DLC 2 is hard are heck

[Laozuli]

4 hours ago, Xillynoc said:

Still working on the guide for all this with xTOTHORO...not encouraging that a lot of the strategy/advice I've seen is "find a better player to co-op with"  according to Tentativeuser, even the most optimal builds (like Laozuli's above) are basically one-shot by every monster you have to deal with after floor 21, regardless of strats like maintaining a constant Protect and Shell barrier combo, so it seems like it comes down to luck and/or skill...don't suppose anyone's found something more effective since? We do have a couple 100%ers already, so clearly it can be done.

 

I feel that glass builds are indeed the only option just because of the poor gear system in the game.

For example a level 300 helmet has 74 defense and when you bring it too 500 it still only has 74 defense. The only thing that increases are the skills on the helmet but you have to pick ones that do damage..... . The ninja skill will probably help to mitigate some hits but you still have to be careful because of its limited uses. 

 

I did saw that a sage build might be great for this as well as you can spam spells from afar but I don't know about the mp management? 

 

Luck is unfortunately a big factor in this dlc. For my gilgamesh rift I tried the 90 enemies gauntlet but failed miserably at 33 monsters, failed a few bosses until I got lucky with a single Kraken fight. The fight was on the ship so I could hide behind the big ship masts from it to pop more mp items and the ninja skill. 

Edited October 28, 2022 by Laozuli

[Dead_Matt]

7 hours ago, Laozuli said:

 

The first 5 to 10h are fun since you will just experiment with the classes and abilities but then the game just overstays its welcome. It feels like a low budget game due to the fact that there are limited levels and monster types. So you will be farming a lot of the same monsters over and over again.

 

If I compare it with Nioh again, I minded the grind way less in those two games since they have better mechanics, plenty of different enemies and is generally better balanced. In Stranger I just wanted to have the grind over asap. 

 

If it wasn't for the fancy steelbook it came with at launch, I would probably have skipped this game

 

 

Have to strongly disagree. The base game experience is fantastic all the way through. "Hard" is basically a similar difficulty as Nioh had out of the gate. No need for gimmicky builds here. 

 

The problems come in the higher challenges of the DLC and when going for 100%. The main bosses of the first DLC are also totally doable with just your knowledge of the combat system and decent equipment. Only missions at the highest mission level and a particular boss rush really need a gimmick build to make it through. 

 

The second DLC doesn't have selectable mission level for most of its content, meaning that sooner or later you will naturally reach a point where you hit a brick wall and need a well thought out build - which means grinding gear and resources. Luckily the gear system now allows you to customize every detail of each piece of equipment, so loot luck is mostly removed from the equation. 

But I'm not at that point yet and from what I've read here I take that even with a perfect build, you still need a lot of skill to make it through. Which is fine by me.

[MakoSOLIDER]

Poured all my resources into a half-decent build and got the trophies. It's not as hard as it initially seems. While the content is more challenging, the DLCs added new smithing options that make creating good builds much easier in comparison to what was there before and even a game like Nioh 2. The game just does a poor job explaining its systems.

Edit: Just noticed my typo in the title of this thread lol. I was very sleepy.

Edited November 1, 2022 by MakoSOLIDER

[MercureUnleashed]

How can you find it "hard" ? I mean... they added the "fusion" system which basically allow you to create the exact build you want ...
- Basic game : Farmed a lot to get full "abyssal set", a lot of RNG...
- First DLC :

• Added the dragon shop with powerfull items
• Reroll perks on every pieces of stuff, increasing affinity, etc...
• Fanthasma/ultima system
• Item Max lvl 300 -> 400
• Job Max lvl 100 -> 150

Everything was done to make the game easier than basic game. Beated the whole dlc with lvl300 stuff..

 

- Second DLC :

• Added new forge system to rely even less on RNG and more on theorycrafting
• Added eons and sealed items
• Added new affinity 600% perk which are OP af.
• Added phantasia perks V and above as regular drops (easier to get than before)
• Added the possibility to even craft your own jewels, which basically make gilgamesh a piece a cake if you fuse many of his accessory (+dmg to gilgamesh / -dmg from gilgamesh)
• Item Max lvl 400 -> 500
• Job Max lvl 150 -> 200
• Buffs from monsters in dark crystal room

Once more, everything was done to make the game easier than before and it's so easy become OP. Almost beated the whole dlc with lvl400 stuff..

