Sony Reportedly taking steps to ban Shovelware

[Velvet]

Just now, Darling Baphomet said:

Bless

 

You picked a helluva day ok, let's go.

 

1 minute ago, Darling Baphomet said:

So what? My point was that if you're going to complain about people complaining, you'd better have a better argument than "people are allowed to do the things you're complaining about!" because people are allowed to complain about other people's actions as well. Being able to do something has no relation to its value or lack thereof.

 

My argument was people complaining about members responding in a thread, members who were on topic about said thread when the person I called out had nothing to add to the conversation (at that time, again, their most recent post was more on point). If you read their post, you would see that the only thing it added to the conversation was along the lines of "if you played these games, you have no say" which he later went into better detail with (again thank you). 

 

4 minutes ago, Darling Baphomet said:

You ridiculed that person for having supposedly faulty definitions of what an actual game is. So which is it? Are strokers actual games, or do they have no value outside of their trophy lists? Or, for a third choice, does your criteria for an actual game depend only on whether or not a game has a trophy list?

 

No, I didn't. I ridiculed them for thinking that their definition of an "actual" game was the only definition of an "actual" game. If you're going to argue with me, get it right. Idk who came up with the word strokers, but let it die. Are these games available on other platforms? yes. Do people still buy them? yes. And as I stated, I'm well aware people buy these games purely for trophies and that's neither my place nor worth my time to argue at this point. The entire post I made for this user was based purely on nothing to add to the conversation and purely bashing people for buying games, from a game store, whether or not anyone thinks they're real games, are purchased from a gaming store. It's not my place to define a game, it's not yours, and it's not anyone's. They're purchased from a gaming store, they were developed as a game, so by definition, like it or, they are games. 

 

I tapped a jar of Mayo for 15 minutes. I'm in no better wrong or right to have an opinion on what does or doesn't make these games. A lot of us have ezpz on our profiles, but who are we to say what should and shouldn't be allowed? The topic at hand is the Sony article that has since been confirmed and the conversation surrounding it. Those responding on the topic, good or bad, love it. Those here simply to bash profiles who "aided" in the "problem", nah. That's what I was calling out with their original post, nothing more, nothing less. 

 

I'm here if you want to try again. 

[Deadly_Ha_Ha]

13 minutes ago, Darling Baphomet said:

 

Bad lists =/= bad games. For instance, with the Ratalaika situation, many of them were good games, however the trophy lists in many cases didn't even require you to make much progress in the games to platinum which enabled trophy spammers. So even though many of the games were good, the trophy lists made them a net negative to the trophy hunting community.

He's not gonna get that. He felt accomplished with his attempt at a fun little witticism and isn't interested in actually getting the point of what I said which drove him to say what you're responding to 

[Jelly Soup]

15 minutes ago, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

He's not gonna get that. He felt accomplished with his attempt at a fun little witticism and isn't interested in actually getting the point of what I said which drove him to say what you're responding to 

 

I got if fine, thanks. I didn't feel the need to respond to you directly because:
1. Your point was mostly something I'd shrug and say 'ok, fair enough' to. Didn't feel like that was worth a post.

2. You're a passive aggressive little thing, further evidenced by this, and let me borrow your words, attempt at a fun little witticism here. The best way to deal with this kind of behavior is to not encourage it.

 

This has all turned into the typical shitshow these easy trophy threads always become before a lock. All over something we've only had slight confirmation of.

[Deadly_Ha_Ha]

3 minutes ago, Jelly Soup said:

 

I got if fine, thanks. I didn't feel the need to respond to you directly because:
1. Your point was mostly something I'd shrug and say 'ok, fair enough' to. Didn't feel like that was worth a post.

2. You're a passive aggressive little thing, further evidenced by this, and let me borrow your words, attempt at a fun little witticism here. The best way to deal with this kind of behavior is to not encourage it.

 

This has all turned into the typical shitshow these easy trophy threads always become before a lock. All over something we've only had slight confirmation of.

Right. You going in for a hit and run on what I said to that other dude was passive aggressive btw and the reason I even said that to Baphomet. You reap what you sow. If we're done then good, keep it pushing

[Velvet]

6 minutes ago, Jelly Soup said:

This has all turned into the typical shitshow these easy trophy threads always become before a lock. All over something we've only had slight confirmation of.

