Is it worth playing the DLC first?

[DamagingRob]

The DLC is the first game. And that is better than Madness Returns as far as fun goes

...What? Did you play it on PS3? To me, the controls were pretty stiff. I still enjoyed it, and think it's worth playing. But Madness Returns is the better game, mechanically speaking. And, in my opinion, much more fun to play. 

[XInactiveAccountX]

...What? Did you play it on PS3? To me, the controls were pretty stiff. I still enjoyed it, and think it's worth playing. But Madness Returns is the better game, mechanically speaking. And, in my opinion, much more fun to play. 

 

Played it on Xbox 360. To me, the new game is just prettier. Everything about the first game's mechanics heralds back to old platformers and it's just so much fun for me. And the style had its own touch of horror and charm.

 

But really, to each his own

[Baka_Marimo]

I just downloaded and installed the prequel but couldn't find it anywhere in the XMB. So I assumed it is only accesible if you have the main game. And since that is only 4,99 € on the store (from 16th March till 6th April) I bought that as well and am downloading it now

 

Edit: Yeah it also says in the store that you need to have the main game in order to play the prequel. If only I would read all the stuff I am downloading...

Edited March 16, 2016 by GTRP_Lancerlover

[yellowwindow7]

so I finished the horrible woods level ( dear god it tooks forever and keeps going on and on ) but I didn't get the trophy for finishing it :/

not only the first game had clunky controls and bad platforming, but also glitchy trophies too... at least for me >_<

EDIT: never mind, I got the trophy.

killing the boss and return to your original size isn't enough, you have to also pass the part with the little demons and ghosts to count as getting out of the woods.

Edited April 1, 2016 by yellowwindow7

[Edunstar84]

I just finished the DLC and have started the main game. I'm so happy to have it all behind me! Words really can't express how I feel: relief, joy - all bundled in 1.

I would definitely recommend playing this first. As many said its a prequel but also to get it out of the way. The controls are super bad, so much so that after every jump, almost every enemy kill you have to save. Also, you would want to enjoy and appreciate Madness Returns without the DLC hanging over your head.

[usrmd]

I just finished the DLC and have started the main game. I'm so happy to have it all behind me! Words really can't express how I feel: relief, joy - all bundled in 1.

I would definitely recommend playing this first. As many said its a prequel but also to get it out of the way. The controls are super bad, so much so that after every jump, almost every enemy kill you have to save. Also, you would want to enjoy and appreciate Madness Returns without the DLC hanging over your head.

 

really wish i had done this.. still no 100% for me

[Zeitgeist-9]

I played part of the first Alice, and in my console, after certain part of the story, the dlc saved date got corrupted, I couldn't end the dlc yet

[fraserwalkr]

the prequel is a decent game, but it's really dated and there a lot of unforgivable quirks to the controls. apart from handling like ass to begin with, did anyone else notice the controls would "stick" from time to time? like Alice wouldnt stop running in one direction even if you weren't doing anything - which usually meant running off a ledge to your demise. Another good one is she'd just keep firing a weapon which would deplete your "magic" gauge. Some of the level design is great but it really does feel like a chore at times. Once you sort of get used to it, I think they game really picks up around the Looking Glass / Chess section but it still requires a lot patience with the frustrating design choices.

[Edunstar84]

the prequel is a decent game, but it's really dated and there a lot of unforgivable quirks to the controls. apart from handling like ass to begin with, did anyone else notice the controls would "stick" from time to time? like Alice wouldnt stop running in one direction even if you weren't doing anything - which usually meant running off a ledge to your demise. Another good one is she'd just keep firing a weapon which would deplete your "magic" gauge. Some of the level design is great but it really does feel like a chore at times. Once you sort of get used to it, I think they game really picks up around the Looking Glass / Chess section but it still requires a lot patience with the frustrating design choices.

I had that happen to me during the last part of the DLC, especially during the part where I had to fight numerous cards around small bridges over lava. I'm so glad I'm finished with it. Now I just have to go back to the main game!

[Dragn_Whytefyre]

The controls are, well, horrid. Was the DLC originally a PSN game? Has the feel of one. A bad one. Got out of the first chapter and I'm still not sure which controls are which.

[Devil_Spooky]

2 hours ago, Dragn_Dolphin said:

The controls are, well, horrid. Was the DLC originally a PSN game? Has the feel of one. A bad one. Got out of the first chapter and I'm still not sure which controls are which.

 

No, it was a PC game and it was meant to be played with a mouse and keyboard, it wasn't built with controllers in mind.

[Dragn_Whytefyre]

On December 29, 2016 at 4:31 AM, Devil_Spooky said:

 

No, it was a PC game and it was meant to be played with a mouse and keyboard, it wasn't built with controllers in mind.

