How are people so good at trophy hunting/video games in general? Have they gotten good gradually or were they just born good?

[StraightVege 4,002]

Obviously, there's a genetic component to everything, but "born good" certainly wouldn't be an apt description in my case. 😅

 

I just happened to grow up in a family generally interested in video games, where we almost always had the latest consoles around, thus I became fascinated with them at a very young age—must've been around 4 years old. For the most part, I excitedly watched my older brothers play them, continually impressed by their skills, since I could barely progress beyond the first level of most games myself at the time. I would actually bang on my brother's bedroom door in the morning, begging him to play something on the Sega Master System or Atari for my amusement! They would basically always defeat me in fighting game versus modes and whatnot, as well.

 

However, the saying "practice makes perfect" turns out to be largely true, as I gradually came into my own in the PS1 era, finally capable of beating games unassisted by older relatives. Once I had a taste of accomplishment, it just snowballed from there, really; I was motivated to keep practicing, and later returned to retro titles which gave me trouble as a kid, to have my "revenge" on them. Amazing how much easier everything seemed through the lens of experience! Screw you, Ghosts 'n Goblins! All that said, long before achievement systems were invented, I was always the sort to persist through any torturous challenge to reach 100% completion, regardless of loving or hating the game in question. So, I'm sure my perfectionist personality type contributes quite a bit, too (at a cost to my mental health sometimes).

 

In short, I was "fortunate" enough to have a family life that fostered an interest in gaming, and an inclination toward honing my abilities with them. I would echo the sentiment that practice and perseverance are of highest importance in this endeavor. On somewhat of a tangent: over the years, I've had a number of people compliment my supposed gaming skills, and I never know exactly how to react. Part of me is grateful to hear it, of course, but the other half wonders "what if I had spent thousands of hours mastering a second language or a musical instrument, instead of a gamepad?" 😕

[Z1MZUM 2,247]

I'm pretty good at gaming since childhood, I'm not very good at following up platinum trophies though. I'm even better at pinball and once got banned from playing them in a bar

 

With that said I grew up gaming since the Atari so it's all practice and experience as opposed to born talent. I feel that conquering what I consider much harder games back in the day make newer games allot easier.

 

I finished Super Mario brothers on the NES using nothing but my toes once.

[VigilantCrow 1,043]

I suspect there's two main reasons why some trophy hunters are just good at games in general (you'd need a whole different conversation for genres like fighters, strategy, rhythm and other genres that require transferrable skill sets from real life).

 

First of course is experience with playing games. We have that saying about needing 10k hours to become an expert at something. By the time you get to 30, you've probably passed that milestone. Combine that with how games are easier these days as the industry caters to a broader audience and the people who have 10k hours will easily succeed with modern hunting. 

 

Second is the vast amount of resources you can find for games. If you can read/watch how an AI works you can consistently exploit it. I'd say most of the top hunters have good research skills to find those resources and exceptional patience to actually learn how to use those resources properly.

Edited November 15, 2022 by VigilantCrow

[Shikotei-kun 222]

On 11/12/2022 at 7:01 PM, j10527805323 said:

I would often use cheats or mods because it was singleplayer, and I was enjoying the game to the fullest by cheating rather than the satisfaction of overcoming the struggle.

[...]

However, having cheated in the past, I didn’t improve and got burned with having to play games the proper way.

Using cheats to make a game more fun is something probably a lot of us have done. Who hasn't used "howdoyouturnthison" or "bigdaddy" in Age of Empires? Or spawned vehicles in Grand Theft Auto: Vice City? Or used godmode, no-wall in Quake or Unreal Tournament? PC games were rife with built-in cheat codes, and later they got trainers (actual hacking tools).

Aim bots in MMOs, jump hacks in platformers.

What I'm trying to say, is that you had more fun than you otherwise would have had if you'd played "properly".

 

On 11/12/2022 at 9:48 PM, Whitelightnin683 said:

Surprised no one has mentioned the use of guides and whether this strictly voids the skill aspect of obtaining trophies.

Guides for collectibles, hard-to-find pathways, secret locations, or just plain ol' confusing triggers have helped my ass get plenty of that satisfying *ding*.

Games like the Deponia series have a lot of missable and obscure trophy requirements that -without a guide- are almost guaranteed to be missed.

