Game of Thrones S7 Discussion *SPOILERS*

[MosesRockefeller]

8 minutes ago, Miles_Warren said:

Actually, thinking about it, but they did also kill off Olynna Tyrell. Ok, maybe not a major character but certainly one of the more popular characters in the show. Other than her and Littlefinger, the season really didn't kill off any other major characters. Sadly, this is what happens when the show strays away from the source material. If George R.R. Martin hadn't written the books in the first place, I imagine Ned Stark would still be alive and the Red Wedding would certainly have never happened. I also think that the final two books, Winds of Winter and Dream of Spring, will be completely different to the final three seasons of GoT with a few exceptions (Shireen getting sacrificed, R+L=J and Hodor's death actually making it to the books for example).

I said this episode. I think most of the finales have killed off more people. I realize S6 was higher than usual, but there they killed off Tommen, Margery, Loras Tyrell, Grand Maester Pycelle, Lancel Lannister, Kevan Lannister, Mace Tyrell, and Walder Frey. That's 8 major and semi-major characters. As much as I liked seeing Margery compete with Cersei, at least the ending shocked and made us think almost nobody was safe. Here we lost 1 major character; the plot armor has gotten ridiculous.

 

8 minutes ago, Miles_Warren said:

I didn't see it but I just looked it up. Andy Samberg is in it and he is golden in everything he does. Brooklyn 911 y'all. And yes, Jon Snow is just as dim witted as his character in that film.

You should check it out, Kit Harrington shows he can be really funny as a dimwit.

Edited August 29, 2017 by MosesRockefeller

[HaSoOoN-MHD]

They could have killed off a lot more people and it won't matter. You just know who's too important to die and who isn't - and that wasn't the way the show operated for its first four seasons. 

[Novemberian]

Well, I guess in a way they did kill three in this season if you count Viserion as well. But yeah, he is not really  ... "dead dead."

 

I'm just thinking that Rhaegar already had a son named Aegon with Elia in the books. So like. What is Jon's name going to be? Jaehaerys? Or is he going to be Aegon as well which would be stupid as hell. Kinda disappointed that Aegon ended up being his name in the show but oh well.

 

Anyhow, I liked the final episode. I expected a little more from the Rhaegar/Lyanna scene but whatever. I don't really understand why people are freaking about this Daenerys/Jon thing. Yes, it is incest but it was pretty obvious quite early on that they are going to end up together at some point. The TV series is based on a book series called "A Song of Ice and Fire." Though lately I've been thinking if it could refer just to Jon. Anyway, I loved it that Jamie left Cersei (finally) and Littlefinger is dead (finally).

[Macabro]

6 hours ago, Gibbo_0113 said:

 

Its looking like we may get "Winds of Winter" next year but there is no way A "Dream of Spring" will be out before the show ends.

What?

There's a another book after Winds of Winter? That's news to me.

Is this confirmed or just a rumor?

16 hours ago, sephiroth4424 said:

I think that Cersei was right to stay put and not fight the undead.By the time they reach King's Landing,she would be over 100 .Seriously, what's with the marching speed.Also i'd like to know how they planned to pass through the Wall,other than what we've seen.Because it would be stupid if they waited all along for someone to bring a dragon to them

My guess is that the whitewalkers would have had the dead climb over and open the gate from inside. Or have the giants break through. Just one giant almost broke through in the both the novel and the show and it's already been shown that the wall can be climbed. I don't know if the dead are smart enough to climb over and open the gate. I guess it depends on how much direct control the white walkers have over them, So I'm gonna go with having the dead giants break through. 

 

Edit: Not sure if there is a tunnel/gate under the wall on eastwatch by the sea though.

Edited August 29, 2017 by Macabro
Content

[Miles_Warren]

6 minutes ago, Macabro said:

What?

There's a another book after Winds of Winter? That's news to me.

Is this confirmed or just a rumor?

 

It is confirmed by the author himself. Go to wikipedia and read up on it.

 

12 minutes ago, novemberrx said:

I'm just thinking that Rhaegar already had a son named Aegon with Elia in the books. So like. What is Jon's name going to be? Jaehaerys? Or is he going to be Aegon as well which would be stupid as hell. Kinda disappointed that Aegon ended up being his name in the show but oh well.

