I think they should, though not because I have any love for them. I autopopped some trophies (Sound Shapes, a few in Dynasty Warriors 8 CE). I'm not particularly proud of it, but I did earn the plat in each of those games initially, and auto-popping is something which is (or possibly was, in the case of something like Sound Shapes) available to anyone. And there are clear rules here governing auto-popping (specifically, you have to show that you earned the plat at least once legitimately). As far as a "legal" question, I think the reasons have been given, and given well.

 

As far as a "moral" question, it's completely debatable, and I have no gripe with people who love or hate them. I agree with Arcesius that if you dislike an auto-pooped plat, you can call it out (provided you don't descend into trolling). But if you like it, that's fine, too. I also wish that the leaderboards were somehow cleaned up, but this is likely an impossibility (I know you could say, "Well, just have a threshold time!", but such times are easy to work around simply by earning a few trophies legitimately, and then auto-popping the rest).

 

The only people I question are the ones who insist that anyone who might talk about aspects of trophies and trophy hunting are "too invested", but whatever - they can speak, too, provided it doesn't descend into personal attack.

[loncle13]

"Why isn’t auto popping trophies classed as cheating?"

 

Cuz it's not xD. 

It's now marketing, this new function works perfectly for the crazies trophies hunters, devs add the possibility so it's legit.

 

[Evers_cl]

Its more cheating boosting,use a guide, share play, glinch abuse than auto pop. You already did the trophies and use a function of the game. 

[matigrosso91]

Personally i don't do autopopping, and i never will. I like to play the games from start to finish, even if i have to make them all again. But i have nothing against it, it's allowed and that's the end. Honestly, I couldn't care less about what other people do with their profiles. Live and let live.

[Agent_Renegade22]

I mean who cares for trophies if Microsoft continues to buy all existing studios and publishers we will be heading there soon and as far as I know there's no autopopping, multiple stacks of shitty easy games etc. Fair enough 

Edited February 2, 2022 by Agent_Renegade22

[Eagles_Numba_One]

I have a rule when it comes to auto popping trophies. If it is an upgrade from ps4 to ps5 (Uncharted, Spiderman, FF7, etc.) then i will play the game again and enjoy my time with it and try to earn most trophies naturally and in a fun way. When I'm done doing that, I will pop the rest of the trophies. Things like the crushing and speed run on Uncharted, 100% all districts in spiderman, and all the hair pulling stuff I already did, then I don't find it worth it to do it over and make myself hate my time playing. I got my enjoyment from the game and I find that enough. 

[GoonerLukeThe]

autopopping obviously isn't cheating, they wouldn't let you do it otherwise

 

imo though it's a waste of money if you buy a game just to autopop trophies, it's alright though and makes sense if you get a free upgrade from ps4 to ps5 and then autopop, or if you buy a game and it comes with both versions and you only play the ps4 version (dirt 5 for example, when it was free last month on ps plus)

[PhyrxianLibrarin]

For the same reason multiple people sharing a single PSN account isn't considered cheating.

[TehUberCheezCatz]

The worst thing autopopping has done has made people entitled, that they think they deserve more then what they actually did and so every game has to devolve into people wanting it to autopop because they think they deserve it, when frankly i don't know why it even exists in the first place, noone in the inbetween of ps3/ps4 cared about it, but now everything has to for no good reason with only a very small group of exceptions (like online only games which are unfortunately unavoidable).
While I know logistically this isn't really an option I definitely think it should be cut from fastest boards at the very least, since it completely kills those boards.
And for the people that complain about having to play the game again, why not just y'know, not play it again? or does that make too much sense?

[RotatingCube]

21 minutes ago, TehUberCheezCatz said:

The worst thing autopopping has done has made people entitled, that they think they deserve more then what they actually did and so every game has to devolve into people wanting it to autopop because they think they deserve it, when frankly i don't know why it even exists in the first place, noone in the inbetween of ps3/ps4 cared about it, but now everything has to for no good reason with only a very small group of exceptions (like online only games which are unfortunately unavoidable).
While I know logistically this isn't really an option I definitely think it should be cut from fastest boards at the very least, since it completely kills those boards.
And for the people that complain about having to play the game again, why not just y'know, not play it again? or does that make too much sense?

 

Gotta ask, why did Sony implement it this way in the first place? It's different from how Microsoft does it or even from how Sony used to do it with a lot of games that have both a PS3 and PS4 version.