I wouldn't say this voids the skill aspect. At least, not for the trophies I've been using them: exploration clean-up and mindfulness towards missables. Sure, there's some loss of requirements by knowing there's a lever in the boss-room that does massive damage. Guides make things easier, yes, but you still have to do the thing.

Games like Erica barely require any skill, yet the trophies have such vague descriptions it's hard to obtain them without knowing what to even do. Not to mention they only pop at the end of a playthrough!

 

 

On 11/13/2022 at 9:48 AM, Silver-I-Chariot said:

Being "good" at trophy hunting doesn't have anything to do with skill, it's all about patience and perseverance.

Patience and perseverance eventually build skill. It's not true to say that hunting doesn't require skill. It does. And if one lacks it, they can either accept and let it be, or train/practice until they succeed. This can either be getting that one race down to a T, figure out how to beat that one boss, the "right" pattern to avoid getting killed in bullet hell games... anything really. It all requires skill.

Along with the above two traits, I'd add "knowledge" to what makes trophy hunting easier. Some mentioned Dark Souls, and Crypt of the Necrodancer. These may be notoriously difficult, but can be overcome with an investment of time (quite a bit of it) to:

- build up motor skills (muscle memory, button layout and purposes) to be able to respond to threats and issues faster and without thinking

- knowledge about the game, enemies, areas, tile effects, weapon feasibility and movesets

- experience in combat, traversing the realm, and gain confidence

Knowing how to beat a certain enemy, and having done it multiple times reduces that enemy to a mere nuisance or a stepping stone to the next encounter. At first it'll be a challenge, a fight to figure out the best way to tackle it, followed by defeat or victory. After a while it'll be "ah, this guy" followed by victory.

 

On 11/15/2022 at 5:51 AM, StraightVege said:

Screw you, Ghosts 'n Goblins!

Amen to that! I could barely get out of the graveyard the first fifty times. It took a RetroPie with quicksave (I know, I know) to even beat it. I must've failed hundreds of times, spending more than a month's wages if I had played it in an arcade. The tiniest mistake can cost you dearly. And you gotta do it twice

 

On 11/15/2022 at 5:51 AM, StraightVege said:

[...] the other half wonders "what if I had spent thousands of hours mastering a second language or a musical instrument, instead of a gamepad?"

I mastered a second language, have a solid grip on a third one, and learned a musical instrument or two (1 year for recorder and 7 years for piano). Lemme tell you that if you don't keep that up -with regular practice- you'll lose it all. I haven't actively practiced either in close to two decades; school required too much time. The flute I perhaps lost slower than the piano ('cause the latter is more complex).

When I got into Guitar Hero it probably killed off whatever skill was left in my left hand as the pinky plays higher notes than the thumb on a guitar, which is the exact opposite on a piano for the left hand.

Muscle memory can be such a pain.

 

21 hours ago, VigilantCrow said:

If you can read/watch how an AI works you can consistently exploit it

Finding out a game has an aggro-area (not a range) and that -by exiting it- the enemy instantly disengages (even if they're right in front of you) makes for a fun exploit. Knowing how to bait an easy-to-avoid attack and following it up with your own, how and when to parry, which element to use... things like that can make an encounter so much easier.

 

 

To add my own voice to the choir: yes, there are some elements to a person's character that have an influence on how "good" they can be at trophy hunting. The biggest aspects would be perseverance, flexibility, and analytical thinking.

- You'll fail more than once, but shouldn't give up that easily.

- The strategy you've been using for the last 4 hours could be unfit to use against the current problem, so you'll be needing something new.

- What exactly is the issue, how can you get past it, why does it do what it does?

 

Stubbornness doesn't really help, as it might lock you into a pattern that simply won't work: bringing a knife to a gunfight is a sure way to lose.

 

How I got "good" at games was perhaps by the sheer amount of time I spent playing them. First on keyboard the few times I could (playing stuff like Math Rescue), then on the world's heaviest console and eventually on PC again as I got older. Adding Duplo, Lego, K'nex, and Meccano to the mix of toys I had, my dexterity was under constant development (not to mention piano requires quite a bit too!) so that's sure to have helped.