 

Yup,which makes me think that they are just using Aegon's story in the books and combining it with Jon's story in the show. That would make Aegon Targaryn (in the book) the rightful heir to the Iron Throne.

[Macabro]

6 hours ago, Miles_Warren said:

I saw the episode yesterday and waited until now to comment. I think I needed time to process everything that happened...

 

I have no idea why people are grossed out by Jon and Dany doing it. They are both Targaryns - incest is their thing. The Lannisters doing each other is gross. Speaking of the Lannisters....

 

...the scene between Tyrion and Cersei cut rather early. As soon as Tyrion found out Cersei was pregnant the scene just ended. What happened between the two of them? Until then, Cersei was determined the Lannister forces would not march North to fight the Great War but then the next scene she just changed her mind. Ok, we know she only said she changed her mind to take advantage of the absence of Dany and Jon but still. Was there a secret agreement between Tyrion and Cersei regarding Cersei's baby. A few times this season, Tyrion has commented on the line of succession following Dany's death. And he did seem concerned when he was lurking outside the door when Jon and Dany were doing it. Is something going on there or am I reading too much into it?

 

Littlefinger's death was satisfying. I am sad to see such a great character leave the show but he had a brilliant exit. I was convinced Sansa was being manipulated by him and she was going to sentence Arya to death. When Sansa said the line "You are accused of treason.....Peter Baelish" I was like "Oh snap". The whole time Sansa and Arya were arguing I was thinking why the hell did Bran not step in and say something. He can see everything and is surely aware of Baelish's actions. He more or less hinted at it when Bran and Littlefinger had their meeting. It was nice to see the Stark children play the long con with Littlefinger and beat him at his own game. It was even nicer seeing Littlefinger beg for his life before Arya slit his throat. It was about time a major character was killed off this season. I could've sworn everybody was covered in plot armour.

 

Speaking of Bran...how the hell do his powers work? I thought that scene between Bran and Sam was poorly written. Can Bran only see things happening in the past if people tell him to look? That's a new development surely. I mean who told Bran to look at the conversation between Baelish and Varys when Littlefinger gave his "Chaos is a laddah" speech? Who told him to look at Jon's birth? Who told him to look at Arya murdering the Freys? According to Bran, he is aware of everything that has happened and is presently happening but that is clearly not the case. I'm just confused by that scene....Also, remember when Gilly revealed that Rhaegar had his marriage annulled and he married Lyanna Stark and Sam was clearly not paying attention to her. Well, it turns out he was paying attention after all. It seems Sam is more aware of events than Bran is.

 

It was nice to see Tyrion and Dany realise how thick in the skull Jon Snow really is. All he had to do was lie to Cersei but no...he couldn't even do that. And this guy is the rightful heir to the Iron Throne? It was so satisfying seeing Tyrion and Dany scold Jon for his stupidity. I still don't think Jon will sit the Iron Throne though. I have a feeling he will trip over his laces and fall down the stairs just before he reaches the Iron Throne.

 

Some final thoughts about the episode:

 

It was nice to see the Hound and Brienne talk about Arya. You could tell the Hound was proud of Arya when Brienne told him she is more than capable of taking care of herself.

 

Jaime leaving Cersei and (hopefully!) joing Tyrion in the North. Where does this leave Bronn though?

 

The Wall is gone. Holy shit! Did Tormund and Beric and all of the Night's Watch die off screen? Can't speak about the Night's Watch, but I have a sneaky suspicion Tormund and Beric managed to equip their plot armour just in time.

 

Cersei is buying the Golden Company? Will we be seeing elephants fighting dragons in the final season?

 

Theon is going after Euron to rescue Yara. A noble quest but I fear a futile one. Euron is on his way to bring the Golden Company across the Narrow Sea. I think that will happen and that Theon and Yara will meet their end. But the question is...will Euron meet his end too? Nobody says Euron has to make it across the sea with the army as well.

 

 

Tormund isn't going anywhere until he sexes up Brienne. The show runners are very afraid of the internet and the internet demands they be together. They're not about to snuff their comic relief either.

 

About Euron sailing the golden company over...I think Theon will catch up to Euron and raven Daenerys to send a dragon to end Euron's fleet before it reaches king's landing. Ravens a practically telephones now so that could take all of 30 minutes.

