EA joins Sony in call for inclusivity

[Zephrese]

^ I almost spat out my coffee, god bless you. ?

 

6 minutes ago, Doucet-182 said:

If someone started being mean to me, I don't think i'd suddenly stop supporting marginalized groups. But you do you!

 

Bruh, I don't agree with a lot of shit that they're spewing either, but relax. lmao

Edited May 26, 2022 by Zephrese

[Alos88]

[czDante92]

5 minutes ago, Doucet-182 said:

 

If someone started being mean to me, I don't think i'd suddenly stop supporting marginalized groups. But you do you!

You really are the definition of NPC meme. Well if you're going to ignore whatever I'll post then feel free to reply once more what an awful person I am and then there's nothing more to discuss.

[NewVegasNick]

2 minutes ago, Zephrese said:

^ I almost spat out my coffee, god bless you. 

 

 

Bruh, I don't agree with a lot of shit that they're spewing either, but relax. lmao

 

Yeah i got heated up for sure and need to chill.

 

It just fucks me up when we're in 2022 and we're still out here "debating" LGBT shit ?

[Sunny]

I'm just surprised this thread didn't get locked since it derailed beautifully and it has nothing to do with video games let alone trophies.

/thread

[Darling Baphomet]

11 hours ago, Rozalia1 said:

*Taps OP*

 

Before you post in this thread please remember that we owe it to each other and to PlayStation's millions of users to respect differences of opinion among everyone in our internal and external communities.

 

As for my OP. I always strive to maintain some level of neutrality outside my own comment if I make one and even then I usually try to minimise it, but I do not feel it correct to post these articles and not alert folks to brazen dishonesty like what I pointed out. I made no attack on their article's subject of attacking EA on siding against Abortion rights/stopping support for them in the company, but the anti-Trans thing which they themselves in their article contradict had to be pointed out so no one was tricked into believing the headline and beginning a tangent off it.

 

Yes, yes, we get it, you like your masturbatory right wing civility. Your OP isn't "neutral", it's just garbage. You link three articles, and do not bother so much as to summarize what they're about because you apparently think whining about the contents of said articles is more important than putting the smallest amount of effort into actually explaining what you're making a topic about.

 

But then, let's be honest - that is what this topic was intended to be about - you whining. The articles are just foreplay.

 

11 minutes ago, Doucet-182 said:

If someone started being mean to me, I don't think i'd suddenly stop supporting marginalized groups. But you do you!

 

Let's be honest, none of these people ever actually supported marginalized people. They just like saying they did so that they can revoke their imaginary support every time they decide to whip out the prejudice of the day.

Edited May 26, 2022 by Darling Baphomet

[Rozalia1]

I had hoped my exposing of the two news sources trying to use Trans to juice up their articles would have helped prevent people juicing their posts here with Trans. Both EA and Sony support Trans. They don't want their workers slitting their fellow workers throats over any possible disagreements they might have on that or other issues however.

 

I would caution those dominating the thread with posts on the matter, some perhaps purposely in search of a lock, that you will only hurt your cause doing that as people dislike such things. Though if a haha on the internet is more important then feel free to continue of course.

 

1 hour ago, Slava said:

I expected something very different after seeing this title. 

 

Well, I don't go to corporations and studios for this kind of statements. Their words and avatar changes on social media don't mean anything to me. But does that mean employees shouldn't be allowed to talk about these rights? It seems like the companies are afraid to lose money from potential boycotts or something, and that's the actual reason.

 

Having a war within the company between a split workforce who demands the other side get fired for being evil is bad for business yes. Workers are free to promote their beliefs outside the workplace. Is this outrageous?

 

59 minutes ago, boorish_brute said:

LGBTQ movement: please give us equal rights.

Reactionaries: This is mandated tolerance and forced diversity.

 

If you think that asking for equal rights is too far for you, I don't think these people were ever "allies".

 

His point was that pushing too hard will be met with a reaction which will hurt your cause. You should address that.

 

57 minutes ago, Doucet-182 said:

The funny part is that this whole thread is filled with apologists who "advocate for tolerance of a difference of opinion". A difference of opinion is fine when it's something like which colour your prefer. Not when it's about weather or not you think trans people should exist lmao

 

It's hilarious that for 40 years we get games made mostly by white men for white men. And the moment we see games being made by and for people outside of that group, there's this screeching whining about "keeping politics out of games". Bunch of absolute toddlers.

 

Both EA and Sony support Trans people.

 

For a long period of time Japanese game developers absolutely dominated gaming and even now are still very significant. Additionally, when has gaming ever pushed the politics of your opponents exactly? 

[Alayaes]

1 minute ago, Doucet-182 said:

 

Yeah i got heated up for sure and need to chill.

