missing timestamp for over 4000k games

[TheYuriG]

2 hours ago, Ashande said:

Cheaters, of all stripes an in all venues, are just kind of disgusting to me

Sure, but cheating implies there is competition and rules that are being broken regarding that competition. If you take away the competition factor, is it still cheating?

 

Consider the following case 1: 100 meters sprint, a dude brings a car to the sprint and wins. Everyone gets mad, with reason.

Now consider case 2: the same dude brings a car to the race field, but there is no race happening, he still gets to the end faster than any "legitimate" runner would. Some people still get mad about it.

 

I know this is not a 1:1 comparison and that's beside the point, but do you understand why I consider people to be overreacting about this? Some people have fun/hobbies in different ways. Trophy hunting is only as meaningful as you make it to be, the same way that people get mad over bringing a car to a race field.

[NanaCheese94]

I respect the determination behind whatever it is they are doing. They just enjoy collecting stuff and looking at it in the nice layout this website has, which I can highly empathise with. I think there should be a way to yeet them from the leaderboards, but since they payed Premium they should stay on the Website or get a refund. It's not the users fault the option to ban from the leaderboards doesn't work with this case.

 

Anyways, I guess it's in the hands of Sly and whatever he decides is fine by me since its his website.

Edited October 31, 2022 by NanaCheese94

[Ashande]

23 minutes ago, TheYuriG said:

Sure, but cheating implies there is competition and rules that are being broken regarding that competition. If you take away the competition factor, is it still cheating?

 

Consider the following case 1: 100 meters sprint, a dude brings a car to the sprint and wins. Everyone gets mad, with reason.

Now consider case 2: the same dude brings a car to the race field, but there is no race happening, he still gets to the end faster than any "legitimate" runner would. Some people still get mad about it.

 

I know this is not a 1:1 comparison and that's beside the point, but do you understand why I consider people to be overreacting about this? Some people have fun/hobbies in different ways. Trophy hunting is only as meaningful as you make it to be, the same way that people get mad over bringing a car to a race field.

 

Taking away the competition factor does not change that one is still behaving in an unpleasant, disingenuous manner; it also doesn’t address that the action in this case may well be criminal (as I continue to doubt that the person in question legitimately owns or obtained the games involved.)

 

For your example cases, I largely agree with you… the issue is that, in this instance, our “case 2” individual has inserted himself into a community devoted to tracking such information, and even if they hadn’t, the information is being incorporated into statistics that impact legitimate users (on this site, intentionally or no, they’re throwing off rarity, point tallies and total achievers, as well as potentially impacting trophy hunters checking game lists for unobtainable Platinums; within Sony’s internal systems - that removal from the Leaderboards here will do nothing to solve - they’re screwing up the rarity at least and potentially other stats as well.) Their actions have impact, however small.

 

To create an example that is perhaps more in line with the alleged spirit of what this person is doing; if a collector of, I don’t know and it doesn’t matter, so let’s just say Funko Pops, has a ridiculous number of them and likes to show them off and subscribes to a website for showcasing your Funko collection (which I’m sure exists somewhere), but it is discovered - perhaps by the “collector’s” own admission - that all of them are stolen, counterfeit, or just Photoshopped into their pics, is acceptable? Is it a problem to call that person a dipstick and yeet them out of whatever collection communities they may be a part of?

 

And again, all of that is aside from the high likelihood that a sizable chunk of those trophies come from pirated games, and the suspicions that the “WR” at the end of their handle brings to mind.

[MoneyShotxox]

33 minutes ago, NanaCheese94 said:

I respect the determination behind whatever it is they are doing. They just enjoy collecting stuff and looking at it in the nice layout this website has, which I can highly empathise with. I think there should be a way to yeet them from the leaderboards, but since they payed Premium they should stay on the Website or get a refund. It's not the users fault the option to ban from the leaderboards doesn't work with this case.

 

Anyways, I guess it's in the hands of Sly and whatever he decides is fine by me since its his website.

Imagine if Sony had to refund every account they ban. That would be a lot of money 

[diskdocx]

6 hours ago, Smashero said:

1) AFAIK if profile is not appearing on LB its stats are also not included in "global" site stats, I am "almost" sure about that, but... ;).
 

2) Like in this case? https://psnprofiles.com/trophies/740-borderlands
DLC  (impossible to achieve) has ONE achiever (clearly hacked).