9 minutes ago, Miles_Warren said:

 

It is confirmed by the author himself. Go to wikipedia and read up on it.

 

 

Yup,which makes me think that they are just using Aegon's story in the books and combining it with Jon's story in the show. That would make Aegon Targaryn (in the book) the rightful heir to the Iron Throne.

Nice.

 

 I'll take your word for it.

 

I wouldn't be surprised if they merged jon and aegon. Like they did with coldhands and Benjen Stark.

Edited August 29, 2017 by Macabro
Spelling

[Avatar_Of_Battle]

6 hours ago, Miles_Warren said:

Speaking of Bran...how the hell do his powers work? I thought that scene between Bran and Sam was poorly written. Can Bran only see things happening in the past if people tell him to look? That's a new development surely. I mean who told Bran to look at the conversation between Baelish and Varys when Littlefinger gave his "Chaos is a laddah" speech? Who told him to look at Jon's birth? Who told him to look at Arya murdering the Freys? According to Bran, he is aware of everything that has happened and is presently happening but that is clearly not the case. I'm just confused by that scene....Also, remember when Gilly revealed that Rhaegar had his marriage annulled and he married Lyanna Stark and Sam was clearly not paying attention to her. Well, it turns out he was paying attention after all. It seems Sam is more aware of events than Bran is.

 

From what I saw, it seems like Bran has to actively look into a matter. (white eyes) Once he's onto a subject he can look into it at will and know whatever there is to know. He looked into his siblings and knew what he needed to. Looking into Jon's past could have meant that he missed the secret marriage ceremony since it dealt with those 2 characters and not Jon. (if that makes sense.) Baelish was in front of him at Winterfell, therefore Bran probably went into his past to discover things. 

 

I wonder if the ability works based off of the previous holder's knowledge. If something is not known to the "3 eyed raven" then maybe it can't see it until the subject is brought up? Once it is known then the knowledge is forever there and accessible by the next "3 eyed raven". That would give Bran a distinct advantage. He can travel whereas dude in a tree didn't do much travelling. (from what I remember at least)

[BG_painter]

3 hours ago, novemberrx said:

Well, I guess in a way they did kill three in this season if you count Viserion as well. But yeah, he is not really  ... "dead dead."

 

I'm just thinking that Rhaegar already had a son named Aegon with Elia in the books. So like. What is Jon's name going to be? Jaehaerys? Or is he going to be Aegon as well which would be stupid as hell. Kinda disappointed that Aegon ended up being his name in the show but oh well.

 

Anyhow, I liked the final episode. I expected a little more from the Rhaegar/Lyanna scene but whatever. I don't really understand why people are freaking about this Daenerys/Jon thing. Yes, it is incest but it was pretty obvious quite early on that they are going to end up together at some point. The TV series is based on a book series called "A Song of Ice and Fire." Though lately I've been thinking if it could refer just to Jon. Anyway, I loved it that Jamie left Cersei (finally) and Littlefinger is dead (finally).

Apparently they merged the 2 charcters. Aegon is the youngest baby Raegar had with the martell girl and it was killed by the mountain. In the series they merged the baby with Jon Snow baby.

 

2 hours ago, Macabro said:

What?

There's a another book after Winds of Winter? That's news to me.

Is this confirmed or just a rumor?

[Novemberian]

51 minutes ago, BG_painter said:

Apparently they merged the 2 charcters. Aegon is the youngest baby Raegar had with the martell girl and it was killed by the mountain. In the series they merged the baby with Jon Snow baby.

Really? Eh, I don't really like it but well, there are a lot of things they're doing in the show that I don't like haha. I can't remember for sure but I think Rhaegar's other children were never called by name. Oberyn talks about them to Tyrion but refers to them only as "nephew" and "niece" so I suppose they were free to use Aegon in the show as Jon's true name. 

 

Anyway, I really should re-watch the entire series now that this season is over, see if I can catch at least some of the foreshadowing. 