 

If you struggle with the game, you should watch tutorial or think about your build and your skill, gilgamesh is a joke as long as you can guard and absorb his attacks.

Edited November 1, 2022 by MercureUnleashed

[Clavietka]

This guy are sick

[oYazmat]

6 hours ago, MercureUnleashed said:

How can you find it "hard" ? I mean... they added the "fusion" system which basically allow you to create the exact build you want ...
- Basic game : Farmed a lot to get full "abyssal set", a lot of RNG...
- First DLC :

• Added the dragon shop with powerfull items
• Reroll perks on every pieces of stuff, increasing affinity, etc...
• Fantasia system
• Max lvl 400

Everything was done to make the game easier than basic game. Beated the whole dlc with lvl300 stuff..

 

- Second DLC :

• Added new forge system to rely even less on RNG and more on theorycrafting
• Added eons and sealed items
• Added new affinity 600% perk which are OP af.
• Added phantasia perks V and above as regular drops (easier to get than before)
• Added the possibility to even craft your own jewels, which basically make gilgamesh a piece a cake if you fuse many of his accessory (+dmg to gilgamesh / -dmg from gilgamesh)
• Max lvl 500
• Buffs from monsters in dark crystal room

Once more, everything was done to make the game easier than before and it's so easy become OP. Almost beated the whole dlc with lvl400 stuff..

 

If you struggle with the game, you should watch tutorial or think about your build and your skill, gilgamesh is a joke as long as you can guard and absorb his attacks.

 

Day 1 it seemed Hard, especially for people like me that didn't grind neither the base game nor DLC 1. Now it just seems like another grind affair (Less grinding with the fusion now) to get an OP build (or the right accessories like you said)

Edited November 1, 2022 by oYazmat

[Tothoro]

The more you grind, the easier the DLC becomes. Realistically, a viable build (affinities, effects, equipment, classes) will take 10 hours or so from the time you unlock all of the crafting/customization systems. If you really want to put in 20 hours of repeating the same old missions I'm sure you could make something absolutely busted. But the gameplay loop with this DLC, especially the loop involved in grinding, isn't particularly engaging, rewarding, or enjoyable. I guess if you really like roguelites you might feel differently, but I've never personally been a fan of the "everything is RANDOM, isn't that FUN?" school of game design. 

 

Anyway, there are also so many systems in play that it can be overwhelming to wade through all of the options. In addition to the guide we've been writing I've typed up a doc explaining what the various systems do and how to go about grinding/crafting. We're making the last few passes at editing in the coming day(s) before submitting it to the guide team. I felt pretty helpless at the beginning of the DLC but it is pretty manageable, albeit time-consuming to complete. Hope it helps those of you still struggling.

[TheCed]

Yeah, this is overwhelming.

I usually go for 100% in my final Fantasy, but for this one I'm at a complete loss.

 

I'm trying to make a Summoner build, got 400 in Breaker and Dark Knight, 250 in sumonner, trying to get 400 in Berserker Dragoon and Knight but man, this is tedious.

I always die straight away when attempting the second DLC.

 

Of course, if there's someone who's nice enough to carry me for those trophies, I'd be very happy but I know it's not fun to carry someone.

[oYazmat]

21 hours ago, Tothoro said:

The more you grind, the easier the DLC becomes. Realistically, a viable build (affinities, effects, equipment, classes) will take 10 hours or so from the time you unlock all of the crafting/customization systems. If you really want to put in 20 hours of repeating the same old missions I'm sure you could make something absolutely busted. But the gameplay loop with this DLC, especially the loop involved in grinding, isn't particularly engaging, rewarding, or enjoyable. I guess if you really like roguelites you might feel differently, but I've never personally been a fan of the "everything is RANDOM, isn't that FUN?" school of game design. 

 

Anyway, there are also so many systems in play that it can be overwhelming to wade through all of the options. In addition to the guide we've been writing I've typed up a doc explaining what the various systems do and how to go about grinding/crafting. We're making the last few passes at editing in the coming day(s) before submitting it to the guide team. I felt pretty helpless at the beginning of the DLC but it is pretty manageable, albeit time-consuming to complete. Hope it helps those of you still struggling.

Looking forward to it!

 

I didn't start the DLC 2 yet (I might this Weekend) but am pretty sure the Summoner Build is enough for the Trophies. I just finished doing all DLC 1 missions at level 400 (with extra mode...) and started farming a few relics in the Stymied 400 before I start DLC 2 (using the Shin-Zantetsuken build which I could easily get with my 3 and lower star equipment, I am hitting the Malboro for 80K+, I also activated a few Dragon Challenges and still one shooting it with 50K damage and getting ~375 treasure each run).