Achiever is off the LB / site (?) - stats are still there... But I guess they will readjust automatically overtime... It was like this i.e. with 
https://psnprofiles.com/trophies/4029-dragon-fin-soup
and
https://psnprofiles.com/100-club/1855-ninja-gaiden-σ2-plus

I thought that was why clearly hacked profiles were removed completely. I didn't think any hacked profiles were on the 'dirty' LB (I know it doesn't exist). @MMDE @B1rvine

do you know the answer - if a profile is removed from the LB, but not nuked, do their unlocked trophies count towards PSNP rarity calculations

[Walt the Dog]

6 hours ago, diskdocx said:

Isn’t the issue though, the way PSNP tracks it’s own percentages? Perhaps I’m wrong, but don’t accounts that are removed from LB still have their unlocked trophies count for PSNP trophy earners?

 

So if you left CFW’d profiles, even if not on the LB, all those impossible trophies will have earners, making them appear possible? (And majorly screwing up actual rarities even more)?

Profiles removed from the leaderboards don't have their trophies counted towards rarity, no. There was a glitch once upon a time where this wasn't the case, but it's been fixed for, AFAIK, at least a couple years now. More specifically, the glitch causing this issue was fixed ages ago and then the leftover "shadow achievers" that showed up in earlier games due to this glitch (mostly PS3 and Vita titles) were removed a couple years back.

 

The reason that this guy is impacting rarities despite not showing up on 100% Clubs is because his account is on the leaderboard, ergo the site sees it as legitimate for purposes of rarity calculations. The only reason he isn't showing up in 100% Clubs is that due to a lack of timestamp data for any of his trophies, the site has nothing to pull from to figure out his time to 100% or when he got the 100%.

Edited October 31, 2022 by Walt the Dog

[TheYuriG]

4 hours ago, Ashande said:

To create an example that is perhaps more in line with the alleged spirit of what this person is doing; if a collector of, I don’t know and it doesn’t matter, so let’s just say Funko Pops, has a ridiculous number of them and likes to show them off and subscribes to a website for showcasing your Funko collection (which I’m sure exists somewhere), but it is discovered - perhaps by the “collector’s” own admission - that all of them are stolen, counterfeit, or just Photoshopped into their pics, is acceptable? Is it a problem to call that person a dipstick and yeet them out of whatever collection communities they may be a part of?

I agree with you here.

 

4 hours ago, Ashande said:

And again, all of that is aside from the high likelihood that a sizable chunk of those trophies come from pirated games, and the suspicions that the “WR” at the end of their handle brings to mind.

I don't really have an issue with this point specifically.

 

Firstly, I assume the person is just copying the trophy lists, but not actually playing the game. They aren't enjoying the content that developers took years to make without paying them for their work. The way I see it, it's like this person was taking a xerox/photo of a piece of the content (when the content itself doesn't matter) and then pinning that on their refrigerator. Sure, they are unable to spread the word on how good your game is, but they also aren't stealing it as an actual pirated copy would.

 

Secondly, I don't see a trophy list worth's based on paying for it. In the same way, I don't condemn people for renting/lending games. The developer gets 0 money from those operations and the user pays a very reduced (or no) price to enjoy the experience, but I personally don't associate money with how much enjoyment you can get out of something / worth the trophy list entails, because that would imply that buying games on the release are far superior to buying on deep sales.

 

Apologies if I've somehow missed the point you were trying to make.

[Ashande]

3 hours ago, TheYuriG said:

[…]

Firstly, I assume the person is just copying the trophy lists, but not actually playing the game. They aren't enjoying the content that developers took years to make without paying them for their work. The way I see it, it's like this person was taking a xerox/photo of a piece of the content (when the content itself doesn't matter) and then pinning that on their refrigerator. Sure, they are unable to spread the word on how good your game is, but they also aren't stealing it as an actual pirated copy would.

 

Secondly, I don't see a trophy list worth's based on paying for it. In the same way, I don't condemn people for renting/lending games. The developer gets 0 money from those operations and the user pays a very reduced (or no) price to enjoy the experience, but I personally don't associate money with how much enjoyment you can get out of something / worth the trophy list entails, because that would imply that buying games on the release are far superior to buying on deep sales.

 

Apologies if I've somehow missed the point you were trying to make.

 

If it’s possible to edit one’s profile to add the games/trophies without having access in any way to the game itself, then my issues become “meh.” It’s still irritating, but devolves from irritation on any kind of moral or legal ground to eye-rolling at it just being stupid and pointless (unless and until the perpetrator tries to claim some form of reward or recognition that would rightfully belong to someone else, who did things properly, anyway.)