 

 

This will be my last post in this thread for the sake of the Mods because babes, but this isn't slight confirmation. It has been confirmed this is happening. It's not a rumor, it's in written. 

[AlphaLiquid-X]

1 hour ago, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

I don't know if the game is good or not, does it look like I played it? But I don't have to play it to know the trophy list was a fucking joke dude, get over yourself stop putting words in my mouth. 

 

Except the trophy list wasn't a "joke" and it requires actual effort to complete. Just because it doesn't pad playtime by forcing you to spend an extra ten to twenty hours grinding out weapon upgrades doesn't make it bad, and it's ridiculous to believe otherwise. 

[You]

Aww man, I missed my chance to post this at the 300th post, you guys are chatting way too quickly.

 

[Deadly_Ha_Ha]

4 minutes ago, AlphaLiquid-X said:

 

Except the trophy list wasn't a "joke" and it requires actual effort to complete. Just because it doesn't pad playtime by forcing you to spend an extra ten to twenty hours grinding out weapon upgrades doesn't make it bad, and it's ridiculous to believe otherwise. 

Here, look over this thread or don't I don't care, everything there is to say about the case of this game's list in the context of other R&C is in this thread:

 

 

 

[Boorish]

1 hour ago, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

This is a joke right? You think you can't tell a bad list when you see one? If the list has nothing to do with the quality of the game, then be consistent and allow it can be judged on its own, right?

Top tier shitposting.

[Toman85]

I have bought alot of them, but really I dont care what I spend money on, its my money in the end. To compare, ive spend alot more doobloons on digital items in multiplayergames with lootboxes, fifa points and so much more. 

But recently I have toned it down a bit, I was so much worse weeks ago.

But some of the answers dont belong here (eliteist answers), like you need atleast 1000 ultra rare trophies, they should remove all gamers that have bought them games.

If that happens, then a big chunk here are gonna get deleted.

If Sony devalue gamers with delete all trophies you have got on all those games, all people who bought the games, should'nt we all get refunds if that happens?

 

But yeah, the gameplay have made me hurt my whole arm of button smashing, that's for sure!

 

 

Edited November 23, 2022 by Toman85

[Jelly Soup]

18 minutes ago, Velvet said:

 

 

This will be my last post in this thread for the sake of the Mods because babes, but this isn't slight confirmation. It has been confirmed this is happening. It's not a rumor, it's in written. 

 

The thing is, there was a supposed copy posted a bunch of pages ago, two people saying that some devs have come forward saying this while neglecting to state which devs said what where and every article I can find is mirroring the same article from dex.exe, a literal who site, who only posted that it came from some anon and 'what do you think about that'. Meanwhile no dev studio I can find (please correct me if I'm wrong) has confirmed this beyond reposting the same article or posting they don't know what the fuck this is about.

 

I'm not saying it isn't happening, I'm saying hard confirmation is, at this point, nonexistent (again, please correct me if I'm wrong).

[Velvet]

1 minute ago, Jelly Soup said:

 

The thing is, there was a supposed copy posted a bunch of pages ago, two people saying that some devs have come forward saying this while neglecting to state which devs said what where and every article I can find is mirroring the same article from dex.exe, a literal who site, who only posted that it came from some anon and 'what do you think about that'. Meanwhile no dev studio I can find (please correct me if I'm wrong) has confirmed this beyond reposting the same article or posting they don't know what the fuck this is about.

 

I'm not saying it isn't happening, I'm saying hard confirmation is, at this point, nonexistent (again, please correct me if I'm wrong).

 

I take my last post comment to post because I get what you're saying. The issue is being "first". The reason the initial article was "anonymous" is that the policy isn't live yet so actively saying "I confirmed this!" can be frowned upon. I can confirm from... 6 sources that the contract is real and happening. I have asked for permission to post screenshots but due to Sony being mum, I honestly don't want to get anyone in trouble. Idk how to say that it's not my place nor worth my time to make these claims, but I trust my sources to keep my beer cold, and they always have and always will. There might be some in Discord that can better back this statement up, but as forums go, I can't post yet. I had every reason to not believe the story, then had every reason to hate that it was true. 

