EA joins Sony in call for inclusivity

[Boorish]

6 minutes ago, objectioner said:

Unless your take away from something like Bioshock is "captitalism bad".

[*insert yes chad meme]

[czDante92]

2 minutes ago, Doucet-182 said:

 

To anyone reading this garbage and thinking to themselves "yeah fuck the wokes, they're asking for too much", this is a reminder that LGBT youth are twice as likely to contemplate suicide. 

https://www.theguardian.com/society/2021/may/17/lgbt-youths-twice-as-likely-to-contemplate-suicide-survey-finds

 

Kids are cruel to other kids, more news at 11. But then again, what exactly is the "right" to be gained? Right to not commit suicide?
You are completely clueless of the problem here. When Square Enix created probably the most flamboyant character in history of videogames in DQ XI, everybody loved him, because it was funny, well written character and didn't felt like the creators were thinking "yeah, this will solve the hate in the world we live in, I'm such a good person" while making the game. When EA, ActiBlizz, Naughty Dog or whoever makes even "normal" gay person, it always feels like there's agenda behind it and it feels simply unnatural, and as I was saying above, you don't convince Average Joe to change his mind with this, all you do is gain brownie points from people that already agree with you on everything, while the rest get even more LGBT fatigued.

Current LGBT movement is literally worse than doing absolutely nothing if you really want to see the change.

[Alayaes]

2 minutes ago, Doucet-182 said:

 

Just a few rights off the top of my head (there are so so many more)

 

To this day, gay couples in most states are still unable to easily adopt children due to rampant institutionalized homophobia. 

 

In 2020, the US government literally banned trans members from joining the military

Most states still don't have any laws covering hate crimes that were made on the basis of gender identity or sexual orientation. Which happens very frequently btw especially towards trans women of colour, who are frequently murder victims.

Not to mention that trans folks are constantly harassed for simply existing

 

Since 2016, the supreme court has ruled it unconstitutional to have legislation preventing adoption within same-sex marriages. They therefore now have the same rights as any other couple in all 50 states. What you're describing is the trouble some private adoption agencies might give them based on their personal beliefs. Again, we should continue to strive for improvement, but the rights are in place. Societal roadblocks still exist, of course.

 

Trans people can join the military and have been able to since 2021. In slightly more detail, the ruling states that access to the military in one's self-identified gender provided all appropriate standards are met.

 

The definition of what a hate crime is can be subjective to many, and legislation cannot deal with subjectivity. However, any criminal activity that is against the law, in all 50 states, is handled to the fullest extent of the law equally across the board. While said violence may occur more often in certain subcultures or minorities, that is effectively a different issue to tackle and investigate. Requesting for separate legislation to punish those committing hate crimes on the basis of gender identity/sexual orientation would be to request exceptions to the law. That cannot happen. Why can't it just be prosecuted and handled as the crime itself? If you assault someone, should you receive a harsher punishment because you assaulted a black woman? Should you receive more years in prison if you assault someone that is gay? What if you didn't even know? Those waters are too muddy for easy solutions.

 

I understand that trans people receive more harassment and I disagree with them receiving that, of course. However, that is once again a societal problem. Not a rights problem.

 

The government can only do so much. The people have to do the rest. The court of the public opinion cannot be so easily legislated because it doesn't require compliance.

 

 

 

 

[NewVegasNick]

Just now, czDante92 said:

Kids are cruel to other kids, more news at 11. But then again, what exactly is the "right" to be gained? Right to not commit suicide?
You are completely clueless of the problem here. When Square Enix created probably the most flamboyant character in history of videogames in DQ XI, everybody loved him, because it was funny, well written character and didn't felt like the creators were thinking "yeah, this will solve the hate in the world we live in, I'm such a good person" while making the game. When EA, ActiBlizz, Naughty Dog or whoever makes even "normal" gay person, it always feels like there's agenda behind it and it feels simply unnatural, and as I was saying above, you don't convince Average Joe to change his mind with this, all you do is gain brownie points from people that already agree with you on everything, while the rest get even more LGBT fatigued.

Current LGBT movement is literally worse than doing absolutely nothing if you really want to see the change.

 

Ok Transphobe Dante

 

 

[Sunny]

I usually stay away from flammable topics like this but I'll share something, I'm a gay man married for almost 8 years to a great guy and nowadays my family is always in my house and even my mother who was against it at first now lives with us since she's going through cancer treatment, but back when I was a kid I was bullied, called names and even beaten simply for being slightly "girly" as they called, I'm happy we have all this exposure to raise awareness, but things just spiraled out of control, LGBT is just being used as a means to an end with endless blah blah blah whenever something is slightly misunderstood, it gets really old having to read these so called "news" with nothing but obnoxiouness and sensational headlines, just for clicks and and twitter war, reaching harmony and acceptance is really not like that and it ends up doing more bad than good, I just wish we could have video games without all this nonsense in which everyday is a social battle.