 

I’m not concerned about good or bad press, or what the developers did or didn’t get paid (as you point out, loaning someone a game or renting it are perfectly legitimate things, as is reselling it, that the developer/publisher gets no piece of the pie from.) I don’t consider a trophy more (or less) valuable based on how much someone paid for a game. My issue with that particular aspect is based on the simple fact that piracy is theft. Whether someone got enjoyment out of it, did anything meaningful with it, told someone else how great (or bad) it was or anything else, it’s thievery. Theft is a crime, and beyond legal definitions, is wrong (with potential exceptions regarding “greater good” when it is a matter of survival, but I think everyone would be on board with the idea that jacking a stack of games to make a pretty list is a far cry from anything relating to survival.) I don’t like thieves, and I especially don’t care for pirates, having been the victim of both on more than one occasion.

 

And apologies from me as well, if any of that comes out as hostile towards you; none is intended. I actually find your posts interesting and well thought out.

[GeorgieBeast]

On 29/10/2022 at 5:39 PM, TrophyWR said:

Mister grudger thank you for your reply and valuable input. I paid premium and it is not ideal to be fully removed as I still want to track my profile and have no interest in the leaderboard. Kindly remove yours following the same procedure you stated earlier if you are bothered by me. Looking forward on updates on my removal from the leaderboard. Regards.

Ha ha ha so hilarious. Did you think that paying for premium was going to be some kind of bribe or something? ...what a waste on your part.

 

Also, "track your profile". What? Track your clear and blatent loading up of completed trophy files? Really? That's not trophy hunting, and thats not what any of this is about. Its really sad actually when theres people out there uploading literally [tens of] thousands of trophies at once on a profile. They don't get any of the enjoyment and satisfaction of the chase or grind.

[sweeping-lamp3]

What does the WR mean?

 

 

[GeorgieBeast]

2 minutes ago, sweeping-lamp3 said:

What does the WR mean?

 

 

Willy's receding?? Lol

[Ziune]

4 minutes ago, sweeping-lamp3 said:

What does the WR mean?

 

 

My guess is World Record

[GeorgieBeast]

10 hours ago, TheYuriG said:

Sure, but cheating implies there is competition and rules that are being broken regarding that competition. If you take away the competition factor, is it still cheating?

 

Consider the following case 1: 100 meters sprint, a dude brings a car to the sprint and wins. Everyone gets mad, with reason.

Now consider case 2: the same dude brings a car to the race field, but there is no race happening, he still gets to the end faster than any "legitimate" runner would. Some people still get mad about it.

 

I know this is not a 1:1 comparison and that's beside the point, but do you understand why I consider people to be overreacting about this? Some people have fun/hobbies in different ways. Trophy hunting is only as meaningful as you make it to be, the same way that people get mad over bringing a car to a race field.

Dude that's a really poor example. You say take away the competition factor but you can't in this case because being on the leaderboards is exactly that; and here it's comparing apples to oranges. And the whole thing with a dude with a car turning up to a running race. Well. That'd just be like going out for a cruise on your own. Like having your own website with no one else on it. This isn't.

On 29/10/2022 at 11:12 AM, ChenZheCHN said:

Simply cheater.

 

https://psnprofiles.com/trophies/1919/

 

This game was released only in Japan and is an online game.

 

There is no way a US account could get any trophy in a legit way, let alone all their trophies are missing timestamps.

 

This is where CRT should do something.

I take it you dont have knowledge of 'region stacking' (for example)?

[Smashero]

1 hour ago, sweeping-lamp3 said:

What does the WR mean?

TrophyW**R*

[dieselmanchild]

1 hour ago, Ziune said:

My guess is World Record

Yeah most obvious guess would be World Record, which likely makes his claim that he is only interested in “tracking his trophy files” complete bs.

 

He is interested in waving around his tiny little e-peen just like all the rest of us. Too bad he’s gonna have to wave his little Willy elsewhere cuz nobody wants to see that shit on the leaderboard.

[totallycrushed]

4 hours ago, GeorgieBeast said:

I take it you dont have knowledge of 'region stacking' (for example)?

It's online only so Missing Timestamps shouldn't be happening. Also there is a few JP online games on PSN that are completely unplayable to people outside JP.

[GUDGER666]

I took this screenshot the day 2 accounts appeared at the top of the leaderboard, i can't confirm but that must be their other account. At a quick glance i can't see anything dodgy, but it must be a team account, playing 3-4 games at the same time looking at trophy logs. Never understood why team accounts are allowed, they should have their own leaderboard imo. 