[MooseSketts]

10 hours ago, Miles_Warren said:

Speaking of Bran...how the hell do his powers work? I thought that scene between Bran and Sam was poorly written. Can Bran only see things happening in the past if people tell him to look? That's a new development surely. I mean who told Bran to look at the conversation between Baelish and Varys when Littlefinger gave his "Chaos is a laddah" speech? Who told him to look at Jon's birth? Who told him to look at Arya murdering the Freys? According to Bran, he is aware of everything that has happened and is presently happening but that is clearly not the case. I'm just confused by that scene....Also, remember when Gilly revealed that Rhaegar had his marriage annulled and he married Lyanna Stark and Sam was clearly not paying attention to her. Well, it turns out he was paying attention after all. It seems Sam is more aware of events than Bran is.

 

I wondered about this, too, and I could go on and on; however, I will leave it at this:  it seems this is just for that whole "surprise the audience" crap.

[Macabro]

1 hour ago, novemberrx said:

Really? Eh, I don't really like it but well, there are a lot of things they're doing in the show that I don't like haha. I can't remember for sure but I think Rhaegar's other children were never called by name. Oberyn talks about them to Tyrion but refers to them only as "nephew" and "niece" so I suppose they were free to use Aegon in the show as Jon's true name. 

 

Anyway, I really should re-watch the entire series now that this season is over, see if I can catch at least some of the foreshadowing. 

Yes. As I remember it, Varys pays somebody a trivial amount of gold and a bottle of choice wine for a replacement baby for the mountain to smash against the wall and they ship baby aegon to "Easteros" with one of Raeghar's buddies.

[StarFang7]

In case anyone was wondering here is how the cast feel about the union of ice and fire ?. I personally ship them, but now I think it won't end well. Jon has that incest bomb waiting for him at Winterfell.

 

 

<Obvious Spoilers>

 

Edited August 29, 2017 by StarFang7

[HaSoOoN-MHD]

Still SO annoyed about Benjen. They say the dead cannot pass and that they couldn't do anything with Benjen - but how did they get the wight over the wall? how did that wight attack Mormont in season 1?
 

Unbelievable waste of an interesting character.

 

[RedPage17]

20 hours ago, HaSoOoN-MHD said:

Still SO annoyed about Benjen. They say the dead cannot pass and that they couldn't do anything with Benjen - but how did they get the wight over the wall? how did that wight attack Mormont in season 1?
 

Unbelievable waste of an interesting character.

 

 

It really was a waste. I hope the books give us more of Benjen's story.

[Avatar_Of_Battle]

Brother showed me this. Laughed until I cried.

 

[HaSoOoN-MHD]

On 8/29/2017 at 10:13 PM, novemberrx said:

Really? Eh, I don't really like it but well, there are a lot of things they're doing in the show that I don't like haha. I can't remember for sure but I think Rhaegar's other children were never called by name. Oberyn talks about them to Tyrion but refers to them only as "nephew" and "niece" so I suppose they were free to use Aegon in the show as Jon's true name. 

 

Anyway, I really should re-watch the entire series now that this season is over, see if I can catch at least some of the foreshadowing. 

They did call them out by name. Season 3, Thoros and the Hound. Thoros says ''Prince Aegon''.

Edited August 31, 2017 by HaSoOoN-MHD

[BG_painter]

By the way something came to my mind yesterday: Do u guys think that now that Bran knows everything, Jaime is going to receive a punishment for what he did? Jaime is going to meet Tyrion and he will be in the north with queen Dany.

[Avatar_Of_Battle]

1 hour ago, BG_painter said:

By the way something came to my mind yesterday: Do u guys think that now that Bran knows everything, Jaime is going to receive a punishment for what he did? Jaime is going to meet Tyrion and he will be in the north with queen Dany.

 

Hmm. Depends on what Jaime can bring to the table if he goes that path.

Bran could keep quiet on the matter too. If for nothing else than to have a valuable ally on his side.

[Jack_D_Spade-]

1 hour ago, BG_painter said:

By the way something came to my mind yesterday: Do u guys think that now that Bran knows everything, Jaime is going to receive a punishment for what he did? Jaime is going to meet Tyrion and he will be in the north with queen Dany.

 

Without that push Bran couldn't become the Three-eyed Raven lol...

[MosesRockefeller]

14 minutes ago, Il_Doflamingo said:

 

Without that push Bran couldn't become the Three-eyed Raven lol...