 

It just fucks me up when we're in 2022 and we're still out here "debating" LGBT shit ?

If you continue to think that nothing about LGBT is debatable, then it's no wonder why you get so worked up. There are thousands of issues within the LGBT spectrum in society that are worthy of mature discussion. Some more than others, I could agree, but it's not all black and white.

 

Questions open your mind. Statements close it. Allow people to ask questions and ask them yourself. Discuss multiple perspectives on multiple situations. I feel like part of your frustration lies in the fact that you've decided what's objective while others treat it as subjective, causing you to automatically defend what you deem "the truth" as if you're debating irrefutable facts like a globe-shaped Earth.

[Zephrese]

1 hour ago, Doucet-182 said:

It just fucks me up when we're in 2022 and we're still out here "debating" LGBT shit 

 

I just try to the best of my ability to ignore it because it's obviously going to upset me, hence why I didn't post here for a bit until getting a few good laughs in first.

 

There's nothing inherently wrong with you getting worked up or emotional over it since it's understandably a sensitive issue.

That said, I'd also suggest ignoring people who immediately - or very quickly - resort to passive-aggression or hostility as best as you can because they aren't worth it.

Edited May 26, 2022 by Zephrese

[DrBloodmoney]

2 minutes ago, Sunnyburrito said:

I'm just surprised this thread didn't get locked since it derailed beautifully and it has nothing to do with video games let alone trophies.

/thread

 

Ironically, I'd say this one is among the most civil this particular discussion has ever gone around these parts! 

[Alos88]

Just now, Rozalia1 said:

Both EA and Sony support Trans people.

Superficially, sure. But only in a way that costs them as little as possible, like pretty much all major companies.
Never assume a brand cares about anything more than your wallet.

[KimmysGotGame]

Friendly reminder that staying neutral in the face of oppression only favors the oppressor.

[temp-910724]

9 minutes ago, DrBloodmoney said:

 

 

This is also a game from 1982:

 

 

Would you care to educate me as to how it wasn't?

All the reviews for that are negative, if you Google 1982 games it doesn't even come up. If the argument is most games were made for white men why are we picking a game that was never popular. Now I suppose you could drag it out and start picking games throughout the generations, but I think at some point you have to realise this is not "most games".

 

Though I think you are smart enough to realise the person I replied to is arguing in mostly bad faith, or at the very least extremes spurred by emotions only. 

[Alos88]

1 minute ago, KimmysGotGame said:

Friendly reminder that staying neutral in the face of oppression only favors the oppressor.

 'If you aren't with me you're against me' is a mentality that often pushes fence-sitters onto the other side of the fence.

[Darling Baphomet]

3 minutes ago, Alos88 said:

 'If you aren't with me you're against me' is a mentality that often pushes fence-sitters onto the other side of the fence.

 

You're not a fence sitter, you just have delusions of decency.

[Alayaes]

4 minutes ago, KimmysGotGame said:

Friendly reminder that staying neutral in the face of oppression only favors the oppressor.

 

1 minute ago, Alos88 said:

 'If you aren't with me you're against me' is a mentality that often pushes fence-sitters onto the other side of the fence.

That quote is great, but it was in reference to Nazi Germany and the systematic brutal obliteration of entire subcultures during that regime. Equating that to some people not wanting videogames to address political issues is a bit of a reach.

 

You can be an ally to injustice without wanting to live and breathe that situation 24/7. Videogames and gaming in general used to be about escapism. These days it feels like you need an escape from video games and the videogame industry instead.

[Breakingthegreen]

 

1 minute ago, Alos88 said:

 'If you aren't with me you're against me' is a mentality that often pushes fence-sitters onto the other side of the fence.

I believe it's also an attitude unique to those who the system doesn't target, white people who didn't do anything during the civil rights movement often say these days that they feel guilt for the fact that they didn't help.

[czDante92]

2 minutes ago, KimmysGotGame said:

Friendly reminder that staying neutral in the face of oppression only favors the oppressor.

If government, media, corporations, Hollywood celebrities and major universities are supporting you, are you really oppressed? Or is Cletus, Prudence and Kyle the high school bully such a threat that everybody must unite under rainbow flag?
Go fight for the rights of Pakistani gays if you want to help the really oppressed people. Or maybe convince China that it's cool to be LGBT, see how that oppresion fight will go.

[Jeanolt]

8 minutes ago, KimmysGotGame said:

Friendly reminder that staying neutral in the face of oppression only favors the oppressor.

I couldn't say it better. Thank you kimmy?

[Alos88]

1 minute ago, Darling Baphomet said:

 

You're not a fence sitter, you just have delusions of decency.