[DrBloodmoney]

55 minutes ago, RotatingCube said:

 

Gotta ask, why did Sony implement it this way in the first place? It's different from how Microsoft does it or even from how Sony used to do it with a lot of games that have both a PS3 and PS4 version.

I think it’s because they wanted to update the trophy system for PS5, to implement the more trackable type of trophy on PS5, (which necessitated that all PS5 games have separate lists to their PS4 counterparts,) but they also were cognisant of the fact that a lot of people would not be upgrading to a PS5 right away.

 

I assume they didn’t want people to avoid buying the PS4 version of cross-gen games, and just waiting until they had a PS5.

They wanted people to buy the PS4 version when that was all they could play, but to know they could upgrade at any point when they did get a PS5. (That is also evidenced by the common implementation of free, or heavily discounted upgrade paths for games.)

 

They knew that some people would not want to upgrade in the middle of a game, if it meant they would never get any platinum - if half the trophies were left on a PS4 list, and the other half were on a PS5 list, and neither got finished, and so they implemented auto-pop - as a (somewhat inelegant) solution for people who upgrade in the middle of a game.

They could carry-over their previously earned trophies to the new list, and pick up where they left off, with the possibility of full completion (and a platinum) still available to them.

 

I don’t think they considered the idea of “completionists” though - that some folks wouldn’t want to just leave the old PS4 list incomplete.

 Nor do I think they intend for people to deliberately only play the older versions of games, even after upgrading to a PS5, specifically so they could then auto-pop ALL the trophies in a list.

That, in a sense, has the opposite to the intended effect.
 

The idea was to allow people to upgrade to the better version at any time they chose without locking themselves out of one platinum - not to encourage people to only play the inferior version so they can get two of them.

That’s just a strange practice that happens to have grown out of the confluence of two different, opposing forces - the gaming-experience-centric ideals that governed the Sony policy, and the trophy-centric ideals of the more active Trophy Hunting community.

 

Edited February 2, 2022 by DrBloodmoney

[Titanomachy_75]

13 hours ago, KenjiCBZ said:

I know, in fact, I never said that autopopping should be labelled as cheating, I actually agree with most of the replies here (I still consider it kinda cheap, like stacking ezpz, but everyone is free to do what they want, since it is allowed).

 

What I meant with that post ("I totally disagree") is basically that the requirement for any trophy is to satisfy it just once, it's not that somebody should hide an hard trophy because they believe they may not be able to do it again. It was a reply to THE DARK KNIGHT, not to the OP.

Oh ok gotcha  it’s cheap yes but this is a trophy web page hehe ? some hard trophies can be a problem I agree but just keep at it;) if you think you can’t do it take a break and clear your head and go again I’m sure if you got it once it will come again. Just remember never give up 

Edited February 2, 2022 by Titanomachy_75

[Dry]

No. Auto-popping is not cheating.

 

Now may I ask why do we need a thread with 90+ replies to tell us the obvious? The first reply alone as of writing has 50 upvotes proving it’s not cheating, if you can’t agree with that then maybe you should rethink your decision to become a trophy hunter.

 

Now can someone lock this thread, PLEASE?

Edited February 3, 2022 by PMV

[DragoonOfDojima]

30 minutes ago, PMV said:

No. Auto-popping is not cheating.

 

Now may I ask why do we need a thread with 90+ replies to tell us the obvious? The first reply alone as of writing has 50 upvotes proving it’s not cheating, if you can’t agree with that then maybe you should rethink your decision to become a trophy hunter.

 

Now can someone lock this thread, PLEASE?

This. Everyone is just bickering at this point. I think some people are taking this all too seriously. Trophy hunting is supposed to be a challenge, true, but at the end of the day games are supposed to be fun and it was a feature that was supposed to help with people transitioning from ps4 to ps5, since Sony most likely knew people would be acquiring them at different points in time and might switch from a ps4 game to the ps5 version midgame and wouldn't want to have to backtrack or play the earlier parts just to obtain some trophies they had already gotten on the ps4 version. People are going to have their different opinions and people are going to want to trophy hunt in different ways, we all just need to respect that and not lose sight of the fact this is all for fun and just a hobby. Maybe that's just my viewpoint since I'm still rather new

Edited February 3, 2022 by DeadmanStrife

[You]

Auto popping is not cheating, but it's certainly as close to cheating as you can possibly get. It's unfair and shady at best.