[MilanYildirim]

Am l only one who enjoys seeing him breaking records? Lol. Chap deserves to stay on LB imo. Lb is broken beyond repair as it is anyway. He found a way no one else thought before and l am sure he spent more effort than those showelware bros.I hope he’ll take over 1st place soon so maybe some action will be taken to improve leaderboards ?

[amurnin100]

And this is the final nail in the coffin for the LB if Sly allows this kind of behaviour to stay.

 

Regardless if you agree with his preservation or not, having a mixture of easy plats and blatant auto popping above does not give legit gamers a platform to work their way up the rankings if they wish to do so if “quality” is more important over “quantity”.

 

Sly can’t fix Sony bringing out Shovelware but he can fix the above….

Edited November 1, 2022 by amurnin100

[cappone-ceraio]

2 hours ago, GUDGER666 said:

I took this screenshot the day 2 accounts appeared at the top of the leaderboard, i can't confirm but that must be their other account. At a quick glance i can't see anything dodgy, but it must be a team account, playing 3-4 games at the same time looking at trophy logs. Never understood why team accounts are allowed, they should have their own leaderboard imo. 

The 2nd account definitly look dodgy just look at the times between trophies in Guitar Hero Smash Hits and compare it to the ones from rasmoos' account and they are almost identical. I suspect he used CFW to edit timestamps.

 

https://psnprofiles.com/trophies/130-guitar-hero-smash-hits/iII_DiK--tator?order=date

 

https://psnprofiles.com/trophies/130-guitar-hero-smash-hits/rasmooos?order=date

[Smashero]

28 minutes ago, cappone-ceraio said:

The 2nd account definitly look dodgy just look at the times between trophies in Guitar Hero Smash Hits and compare it to the ones from rasmoos' account and they are almost identical. I suspect he used CFW to edit timestamps.

 

https://psnprofiles.com/trophies/130-guitar-hero-smash-hits/iII_DiK--tator?order=date

 

https://psnprofiles.com/trophies/130-guitar-hero-smash-hits/rasmooos?order=date

Nice find! Those lists are like CTRL+C -> CTRL+V:
-Trophy order - exactly the same,
-July 2009 -> May 2010 (day remained the same).

-Time -> there is always exactly 4h 0min 2secs difference between those lists.

One of them clearly cheated ;).

I found one more
@cappone-ceraio

https://psnprofiles.com/trophies/98-lost-planet-2/iII_DiK--tator?order=date
https://psnprofiles.com/trophies/98-lost-planet-2/Zooyork26?order=date

Intervals between trophies are exactly the same :D.

Edited November 1, 2022 by Smashero

[Bezenko]

Will be nice to have an account on top of the leaderboard that’s not just ezpz 99% 30 second games at least

[TheYuriG]

11 hours ago, Ashande said:

11 hours ago, Ashande said:

And apologies from me as well, if any of that comes out as hostile towards you; none is intended. I actually find your posts interesting and well thought out.

Nah, you are fine, I didn't take it badly at all, it was very civil of you imo.

9 hours ago, GeorgieBeast said:

9 hours ago, GeorgieBeast said:

You say take away the competition factor but you can't in this case because being on the leaderboards is exactly that

You missed the previous messages in that conversation, but the summary is that this person doesn't care about being on the leaderboards (hence removing the competition). Ashande and I were mostly talking about removing this person from the leaderboards vs. removing them from the website entirely.

 

Me on page 2:

Quote

Let's just hope the person can get themselves off the leaderboards peacefully so they can keep tracking their games unbothered.

 

[DrBloodmoney]

I gotta agree with @TheYuriG

 

It's an odd pastime for sure - and I can't claim to see the value myself - but as long as dude is removed from the LB tracking, I don't see why he's gotta get turfed out the whole site. 

I mean, he's flat out said he's not interested in being on the LB - the only reason he is currently is some kind of weird, no.2-pencil-anomaly in the site restrictions. 

 

 

If there is a snooker tournament going on, but in one of the corner tables, the kids are just messing around, rolling the balls into the pockets with their hands, and having fun without getting in anyone's way...

 

... of course you don't want their "scores" to be tallied on the tournament leaderboard...

 

...but you also don't need to scream "Cheater!" in their face, point at them, and throw them out into the street by the scruff of the neck ?

[Axeman_Phoenix]

Well.....the guy is steamrolling ps4 games at a baffling pace, 20k ultra rares and counting, the way he keeps updating his account he might get a ip ban no?
Anyway i am curious to see how far he will go......and if this thread catches fire

Edited November 1, 2022 by Axeman_Phoenix