Aaaah. I see. Well now, that does explain a lot. Thanks.

[diskdocx]

I played the DLC first. It really didn't age well, and wasn't particularly enjoyable (IMO).

 

I'm playing the main game now - it is quite good, I overlooked it for quite a while. Glad I finally dug it out from the backlog.

 

That said, I don't think I would have missed anything or been lost at all by never playing the DLC.

 

Just my 2 cents

[Devil_Spooky]

3 hours ago, diskdocx said:

I played the DLC first. It really didn't age well, and wasn't particularly enjoyable (IMO).

 

I'm playing the main game now - it is quite good, I overlooked it for quite a while. Glad I finally dug it out from the backlog.

 

That said, I don't think I would have missed anything or been lost at all by never playing the DLC.

 

Just my 2 cents

 

Well, the first game is vastly superior to the sequel in every way, other than gameplay that is, and you get to know Alice a lot better in the first and that's really important if you care at all about that universe.

[NanaCheese94]

I think I'm super late to the party but i want to say a few things since I am currently playing the DLC:

I would suggest to play it before Madness Returns for the reason that you will be incredibly pampered after playing it. Madness Returns has super smooth controls and most importantly double/tripple-jump and a way to avoid damage. After playing it, you will feel even more frustrated when playing the DLC, because the jumping mechanic is so horribly broken and you WILL be hit by enemies.

 

I haven't beaten the Jabberwock yet, but regardless of that I suggest to use saves as much as possible. You can save at every point (even during boss fights etc), just watch out you don't save at a time when you're about to die.

Spoiler

During the Tweddle Dee and Tweedle Dum Level, there are certain areas where you have to jump over moving platforms, and an obnoxious room with ftons of flying demons and robots. Save scumming can help you there a lot but it can also doom you. Make sure to use two save slots for that area.

 

If you feel frustrated, you can rush certain areas. You don't have to kill all the enemies, just running by them will work most of the time. During Boss battles there will always be a way to get back life, so it is best to play it patiently and keep an eye out for live, as well as saving after every major blow.

[STK91]

Just finished the DLC. I think it's worth a playthrough but you'll need to start it with the right mindset. The major problem I had with the controls was the jumping button (it retains a bit of momentum upon landing and has a bit of cooldown), once you get accustomed to it, it really is not that bad. Being able to save anywhere really makes the experience way smoother and helps traversing the hardest parts.

Definitely play it before Madness Returns and on easy difficulty to minimize frustration and maximize the enjoyment of the sequel!
 

Edited February 17, 2018 by STK91

[Shakilrahman96]

Planning to get back into the main game once I'm back from a visit (don't have PS3 on me). But the DLC is definitely worth playing first. While I've only just completed chapter 1 of Madness Returns, there are a lot of references to the previous game which will sort of us float past you if you haven't completed the DLC (American McGee's Alice).
 

 

As people have mentioned, the controls are pretty dated but highly exaggerated. They're honestly not that bad. There are 2-3 sections of the game where they caused me trouble but it was easy to overcome. Saving any time anywhere was a  nice and handy feature.

Oh, and if the trophies don't pop straight away after you complete what is required in the trophy description, don't panic like I did. Just continue playing, they tend to pop when you leave the first area of the next level. Not entirely sure why but just don't panic.

Out of the Woods level is a piece of crap, hated it and it lasts forever but the game picks up nicely after it imo. Wouldn't recommend playing the game on any difficulty other than easy, no difficulty related trophies *phew* so unless you're a bit of a sadist, don't do it. 
Not to mention upon completion you really appreciate the smooth controls and nice combat style Madness Returns has to offer. The DLC isn't a bad game, no directions as to where to go next a lot of the time like most older gen. games but its not mind boggling difficult to figure it out either. 

TL;DR: DLC first...

[zeit86geist]

how long is the dlc? finished the first lvl and already fed up with this prequel!

[Copanele]

21 minutes ago, zeit86geist said:

how long is the dlc? finished the first lvl and already fed up with this prequel!

I do believe it takes around 10 hours to finish ( checked a site for some statistics and from what I remember although I played it on PC). Yes the controls on the console are abit iffy but nothing too bad I presume. 

 

I personally consider American McGee's Alice way better than Alice Madness Returns and a must play before the "main game" just because of the story and the soundtrack ,especially if you read Alice in Wonderland and Through the Looking Glass . Graphics are...well bloodier than in the sequel and controls can be manageable with some practice.