 

[StraightVege 4,002]

On 11/16/2022 at 4:01 AM, Shikotei-kun said:

Amen to that! I could barely get out of the graveyard the first fifty times. It took a RetroPie with quicksave (I know, I know) to even beat it. I must've failed hundreds of times, spending more than a month's wages if I had played it in an arcade. The tiniest mistake can cost you dearly. And you gotta do it twice

 

Hey, ain't nothing wrong with that. Save states are fantastic for learning the most challenging sections of retro games. Even top level speedrunners practice that way. If memory serves, the original on console featured mid-level checkpoints and infinite continues, which is kinder than many games of that era, but having saves definitely improves the experience. Nowadays, I wouldn't want to play it any other way, honestly.

 

As a kid, I had the NES version, and only reached the second stage on about 1/10 attempts. After that, I would promptly die in the building filled with ogres who spit projectiles down at you. Upon revisiting it as an adult, I immediately made it to stage 3 without using a continue, which actually shocked me. I would imagine the arcade version is even tougher.

 

On 11/16/2022 at 4:01 AM, Shikotei-kun said:

I mastered a second language, have a solid grip on a third one, and learned a musical instrument or two (1 year for recorder and 7 years for piano). Lemme tell you that if you don't keep that up -with regular practice- you'll lose it all.

 

I'm sure. It's disheartening how much about the human condition is dependent on the "use it or lose it" principle. One really has only enough time and energy to specialize in a couple of pursuits. Had I went in a different direction, I probably would've chosen to learn the piano myself. I'm a fan of ragtime and Tom Brier, despite being a devout metalhead.

 

Your post was a great read, by the way.

[Alantor32 2,443]

Age, my friend. It takes age along with skill to be good at gaming and trophy collecting.

[Sicho 702]

There is no such thing as talent. Everything can be learned with hard work, patience and a bit of obsession and dedication. It may come easier to some than others but that's a product of their environment, not "being born with it". ... unless you are born with brain issues that either enhance or diminish your mental capacities, of course ...

 

You learned to read and write at some point. Maybe you learned an instrument as well. You might have learned how to drive a car. You can also learn how to get good at a game, if you really WANT it. It depends on how important it is to you and how much you want to commit to it.

 

And there is this
https://www.newyorker.com/sports/sporting-scene/complexity-and-the-ten-thousand-hour-rule

Edited November 23, 2022 by Sicho

[j10527805323 3]

This slipped from my mind, but I'd like to properly thank you all that so many people were willing to share their perspective on some random stranger's thread.

 

Unfortunately, it seems like trophy hunting isn't my thing. I did the grass is greener thing with trophy hunters and people who I thought were gods at it, but these two quotes from the thread helped me open my eyes.

 

On 11/13/2022 at 9:54 PM, Winds-of-Neptune said:

I used to be able to handle hours of beat downs for a trophy/plat./100%  but now it isn't really worth the time when you realize just how short life is.  In the end we are fighting against ourselves in this quest for pixelated greatness.  It is somewhat like a gambling addiction.  Always chasing your losses and never satisfied with what you have.

 

On 11/14/2022 at 11:51 PM, StraightVege said:

Part of me is grateful to hear it, of course, but the other half wonders "what if I had spent thousands of hours mastering a second language or a musical instrument, instead of a gamepad?" 😕

 

After thinking about it, I've decided my hobbies should just be about enjoying myself instead of working to be the best. I do respect the people who do have the patience to carry on with challenging trophies or platinums, but I don't have the capacity for patience with trophy hunting on top of academics. Perhaps I'll build patience later on in life and come back to trophy hunting some day.

 

That being said, I think this would be a good thread to read for anyone who is starting trophy hunting and/or is feeling down because of how much others have accomplished.

[DEMON 3,247]

I don't platinum everything, I just go for plats in games I've really enjoyed but I'm also in no rush for it. But, you get better the more harder challenges you set for yourself. You have to keep trying with things, knowing when you're getting a bit overwhelmed and need to take a break and come back to the thing that is challenging you with a fresh mind later or the next day (how I dealt with Weiss in FFVII-R, I wasn't doing it the first day I tried, second day I done it within 3 attempts, using nothing different).