 

I wish there was more information about the Fuse Mechanic (I heard it costs a lot of resources and there a multiple unlocks to get the full benefits but that's pretty much it)

[Tothoro]

3 hours ago, oYazmat said:

Looking forward to it!

 

I didn't start the DLC 2 yet (I might this Weekend) but am pretty sure the Summoner Build is enough for the Trophies. I just finished doing all DLC 1 missions at level 400 (with extra mode...) and started farming a few relics in the Stymied 400 before I start DLC 2 (using the Shin-Zantetsuken build which I could easily get with my 3 and lower star equipment, I am hitting the Malboro for 80K+, I also activated a few Dragon Challenges and still one shooting it with 50K damage and getting ~375 treasure each run).

 

I wish there was more information about the Fuse Mechanic (I heard it costs a lot of resources and there a multiple unlocks to get the full benefits but that's pretty much it)

The problem is that Extra Mode is disabled after floor 21 of the rift, and that represents a pretty massive spike in difficulty. You're not able to spam Shin-Zantetsuken freely without infinite MP, but Shin-Zantetsuken is still one of the better builds from what I've seen, and Warden one of the classes I recommended in the guide for that reason.

 

Fuse essentially lets you move effects or affinities from one weapon to another. You need to complete the Rift Labyrinth up to floor 21 to unlock all of the customization and leveling, so grinding before then will just result in inferior equipment most of the time. Moving affinities over costs crests and anima crystals, moving effects uses random items you get from dismantling other equipment (and occasionally anima crystals IIRC). It gives you a way to not rely on RNG for getting good equipment, but the costs can be a bit excessive. Crystals aren't that big of a deal since the dragon medal farming method from DLC1 still works, but crests are very slow (3-4 per minute) and moving over high affinity values can legitimately cost 200+.

 

I tried to go into much more detail in the build/craft guide and it's been submitted for review, so hopefully in the next day or so it will be live.

 

Edit: Guides are live now. Feel free to leave feedback here or on the guide comments if there are any questions/feedback.

Edited November 3, 2022 by Tothoro

[k1ttyloaf]

How do you get lvl 200 caps for jobs? I dont see any limit unlocks in main missions, is it only in the rift labyrinth of the dlc?

[Tothoro]

Once you exhaust the limit releases for a class on the world map, yes, the only way to get more for that class is via the arcanium chests in the labyrinth.

[Rebourne07]

28 minutes ago, Tothoro said:

Once you exhaust the limit releases for a class on the world map, yes, the only way to get more for that class is via the arcanium chests in the labyrinth.

What's the max level you can get a job without the rift?

[TheCed]

I managed to join a team and we finished Floor 30 but I couldn't complete the Tonberry quest. Gotta Start over but now I have a guide to help me so that's nice !

 

Question: I'm only missing 2 Blessings (Alexander and Leviathan) and the Tonberry sidequest.

 

Does Extra mode drop Arcanium Crystals ? If so, I should be able to cheese those trophies by staying on Floor 21 right ? It's just gonna take a tiny bit longer.

Edited November 4, 2022 by TheCed

[oYazmat]

14 hours ago, Rebourne07 said:

What's the max level you can get a job without the rift?

If you do all main missions in Bahamut 400 you should be able to unlock level 150 for all jobs (You don't need 400 but since you are doing it anyways why not get more Anima crystals & Rat tails! Old Liberator trick is enough, just watch out of the Malboro Boss, if he start casting Disperse get away from him)

[Tothoro]

21 hours ago, TheCed said:

I managed to join a team and we finished Floor 30 but I couldn't complete the Tonberry quest. Gotta Start over but now I have a guide to help me so that's nice !

 

Question: I'm only missing 2 Blessings (Alexander and Leviathan) and the Tonberry sidequest.

 

Does Extra mode drop Arcanium Crystals ? If so, I should be able to cheese those trophies by staying on Floor 21 right ? It's just gonna take a tiny bit longer.

 

Extra Mode drops arcanium items at a much, much lower rate than normal. I received one arcanium powder in my entire run from floor 1 to 21 on extra, no elixirs or crystals. It could take a tiny bit longer or it could take a lot longer, it's all luck.If you can play with someone who's not on Extra you can get better drops from doing so.