True, and it's been a while since I saw S1, but didn't Bran see who pushed him? I thought he already knew?

[Jack_D_Spade-]

47 minutes ago, MosesRockefeller said:

True, and it's been a while since I saw S1, but didn't Bran see who pushed him? I thought he already knew?

 

He saw them but didn't remember... Now he can see all things so probably he knows that was Jaime who pushed him off the window back in season 1. Here's the thing tho: would Bran punish the "event" that made him the being he is now?

Edited August 31, 2017 by Il_Doflamingo

[BG_painter]

59 minutes ago, Il_Doflamingo said:

 

He saw them but didn't remember... Now he can see all things so probably he knows that was Jaime who pushed him off the window back in season 1. Here's the thing tho: would Bran punish the "event" that made him the being he is now?

it's a very complicated situation.. he'd better not let Arya know it for Jaime's sake lol.

[HaSoOoN-MHD]

arya is such a big mary sue i can't be bothered with her anymore.

[BG_painter]

4 hours ago, HaSoOoN-MHD said:

arya is such a big mary sue i can't be bothered with her anymore.

?

[CloudsInHead]

So here's the thing....

 

Big fan of GoT; read some additional lore books (actually had all the relevant information), but have only previewed the books so far (they're decent, but get bloated as the series goes on). I'd say I'm more knowledgeable about this universe than the majority, but I'm sure I'm missing some details.

 

Anyways, Littlefinger... the season finale death that was promised.

 

Was his death appropriate? Poetic? Ironic? Humiliating?

 

ABSOLUTLEY. He was admired for his cunning, political maneuvering, and underhanded dealings/alliances..... but he was a loathsome coward of a man who used woman (primarily) as tools of chaos. Perhaps the most misogynistic, pedophilic, creepy, and obsessed character on the show played perfectly by Aiden Giillen. Very happy he is dead 

 

/end explanation to people yelling "Littlefinger Apologist! Sexist!" lol

 

ISSUE:

 

The setup of his guilt.... everyone has heard about this "deleted scene that would explain everything" which is really stupid considering that scene could have replaced a dozen considering it's importance to explain things to show-only audience member... INSTEAD, the whole season we watched Arya and Sansa play US, the VIEWERS with all that "acted hostility."

 

Littlefinger is not supernatural and it's safe to say Arya's situational awareness is off the charts at this point (blind training)... he doesn't stay outside the with an ear on the door, he's not under the bed, he's not in the closet... so why all the theatrics? For who? It would be EXTRAORDINARILY simple to show Littlefinger and the audience this conflict from a more realistic, believable angle.

 

That was LFs whole strength. Knowing what was going on behind closed door (including people desires/wants/needs) without using anything supernatural and the ability to navigate his "chaos ladder." There's NO WAY Arya/Sansa were playing for LF in those scenes (logically).... the writers/directors made the ENTIRE setup ridiculous and corny (especially with such a perfect end to LF) by showing how LF would have any idea how deep the "conflict" was supposedly going.

 

The whole arguing and murderous glances, the Arya on trial fake out, the LACK OF ANY SCENE WITH BRAN WHERE HE MAY HAVE TOLD THEM EVERY SINGLE THING NEEDED TO KNOW IN THEIR UNIVERSE (lulz) and, of course, the whole "trial scene."

 

Another case of D+D thinking they did something clever and then forgetting a sinkhole like this; let me remind everyone:

 

Arya and Sansa were essentially just faking US out, as in almost talking to the viewer. Immersion annihilator and also corny AF. Guess they needed to really rush his death, huh?

 

TL;DR Version

 

The sendoff for LF was perfect, HOWEVER, the setup in the season and the way it was explained/shown/put together was literally amateurish given the huge immersion breaker explained above.

 

Did they really not understand that most people would realize that Arya/Sansa arguing in a room, by themselves, could look strange if it was all just for an unmentioned ruse later on?

 

Please, I beg someone, explain, why did they need to show PRIVATE interactions where LF could not use his CIA/NSA of Westeros skills? No bugs. No corny ear to the door BS.

 

Sansa and Arya tricked us.... didn't know it was that kind of show and it isn't.

Edited September 1, 2017 by The_Apex_Badger