 

And I was brought into gaming when I was barely a toddler. Started off playing games like Sonic and Wonder Boy. Now at 32, I play a whole variety of games, but mostly enjoy JRPG (which I mostly have no issue in platinuming), fighting games (sometimes the challenge modes can prevent me platting them, depending what has to be done, I've just never been good at stringing together long combos as I have a bad memory in that regard), and MMORPG (currently not got the plat for XIV on the PS5 but if you look at all I have left it's basically crafting and gathering collectables, I've literally done all the hardest stuff besides the new Crit dungeon which isn't even required for the plat).

[Onivicious 22]

Yes, you’re born with it. When god made me he said “You’re going to have the best gaming chair”. Sorry bud, you just drew the short straw, no amount of practice or perseverance will ever raise you to my level.

 

Everyone knows trophy hunting-prowess is strictly based on genetic determinism, and any notions of things like “practice” are silly fantasies.

[Eevee_Everfree 73]

I learn by watching,  if I can see it be done then my fire is lit and I can push myself to match those impressive heights.

[blacklight-nero 418]

I don’t get how someone can be born good at gaming but anyway I’ve never thought I was particularly great at gaming I’ve never felt that I excelled in a game were I was amazing at not really, At best I end up being good enough to persevere not always but most of the time, For me that comes down to patience and that’s not something I excel at neither but getting older has helped mellow me out somewhat and my gaming experiences are better for it. 

Edited January 27 by blacklight-nero

[Annoyingtiger888 557]

A lot of people will say that you can be born with the skills needed to be a good gamer and a lot of people will disagree and say that anyone can learn the skills needed. Me? I think it's a bit of both. Some people are born with great reflexes, their minds can take in information quicker and they can learn the strategy needed to complete a game quicker.

 

I'm a terrible gamer. My reflexes are ass, I freeze up whenever I get into a boss fight or I'm surrounded by enemies, and it takes me AGES to learn and memorize anything. It sucks because I love gaming and I also enjoy trophy hunting, but if I focus on trying to keep up with those around me, I'll just be left depressed and covered in dust. I've learned to play games at my own pace. While I would LOVE to be able to play games like the Souls Born games and platinum everything I play, I know it won't happen. I'm content to just play games on the easiest difficulty and earn what trophies I can.

[DanteIshimura 20]

I would consider myself an average skilled gamer at best. No matter what profile I have been on, most of my completions came more from perseverance rather than having awesome gaming skills. 

 

But I will always say that because of the achievement/trophy system, it did indeed make me a better gamer. Gens before the 360/PS3 era I would have called myself a casual gamer.. if that. And even then I would mostly play easy modes just to see the endings or use cheats etc. Because you cannot do that these days and due to most games having a difficulty related requirements, I certainly upped my skills as well as got so much more out of games when the requirements are done right. 

Edited January 27 by DanteIshimura

[Dreakon13 2,808]

Gaming is basically two parts understanding the games mechanics, one part reflexes.  Soulsborne games always seemed terribly overwhelming to me but was surprised to see how reasonable or downright easy some of them got with just a bit of leveling, gearing and proper builds.  All stuff that takes more time and research than mental or physical gifts.  Sure you have these savants that beat the game in one run, naked and level 1... but for average to good gamers, it's more just a matter of sticking to it, dying a lot, and figuring out how to game the games, than it is about being excessively skilled.

Edited January 31 by Dreakon13

[starcrunch061 10,889]

I'll tell you what made trophy hunters great! Good old fashioned GUMPTION! There's nothing there a little elbow grease won't fix, so let's roll up our sleeves and..

...

...<snore>

[RustyBacon13 86]

On 11/13/2022 at 2:55 AM, DrBloodmoney said:

Some folks are true beasts at gaming for sure…

 

…but others just have the patience and the endurance to get smacked around by a game over and over and keep coming back for more.

 

That’s the camp I fall in - bad at games, good at patience😂

 

Like Rocky says:

“It ain’t about how hard you hit, it’s about how hard you can get hit and keep moving forward”

 

This sums up my gaming life so much 😀

 

Also, to the people that write guides on post videos on every solution you'd ever need, what a godsend man. I would never be able to get anything done if not for those 😝

[DanteIshimura 20]

Wildarms makes a good point. 