Funny how fast you are to attack based on such little information. Again, you're making assumptions about others while asking others not to make assumptions of you. I don't expect you not to see the double standard, but I have no delusions of decency. 
I'm not special. I'm not better than you. We have- potentially- differing worldviews, and that's fine.

[madbuk]

1 minute ago, Alayaes said:

 

That quote is great, but it was in reference to Nazi Germany and the systematic brutal obliteration of entire subcultures during that regime. Equating that to some people not wanting videogames to address political issues is a bit of a reach.

 

You can be an ally to injustice without wanting to live and breathe that situation 24/7. Videogames and gaming in general used to be about escapism. These days it feels like you need an escape from video games and the videogame industry instead.

Videogames always have been and always will be political, this isn't a new thing. Pac-Man released in 1980, 42 years ago now, and has political themes, and I'm sure you could trace them back even further.

 

Just like books, movies, music, and art are political as well. A person's or group's views will always bleed into their creative work whether intentionally or not, because a lot of creativity is driven by beliefs.

[czDante92]

Just now, Alos88 said:

Funny how fast you are to attack based on such little information.

For such self-claimed "tolerant" people they're always fastest to attack other people if their world views don't 100% align.

[DrBloodmoney]

57 minutes ago, temp-910724 said:

All the reviews for that are negative, if you Google 1982 games it doesn't even come up. If the argument is most games were made for white men why are we picking a game that was never popular. Now I suppose you could drag it out and start picking games throughout the generations, but I think at some point you have to realise this is not "most games".

 

Though I think you are smart enough to realise the person I replied to is arguing in mostly bad faith, or at the very least extremes spurred by emotions only. 

 

Obviously that's an extreme example, played for laughs...

... but my point was that that game would never be created in a climate where anyone expected the audience of games to be anything but White (and Japanese) Men.

 

And while I'm not indifferent to the point you were making, I do think it's pretty ridiculous to suggest games 40 years ago were aimed at anything but men, since we know fine well that they made up such a massive block of the demographic at that point, as to render virtually all other demographics within that audience statistically obsolete.

 

I say that as one of them.

 

Whether you can identify specific elements of individual games from back then that were obviously aimed solely at while males is irrelevant - virtually the whole audience was white and male at that point, and so by definition all games were aimed at white and asian men, whether that's obvious from the content or not.

 

The point isn't that that was bad - industries have to cater to their audience - but that status quo in terms of product manufacture actually outlasted its term as a commercial reality by quite some margin. There was a fairly long period of time where more and more other demographics were entering the market for games, but the industry simply wasn't acknowledging them, or catering to them in the mainstream - only around the fringes - and in the case of gay / transgender, the very extreme fringes.

 

It's the quick-snap back to reality as that bubble burst, and suddenly the whole commercial audience is getting a slice of the pie that seems to have given some of the old-guard whiplash. That whiplash is understandable to a certain extent - change can be jarring, even to those not particularly bigoted against the audience it caters to - but it also seems to have blinded them a little, and made them more hostile than they need to act, or should seem, (or probably even do actually feel).

 

Most still seem to fail to acknowledge that even now, the dominant playable character in videogames is the straight white male.

It just isn't the only playable character now.

Edited May 26, 2022 by DrBloodmoney

[Darling Baphomet]

Just now, Alos88 said:

I'm not better than you.

 

Finally, something we can agree on. I do not care whether or not you make assumptions about me. Most likely, you already have. If you believe marginalized people wanting the bare minimum of respect is enough to push the ~poor, innocent fence sitters~ into bigotry, that tells me more than I need to know about you.

 

4 minutes ago, Alayaes said:

You can be an ally to injustice without wanting to live and breathe that situation 24/7. Videogames and gaming in general used to be about escapism. These days it feels like you need an escape from video games and the videogame industry instead.

 

Okay but what is it you want to escape from? Other people's struggles?

 

Consider that the marginalized people you claim allyship towards not only do not get to take breaks from the injustice that permeates their lives, but on top of that they can't even find safety and representation in their escapism, and when they do ask for such they get accused of grooming children or whatever the fuck else.

[Alayaes]

Just now, madbuk said:

Videogames always have been and always will be political, this isn't a new thing. Pac-Man released in 1980, 42 years ago now, and has political themes, and I'm sure you could trace them back even further.

 

Just like books, movies, music, and art are political as well. A person's or group's views will always bleed into their creative work whether intentionally or not, because a lot of creativity is driven by beliefs.

What political themes does Pac-Man have? Perhaps I can agree that it has a political allegory? I don't recall Pac-Man reciting to me how to configure my moral compass, what side of history was objectively better than the other, nor were the developers tweeting me about what to stand for or believe in.