 

EDIT: Wow this is one old thread! Did not see the initial post date and I recently bought the games from UK store as well  

Edited March 19, 2019 by Copanele

[SkyMason]

I've almost finished the DLC, and oh boy this game has not aged well. Incredibly stiff controls, and despite the cool aesthetic, there is no defending how poor the level design is. The second half of the game is an absolute slog, and the boss fights (looking at you jabberwock) are mostly just tedious and annoying. The save mechanic is the only saving grace tbh, I would have long stopped bothering before the 100th insta-death platforming section without it. I'm all for playing old ass games, but this is definitely something I don't regret missing out on way back when.

[TheSkyIsTeal]

On 4/3/2014 at 2:08 PM, RickNU19 said:

If you want to understand the story play first the DLC, if not just start the game

You probably still won't understand the story but at least it's a fun game.

On 7/30/2016 at 1:29 PM, Fray32- said:

the prequel is a decent game, but it's really dated and there a lot of unforgivable quirks to the controls. apart from handling like ass to begin with, did anyone else notice the controls would "stick" from time to time? like Alice wouldnt stop running in one direction even if you weren't doing anything - which usually meant running off a ledge to your demise. Another good one is she'd just keep firing a weapon which would deplete your "magic" gauge. Some of the level design is great but it really does feel like a chore at times. Once you sort of get used to it, I think they game really picks up around the Looking Glass / Chess section but it still requires a lot patience with the frustrating design choices.

I had the same sticking issue but the firing did not happen to me. I had to replay half the game because I missed the Ice Wand and could not beat the Red King without it on Nightmare mode so I think might know where you're coming from with the frustrating design choices.

[Guardian_owl]

Ya, the jump mechanic is rather strange, but once you figure it out it is quite accurate. You have to unlearn all your video game instincts of running and jumping. Forward momentum does not affect the length of the jump that much, the angle of the camera is what determines the length of a jump. When you stand still for 2 seconds a pair of rotating footsteps appear in front of you. If you angle the camera down toward your feet, the footsteps move closer to you and if you angle the camera upward, the footsteps move away from you. When you press the jump button, after a slight delay you will jump and land where the rotating feet were visible. Unfortunately the rotating feet will only show up on fixed pieces of architecture. If it is an object with action like a flying book or a leaf on a pond, the rotating feet are not visible so you will have to estimate the location of the rotating feet based on past experience.

Edited November 2, 2019 by Guardian_owl

[maxstirner_2015]

I've only played the 1st level of the DLC, but have already noticed that the controls are heavy-duty. Really clunky and strange, plus the level design is really iffy which just makes things somewhat worse. I can't really say my first impressions were good, it seems to be a seriously dated game

[danbu__]

I finished this a few days ago and  oh boy, it was a hard piece of work.

While I absolutely adore the artdesign and the soundtrack, this game really doesn't play well.

 

I am pretty sure this is partly to blame on the fact that this is a port, because one can feel that this was built with keyboard and mouse controls in mind and not with a controller. But there are also other things that are everything but great.

Weird, clunky jump mechanics paired with many insta-death pits and lava pools. Respawning enemies, maze-like maps near the end of the game, a bad camera...there's more than enough wich makes this game experience kind of frustrating. Fortunately there's the possiblilty to save whenever you want. Without that I am not sure if I would have finished the game.

In the end I still am somehow gladthat I did and that I have seen all the cool locations and scenes this game has to offer, but I am pretty sure I will not ever play this again and I would hardly recommend this to anyone who is not in it for the 100% completion.

 

 

[LegendExeter]

If you are going to play both games and go for the 100%, then yes you should play the DLC first game in the series, first.  The reason for this is because it's horrible.  It's possibly, aside from old, old games like ET on Atari for example, it's possibly the worst game I've ever played.  Not even so much in difficulty either, it's just an amalgamation of shit.  It's a game I seen a decade ago on PC and thought it looked so cool and wanted to play it.  It's a game that many people want to forgive it's transgessions due to the source material and the unique and interesting twist that American McGee put on this game.  However it falls incredibly short.

 

The original game has decent graphics, an eerie soundtrack, and an interesting story and twist on the Alice in Wonderland story.  

 

Aside from that the game is littered with bugs, such as getting stuck in walls/corners which cause a death, missing jumps on certain stages will put you back at the beginning of the area while other stages you will die and have to reload your game.  Why the difference?  Why not just reload right at the area you were at all the time, it has no consistency.  Jumping as mentioned ad nasuem in this thread is horrendous, you get the hang of it and can kind of gauge how far she is going to jump about midway through your playthrough or in the neverending level that is the Woods.  You will find out through much struggle that it is hard to grab onto vines and when you do the O button has you work your way down the vine and Triangle has Alice go up.

 

The game is affected by slowdown at certain points, and utter confusion spots where Alice will either stop moving completely and you just have to wait for like 10 seconds until the game fixes itself or you die.  Other times, once against the Jabberwocky pt. 2 Alice just started running in circles of which I had to wait to die and never regained control.  The game has no type of tutorial throughout the game, or hey you found a new weapon why don't we show you how to use it.  