 

You can be good at a game, but you will never know how good you are until you actually compete. Speed and accuracy are what really terms someone being good at something is. Just like when you're at work. You may be good at doing you job in terms of getting your work done by the end of your shift, but are you better than the next guy? Perhaps they did all jobs and already started on the next days tasks. 

 

But you can still be a good silent single player gamer, but by giving yourself tasks from other gamers that you have seen. 

[Jelly Soup 1,990]

I don't know about the rest of these so called achievement hunters, but I was born with high factor motor control. I reached a hand out and slapped the doctor away, then birthed and cleaned myself. By one hour old I was completing the likes of Galaxian, Ghosts 'N Goblins - arcade & NES - and Dragon's Lair all at the same time. You're talking to a creature ordained by nature and blessed by Atheismo. A self programming TASbot with no wifi cap. An unnaturally reoccurring neural net processor woven into a super meat computer.

 

Why don't my achievement stats reflect my godlike abilities, you ask? The simple answer is I love this community. I wouldn't wish to discourage the peasants that scurry about, posting their ""accomplishments"". The detailed answer is my might is too much for the mortals here. Unleashing my full potential would shatter most of these minds of inferior make. Hakoom would switch from a 48 hour cycle to no concept of time. Roughdawg would congeal into a creature unto Inside. AJ would piddle artifacted pixels all over his 90s Spider-Man undies. Percy would smash his full bowl of Captain Crunch: Opps! All Trophies. Such is my love for this realm that I would rather contain my power than shame you all into a blobby puddle of I Have No Trophies, But I Must Unlock.








What was the question again?
Oh, right. Probably age and free time balance or something.

[Hitman_Spinksy1 551]

It's a combination of factors. 

 

1st. Is finding the genres you like. That way you're going to get better. You can't get good at racing games if you hate racing games and just playing them bores you. 

2nd Is perseverance. Like anything in life, the more you do it, the better you become. I've dropped games within minutes because I couldn't figure them out and felt they were too hard only to come back later and get the plat. I'm no better at Super Mario or Sonic as I was back when I was 9 but that's because I don't play them anymore and I find them still as challenging as I remember. 

3rd Age has a small factor but not at getting good. Like I said I'm no better at retros as I was as a child but the older you get the more you figure out what games you get enjoyment from and a game you're having fun playing feels a whole lot easier than a game you're just not that into. Also as you get older you're more focused I find as when I was younger I could never decide what to play, never gave anything a fair shot or decided to get good so I'd play a different game every time. 

 

Just think about how it is going back to a game you've put several hours into and how confused your brain is. You don't know the controls, what to do, where to go and it takes time to pick things up again and regain your skill. That's how most games work so it's best to focus on 1 game at a time so in the end you have the skills required to beat it 

 

[Barry_Berkman 2]

I'd say it's probably both. Me and a friend game about the same amount of time each week and started gaming around the same age. Base skill I'm probably higher, bar a few exceptions. I do push myself more on games though and play harder games to help improve my skill. He plays way more casually and we frequently play on the easiest setting. Time is definitely a huge factor though. I've given up on games I attempted a few years ago and then went back to them. Found them easier and even managed to beat them the second time around.

 

The Goldeneye/Perfect Dark speedrunner "Perfect Ace" is a good example of natural skill. Sure he's improved over time but he's always been exceptionally good at those games.

[Mellenthin 103]

Genetics always play a big part and helps immensely.

 

But I'm sure of that even you OP would become better at games after 30,000 hours or so under your belt.😉

[snorbromsen 1]

I never used to care for trophies at all, but once I felt the rush of accomplishing something cool or difficult in a videogame for the first time I was hooked. I have been hunting trophies on and off for a while now with my recent bursts lasting for about 6-12 months before taking a break around the same length. I used to be terrible at this stuff but have gotten way better at quickly understanding the intricasies of a games trophy list and how to achieve them in a fun way. Because my ultimate goal is still to have fun and sometimes feel challenged I do tend to skip over a lot of games that seem tedious or I simply don't like. Just keep at it and you'll get better overtime and figure out your preferred method of hunting and what you like doing.

 

Also, do consider trying out a variety of games and going out of your comfort zone. It can help you improve in so many ways and maybe you'll find way more stuff to like in this space!