Edited May 26, 2022 by Sunnyburrito

[Alayaes]

5 minutes ago, Jeanoltt said:

Probably, but imagine that 99% of the characters in media are cis or hetero. The other 1% that isn't, create a thousand more of this kind of discussions that the 99%. That's the problem. People only see what they don't like.

I've always kind of seen the same two scenarios:

 

Scenario 1: you take an existing character and retcon them into being LGBT/different race/different gender. A lot of people take issue with this and the fans feel disrespected. Most people have an issue with this and fights online ensue.

 

Scenario 2: you make an entirely original character and make him or her LGBT, whatever race, whatever gender. Nobody complains except for some small minority that nobody pays attention to.

[Jeanolt]

9 minutes ago, objectioner said:

 

You seem to be conflating 'political theming' with 'political messaging'.

 

The former is presenting you with a political ideas and letting you decide what you think about it.

 

The latter is telling you what/how to think.

 

People like it when they are presened with a story that makes them think, not how to think. 

 

Unless your take away from something like Bioshock is "captitalism bad".

 

You don't "think" about gender, race or sexuality, you accept it, and continue. We are not a political topic, we are people, just like you, and deserve respect. If someone tells you to respect black people rights, you don't have a choice on that. In videogames, they don't need any justification, just like they don't need it in real life. 

 

Supporting us isn't a far-right, far-left, or center topic. Supporting us is being human.

[NewVegasNick]

1 minute ago, Alayaes said:

I've always kind of seen the same two scenarios:

 

Scenario 1: you take an existing character and retcon them into being LGBT/different race/different gender. A lot of people take issue with this and the fans feel disrespected. Most people have an issue with this and fights online ensue.

 

Scenario 2: you make an entirely original character and make him or her LGBT, whatever race, whatever gender. Nobody complains except for some small minority that nobody pays attention to.

 

 

Have you considered that most people fighting to keep a character white are usually absolute losers?

 

[Boorish]

7 minutes ago, czDante92 said:

it always feels like there's agenda

to you.

[czDante92]

1 minute ago, Doucet-182 said:

 

Ok Transphobe Dante

 

 

You know, before the Woke Movement I didn't really mind transgenders/sexuals, I've seen like 2 irl and those Drag Queen shows are kinda funny, but damn, now I might be.
Also, really great argument for your cause, insulting the other person. This will surely make me rethink my beliefs. Probably not the way you might like though.

[Alayaes]

Just now, Doucet-182 said:

 

 

Have you considered that most people fighting to keep a character white are usually absolute losers?

 

I have not, and I think that's a subjective opinion that only adds fuel to the fire. I myself have been annoyed with gender-swapping and race-swapping in the past, and I don't consider myself a loser at all.

 

Especially because I know for a fact that if it was in reverse, it would universally not be tolerated. Unless Japan does it, at which point nobody seems to care "because that's just their culture". As in, Erin Jaeger from Attack on Titan was not Asian like in the adaptation they made. In fact, almost nobody was, but I digress.

 

It goes back to the original point I made a while back. I feel like if they were to take Peter Parker (not Spider-Man, but Peter Parker himself) and retconned him into being a black guy, it would be the writer telling me "maybe if we change a character you like, you'll take notice of the issue!!". No, I don't need help noticing the issue, but thanks for assuming I do. Now let's change Blade into a white dude from Jackson Mississippi. See what happens.

 

Luckily, they instead made Miles Morales. Somebody nobody seems to have a problem with. Because, you know, it's not a retcon but an original character. Good!

[czDante92]

Just now, boorish_brute said:

to you.

I have nothing against gay people and if this feels like an agenda to me, then how do you think will feel people who are against them? Do you want to change society's opinion on gay people or do you want to force your ideas on everybody, as long as you believe you're morally right?

[NewVegasNick]

5 minutes ago, czDante92 said:

You know, before the Woke Movement I didn't really mind transgenders/sexuals, I've seen like 2 irl and those Drag Queen shows are kinda funny, but damn, now I might be.
Also, really great argument for your cause, insulting the other person. This will surely make me rethink my beliefs. Probably not the way you might like though.

 

If you're threatening to no longer support a cause because someone was mean to you. Some people might suggest that you were never an earnest ally. 

Edited May 26, 2022 by Doucet-182

[objectioner]

2 minutes ago, Jeanoltt said:

You don't "think" about gender, race or sexuality, you accept it, and continue. We are not a political topic, we are people, just like you, and deserve respect. If someone tells you to respect black people rights, you don't have a choice on that. In videogames, they don't need any justification, just like they don't need it in real life. 

 

Supporting us isn't a far-right, far-left, or center topic. Supporting us is being human.

 

You seem to be missing my point.

I'm talking about when people say "keep politics out of videogames".

 

I'm not "denying" people's right to exist.