 

The first trouble you will run into will be the banshees because you won't know how to kill them, you won't even know that you can attack and throw your knife.  Yet throwing your weapon causes a delay in waiting for it to be retrieved back to you.  Square regular attack, Triangle is throw or Shoot with other weapons.  Once you find the Croquet Mallet that will be your primary weapon through the next several parts of the game.  The Ice Wand will become useful yet drains quite a bit of Essence when using, so you will be refilling a lot.  The Demon Dice is completely useless in the game, I never got the large demon that kicks butt and in fact I got a Demon once that tried and kept attacking me until I killed it.  The Jacks are your best weapon for the majority of the end game phase.  The Jabberwocky staff you will only use on the jabberwocky pt. 2, and the Queen of Hearts pt. 1, you should find the Blunderbuss during the pt. 2 fight with QoH so should use that in the end battle.

 

The thing that makes this game so horrible is that it is littered with what I call "death points".  Actually I just made that up, places where you can die in a game, or kill points.  It is so damn stupid.  All of this poisonous water or acid.  Even when the water is fine you can still drown and have really no good tell's that let you know when the hell that is going to happen aside from Alice just letting out bubbles.  There is a part where you have to swim through a fan that is broken in an underground tunnel, if you get hit by the blade, not damage...you're dead!  

 

As stated you will save alot not even so much out of difficulty yet out of annoyance of if you die you have to do all the jumps or platforming all over again.  I didn't save after every jump, I made sure I got some progress in between saves.  You will want to save at the start of a boss fight just so you don't have to keep hearing the speech or seeing the cut scene.

 

I hated the part where you ride the leaf in the Woods, and you had no clue how to navigate under the water if you fell off and how to fight the piranhas.  There is a part near the end, talking about death points here, where there are two steam pipes letting out steam randomly across a narrow ledge.  As well on this ledge are two large gears vertically in front of Alice, not parallel to the screen.  So you need to step in between the spokes and you can let it push you further, however the steam is going off and on so you have to time moving past the steam carefully.  First time the steam hit me.  The second time I got to the second gear and then started pushing back against the gear as I didn't want to get hit by the steam and incredibly it killed me...the gear.  The games reasoning was that somehow even though I could not have physically done it from Alice's height, the game presumed her legs were underneath the gear spoke and so it crushed me and killed me.  I just couldn't believe that programming was in there to do that.  It was so ridiculous.  The time I got past it, I simply let the gear spokes push Alice until the steam stopped and then ran forward.

 

The second Jabberwocky battle is a complete joke, of which he can annihalate you in 5 seconds or less.  It's completely random what he decides to do.  I seen a video of a guy use the darts twice and then just took him out with the J-wocky staff, yet it doesn't exactly work like that.  My best advice for fighting him, as soon as the battle starts, start charging that jabberwocky staff and shoot him, keep moving your R3 toggle to keep him targeted and if he starts breathing fire on you, stop....move away from him (TRY TO), grab a meta essence and then shoot him again.  The time I beat him I literally used my whole essence using the Jwock staff.  He fell to the ground, and then I used jacks until he died.  Hard as all hell.

 

Also you won't know how to use the Jwock staff and sometimes Alice can get hurt by her own weapon.  This is how, at the end of the Jwock staff attack it shoots a fireball that explodes, if youre target is near you, or if you shoot it at a wall, it will explode near you causing damage to you.  

 

I didn't use a guide for much of the game until I was near the Tweedle Dee/Dum section with the moving see-saw floors, the clock numbers in the sky, and the clocks in the odd childrens rooms.  I couldn't figure out how to get the door open, a quick google search solved that.  I won't spoil the hint if you want the challenge.

 

I did look up a Boss FAQ as I could not understand how to attack the Centipede, of which I read that for all of the rest of the bosses to.  Then nearing the end once I got to Labrynthine Revenge I couldn't take it anymore, and I was like...that's it I'm done with this lets get this over with.  From there on I followed a walkthrough of how to get through that and Machinations, which led me to Jabberwocky 2 who was complete hell.  Died about 30 times before winning...on EASY difficulty.  Then finished Battle Royale and Ascension without a guide, of course read how to beat the Queen and watched a video on it.  She was not that hard, took several hits in the first form, and 4 hits from the gun in the second form.

 

Overall, porting aside the game deserves no excuse.  It's a great concept, a cool twist on Alice and I've heard it's becoming a TV show now.  Alice in Wonderland has always been an intriguing series that could have so much more done with it as it's a very strange and interesting world of weirdness.  Yet it cannot save this title from being NOT FUN!  

 

My reaction when it was done was not a sense of accomplishment, yet a feeling of thank the Christ this is over!