[You]

Just now, Velvet said:

 

I take my last post comment to post because I get what you're saying. The issue is being "first". The reason the initial article was "anonymous" is that the policy isn't live yet so actively saying "I confirmed this!" can be frowned upon. I can confirm from... 6 sources that the contract is real and happening. I have asked for permission to post screenshots but due to Sony being mum, I honestly don't want to get anyone in trouble. Idk how to say that it's not my place nor worth my time to make these claims, but I trust my sources to keep my beer cold, and they always have and always will. There might be some in Discord that can better back this statement up, but as forums go, I can't post yet. I had every reason to not believe the story, then had every reason to hate that it was true. 

 

Can you imagine if Sony delist all the shite released so far as well...

 

The meltdown on this site is going to immense, people who bought the games, people who can no longer buy the games, people who wanted too but now can't. People who want those games to have their points set to zero in the leaderboards. It's gonna wild!

 

I think it should be all or nothing, keep the shit flowing in like now at full speed, or complete remove all of these games from the store, delist the lot! If I have to put up with, and be happy with all the delistings of games on PS3, like Konami's scrolling beat-em-ups. Out Run, After Butners, Scott Pilgrim VS The World and all the hundreds of games that have had their servers shut over the years.

 

Yeah, if we have to put up with legit games vanishing from the store, we should absolutely have these games delisted, all of them.

Which of course, I think could quite possibly be the end of this website, or at least certainly the leaderboard aspect. The unfair advantage of everyone buying all this shit up till this point and had a head start, would be immense.

[AlphaLiquid-X]

2 hours ago, Darling Baphomet said:

 

I literally just said, in the post that you're replying to, that the problem is their ability to be used as trophy spam, not the games themselves.

 

My apologies, that was a misunderstanding on my part. 

 

57 minutes ago, Darling Baphomet said:

 

Bad lists =/= bad games. For instance, with the Ratalaika situation, many of them were good games, however the trophy lists in many cases didn't even require you to make much progress in the games to platinum which enabled trophy spammers. So even though many of the games were good, the trophy lists made them a net negative to the trophy hunting community.

 

I can agree with the sentiment that having a Platinum on a game that can be completed without even beating the game can be an issue. What I'm concerned about are games that don't fit the traditional mold being unfairly labeled as bad by the community because they aren't suitable for a "normal" trophy list. For example, the "My Name Is Mayo" series gets unfairly labeled as shovelware, but the series is specifically designed as one big running gag. But because of the way the game itself is designed the trophy list really couldn't be done any other way than it is now. 

 

And where do you draw the line? Should a visual novel like "Steins;Gate" or "428: Shibuya Scramble" be considered bad because players can just skip through all the dialogue and still get all the trophies? What about games by Telltale, where most of their games only required you to complete every chapter? Heck, what about Mosaic? It's trophy list basically boils down to pressing "X" to collect blips. Now, I'm not saying that there's *not* trophy spam. Stuff like "Stroke" games are definitely a problem. Same for games that have fifty different regions and autopop. But we need to make sure that we don't get those confused with games by Indie devs or that look to provide an experience that's different from the norm, because otherwise people risk missing out on interesting experiences. 

[Jelly Soup]

13 minutes ago, Velvet said:

 

I take my last post comment to post because I get what you're saying. The issue is being "first". The reason the initial article was "anonymous" is that the policy isn't live yet so actively saying "I confirmed this!" can be frowned upon. I can confirm from... 6 sources that the contract is real and happening. I have asked for permission to post screenshots but due to Sony being mum, I honestly don't want to get anyone in trouble. Idk how to say that it's not my place nor worth my time to make these claims, but I trust my sources to keep my beer cold, and they always have and always will. There might be some in Discord that can better back this statement up, but as forums go, I can't post yet. I had every reason to not believe the story, then had every reason to hate that it was true. 

 

I accept this explanation with a cautious nod.
Think this nod, but with a hint of sus:
 

[Velvet]

8 minutes ago, Jelly Soup said:

 

I accept this explanation with a cautious nod.
Think this nod, but with a hint of sus:
 

 

 

Breaking my post promise once again mostly because I love your name, I respect this, DM me on Discord. Don't ask how. Just do. 