I know some guy got above 50 upvotes saying it's not cheating.

 

However, you are getting free trophies for literally no reason.

 

Imagine if I worked for a week in a 1 week contract, and got paid stocking shelves in a warehouse. And then several years later I got the exact same task, but I just got paid for it anyway and didn't have to stock the shelves at all, and the reason was because I'd stocked them before years earlier.

 

Or worse, you just expected the money without doing any of the work, because you'd done the work years ago.

 

That would be weird, in either circumstance.

 

Who cares if you did them once, you shouldn't be rewarded trophies for literally doing nothing.

Having said that, considering the cash for trophies joke of a system we have now, autopopping is certainly the lesser of two evils.

[MonaSaxPayne]

14 hours ago, DrBloodmoney said:

I think it’s because they wanted to update the trophy system for PS5, to implement the more trackable type of trophy on PS5, (which necessitated that all PS5 games have separate lists to their PS4 counterparts,) but they also were cognisant of the fact that a lot of people would not be upgrading to a PS5 right away.

 

I assume they didn’t want people to avoid buying the PS4 version of cross-gen games, and just waiting until they had a PS5.

They wanted people to buy the PS4 version when that was all they could play, but to know they could upgrade at any point when they did get a PS5. (That is also evidenced by the common implementation of free, or heavily discounted upgrade paths for games.)

 

They knew that some people would not want to upgrade in the middle of a game, if it meant they would never get any platinum - if half the trophies were left on a PS4 list, and the other half were on a PS5 list, and neither got finished, and so they implemented auto-pop - as a (somewhat inelegant) solution for people who upgrade in the middle of a game.

They could carry-over their previously earned trophies to the new list, and pick up where they left off, with the possibility of full completion (and a platinum) still available to them.

 

I don’t think they considered the idea of “completionists” though - that some folks wouldn’t want to just leave the old PS4 list incomplete.

 Nor do I think they intend for people to deliberately only play the older versions of games, even after upgrading to a PS5, specifically so they could then auto-pop ALL the trophies in a list.

That, in a sense, has the opposite to the intended effect.
 

The idea was to allow people to upgrade to the better version at any time they chose without locking themselves out of one platinum - not to encourage people to only play the inferior version so they can get two of them.

That’s just a strange practice that happens to have grown out of the confluence of two different, opposing forces - the gaming-experience-centric ideals that governed the Sony policy, and the trophy-centric ideals of the more active Trophy Hunting community.

 

 

or.. they could've done what Microsoft did.. games just have 1 achievement list regardless of the console u play it on

 

they use "smart delivery system" for u to automatically play the best version of a game 

 

so if u have an Xbox One and want to play, say cod vanguard, and 6 months later u get a series S/X, the newer console would just allow u to play the upgraded series S/X version for free... complete with cloud saves so u don't lose any progress (unlike playstation, cloud saves are automatic and not blocked behind a subscription paywall)

Edited February 3, 2022 by MonaSaxPayne

[DrBloodmoney]

20 minutes ago, MonaSaxPayne said:

 

or.. they could've done what Microsoft did.. games just have 1 achievement list regardless of the console u play it on

 

they use "smart delivery system" for u to automatically play the best version of a game 

 

so if u have an Xbox One and want to play, say cod vanguard, and 6 months later u get a series S/X, the newer console would just allow u to play the upgraded series S/X version for free... complete with cloud saves so u don't lose any progress (unlike playstation, cloud saves are automatic and not blocked behind a subscription paywall)

 

Yes, but they couldn't have done that, because of the implementation of the new type of trophies for PS5, to allow tracking. If they did shared lists, they would have been stuck using the old PS3 trophy system.

 

Unfortunately, this is just a byproduct of that upgrade - a necessary downside, if you will.

[MonaSaxPayne]

4 minutes ago, DrBloodmoney said:

 

Yes, but they couldn't have done that, because of the implementation of the new type of trophies for PS5, to allow tracking. If they did shared lists, they would have been stuck using the old PS3 trophy system.

 

Unfortunately, this is just a byproduct of that upgrade - a necessary downside, if you will.

 

I'm no tech guru, but I doubt stat tracking, while visible on it, is dependent on the trophy list itself to work. just like the square trophy tiles and new trophy level ranking, these changes were made "just because"

 

but I don't want to derail the thread any further with my ranting ?