 

As for your point, I didn't used to think about things like gender untill people quite forcably started asserting therr was more than two biological genders.

Thats when I started noticing it was "political messaging' being pushed.

[temp-910724]

55 minutes ago, Doucet-182 said:

 

It's hilarious that for 40 years we get games made mostly by white men for white men. And the moment we see games being made by and for people outside of that group, there's this screeching whining about "keeping politics out of games". Bunch of absolute toddlers.

 

This is what games looked like 40 years ago, could you educate me on how these were made for white men?

[Boorish]

3 minutes ago, czDante92 said:

I have nothing against gay people and if this feels like an agenda to me, then how do you think will feel people who are against them? Do you want to change society's opinion on gay people or do you want to force your ideas on everybody, as long as you believe you're morally right?

What's the "agenda"? How is it forcing the idea of being gay?

Edited May 26, 2022 by boorish_brute

[Zephrese]

I must be too left-leaning for some people in here, and too right-leaning for others because holy fuck I'm cringing so hard from things people on both sides have said. lmao

i.e I think using words like "woke", "SJW", "NPC", etc. unironically makes you look unintelligent, but also I agree with not changing a character's race, sex, etc.

 

Unfortunately a lot of people can't - or don't care to - hear themselves talk, and how what they say sounds to other people. Every side has its share of nuts, I guess. -shrug-

Edited May 26, 2022 by Zephrese

[Alayaes]

9 minutes ago, Jeanoltt said:

You don't "think" about gender, race or sexuality, you accept it, and continue. We are not a political topic, we are people, just like you, and deserve respect. If someone tells you to respect black people rights, you don't have a choice on that. In videogames, they don't need any justification, just like they don't need it in real life. 

 

Supporting us isn't a far-right, far-left, or center topic. Supporting us is being human.

While I cannot disagree with what you're saying, an important distinction must be made.

 

You don't deserve respect. You deserve the same chances and opportunities to earn respect. Being part of a minority or marginalized group should not be used as a trump card, but it often is. Your sexual orientation, your gender identity, or your ethnicity should not entitle you to any more or less respect or opportunity.

 

Respecting someone's rights is different from respecting the person enjoying those rights.

[DrBloodmoney]

 

2 minutes ago, temp-910724 said:

 

This is what games looked like 40 years ago, could you educate me on how these were made for white men?

 

This is also a game from 1982:

 

 

Would you care to educate me as to how it wasn't?

[czDante92]

Just now, Doucet-182 said:

 

If you're threating to no longer support a cause because someone was mean to you. Some people might suggest that you were never an earnest ally. 

I was never "ally", I just didn't care. Now you probably are, and you're making sure I won't be in the future.
Now of course I don't really mind what some random person posts on internet forum and keep on believing what I believe, but ask youself, are you helping the situation? Or just adding fuel to the fire?
You're ally to trans people just like Japan was an ally to Germany, you mean well but maybe don't attack USA when Germany have enough enemies to fight.

[kinnyman]

1 hour ago, Doucet-182 said:

It's hilarious that for 40 years we get games made mostly by white men for white men. And the moment we see games being made by and for people outside of that group, there's this screeching whining about "keeping politics out of games".

 

Have you ever played and beaten SEGA, NES / Famicon, or SNES games?  Look at the credits.  Majority were made and developed in Japan.  So you are wrong here.  In fact, all of your following posts are hyper sensitive, highly opinionated and highly uneducated bullshit and you are getting called out on it, but instead of responding to the point, you are calling people names now because they ask you for clarification on what you say.  Welcome to equality, you need to be able to defend your position and not just spout unstable, emotional nonsense.

 

1 hour ago, Doucet-182 said:

Bunch of absolute toddlers.

LMAO.  The fucking irony. 

[Alayaes]

1 minute ago, DrBloodmoney said:

Would you care to educate me as to how it wasn't?

They should add trophies to that game. Missed opportunity.

[NewVegasNick]

1 minute ago, czDante92 said:

I was never "ally", I just didn't care. Now you probably are, and you're making sure I won't be in the future.
Now of course I don't really mind what some random person posts on internet forum and keep on believing what I believe, but ask youself, are you helping the situation? Or just adding fuel to the fire?
You're ally to trans people just like Japan was an ally to Germany, you mean well but maybe don't attack USA when Germany have enough enemies to fight.

 

If someone started being mean to me, I don't think i'd suddenly stop supporting marginalized groups. But you do you!

Edited May 26, 2022 by Doucet-182

[czDante92]

6 minutes ago, boorish_brute said:

What's the "agenda"? How is it forcing the idea of being gay?

here https://www.bbc.com/news/newsbeat-46795596
also it doesn't force anyone gay, it "forces" the acceptance, which might be a noble goal, but as I wrote, it fails miserably and making things worse

[Jeanolt]

24 minutes ago, Doucet-182 said:

 

Ok Transphobe Dante