[AlphaLiquid-X]

34 minutes ago, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

Here, look over this thread or don't I don't care, everything there is to say about the case of this game's list in the context of other R&C is in this thread:

 

 

 

 

I've already seen that thread, and it's just as stupid now as it was when it was posted. A list isn't bad just because it doesn't force you to play through on every difficulty or the hardest difficulty, or because it doesn't make you hunt down 2,400 fucking tchotchkes (*Cough* Spider-Man: Web of Shadows *Cough*). A trophy list shouldn't be busywork or force you to strip a game down to it bones like a ravenous piranha. 

[AJ_Radio]

I take a few days break from posting comments after one of my threads got removed after I purposely locked it... and I mostly miss out on this discussion. Even when I'm not stirring the pot and getting a bunch of people angry at me for stupid reasons, threads like this one still generate a lot of drama.

 

Maybe Sony is finally taking a good stance on this one. However, it's too little, too late.

 

The damage has been done and it's made people like Hakoom mostly step back on the trophy hunting hobby. Granted he is older these days, I see lots of grey hair on his head in contrast to the older days when he was a passionate dude with darkish hair, although I always had a little trouble understanding him from his accent. Roughdawg4 who was #1 on the leaderboards at the time of his dispute made a giant crybaby rant and his ban wasn't lifted.

Most shovelware I see makes the shitty Flash games on the 2000's look like Oscar nominated masterpieces in comparison. We're already at the point where a lot of games 20 years ago were more fun, complex and just plain atmospheric, even though these developers of the modern day have far more tools and power at their disposal. Creativity wise, they are as dumb as a dullard.

 

In conclusion, it feels good when I'm not the person that starts a giant shitshow because any thread like this one is bound to get the lock hammer infused on it, because nobody can really debate trophies anymore. That being said, I wouldn't engage with some of the left wing nutcases on this website as they often try to over complicate the issue and then use ad hominem when their narrative is challenged. Just some advice from someone who already has gotten a good dose of that.

 

If Sony had better quality control like they did in the PS3 and early PS4 days, we wouldn't have this mess we have today.

[Boorish]

21 minutes ago, AJ_Radio said:

I wouldn't engage with some of the left wing nutcases on this website as they often try to over complicate the issue and then use ad hominem when their narrative is challenged. Just some advice from someone who already has gotten a good dose of that.

Another contender for shitposting.

[Infected Elite]

Its good Sony is doing something but i still dont care. Leaderboards dont matter to me. Enjoying gaming in general matters. Ranking is just there to exist for me, and if some people wanted to spend money on shovelware, thats on them. 

 

Just now, boorish_brute said:

Another contender for shitposting.

oh we know he is. Always acting like he knows how everything works and ranting. You get a like.

[AJ_Radio]

3 minutes ago, boorish_brute said:

Another contender for shitposting.

 

Right, because at least a quarter of all the posts I read in this thread have been shitposting and insulting others. You are no different than the rest of them.

[Infected Elite]

Please don't let this thread get taken over by whiny AJ.

 

In other news, the shovelware games will eventually be on Vice TV series" Darkside of the Games". Can't wait for it!

[JeManquedHygiene]

Pages upon pages of people complaining that the leaderboards are already broken anyway. Which is true. Yet almost no one came up with the most obvious solution to this predicament. Something that's been asked and suggested many times over many years.

• Create a new (working) leaderboard based on rarity.
• Set it up as default. Keep the old one for the shovelware bois.
• All 98%+ rarity shovelware now worth next to 0 point.
• Profit.

[xBlackEye]

1 hour ago, enaysoft said:

The meltdown on this site is going to immense, people who bought the games, people who can no longer buy the games, people who wanted too but now can't. People who want those games to have their points set to zero in the leaderboards. It's gonna wild!

 

Online games that are already offline. For example, PlayStation Home.

You can't get those trophies anymore either, wouldn't it be the same scenario? 

Edited November 23, 2022 by xBlackEye

[AffectatiousDonk]

Excellent news once this goes through the value of my alt accounts will go through the roof. If I pair them with 1000 top rated I might even be able to make a play for twitter .......