Stargazer2600

R.I.P BioWare?

49 posts in this topic

4 hours ago, Sypher-KoS said:

EA has slowly been killing Bioware for years.  They've done this to other studios in the past like Westwood.  Westwood used to make the Command and Conquer series and Red Alert and was one of my favorite RTS developers back in the day.  Slowly and surely EA forced Westwood to release more and more inferior products until only the name remained and they were ultimately dissolved and the different people sent to work elsewhere within EA or just leaving.

 

Bioware is a shell of their former selves and has been for quite some time.  Anthem may be the final nail since it appears they are abandoning RPG's to make a Destiny like MMO.  They might have one last final gasp with Dragon Age 4 but after those two projects I wouldn't be surprised if they were dismantled like the other companies EA has buried and they start releasing garbage under the Bioware name until its no longer profitable.

 

I don't feel Andromeda alone is to blame for the downfall of Bioware but their days are numbered.

 

I'm glad to hear someone enjoy Red Alert as much as I did.

 

EA also killed off Maxis. The first Sims game was a masterpiece, so many options to explore which was definitely something to take note in the early 2000s. Simcity 4 was quite alright as well.

 

But then came The Sims 3 and Simcity 5. Both games, as far as I'm concerned, were disasters. Will Wright was one of the most innovative figures when it came to strategy building games. Depending on how well you managed your city, and whether you preferred an industrial metropolis or a small town, you can be overly successful or heavily in debt.

 

EA also played a large part in dumbing down the Dead Space series, particularly Dead Space 3. Mass Effect 3 didn't get all too good of reviews either, the initial ending was a huge letdown.

 

I understand all companies have to make money, but when you put everything aside just so you can earn a bigger chunk of cash to satisfy your shareholders, then we have a big problem.

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Bioware, I thought the awful ME2 and ME3 would have been their last hope. Dragon Age 3 was their comeback imo, I think allot of people didn't want MEA to begin with.

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4 hours ago, SkyMason said:

Think the OP's being a bit hyperbolic, but IMO Mass Effect Andromeda's biggest crime was just being incredibly dull. I'm trying to go through it but i have so little motivation. There's no payoff to anything, or at least none worth while.

 

I completely get how you feel. Never should I say that I'd rather be playing another game, yet I thought "I wish I was playing Persona 5 instead" multiple times in my playthrough.

 

I wouldn't worry about Bioware quite yet, OP. Say what you will about Inquisition but it sold well, it did well with critics, it even netted Game of the Year awards and that was their last game before Andromeda, so I'd say they're still okay for a while. I think that if Anthem is not amazing, then it's time to worry.

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4 hours ago, Spaz said:

 

I'm glad to hear someone enjoy Red Alert as much as I did.

 

EA also killed off Maxis. The first Sims game was a masterpiece, so many options to explore which was definitely something to take note in the early 2000s. Simcity 4 was quite alright as well.

 

But then came The Sims 3 and Simcity 5. Both games, as far as I'm concerned, were disasters. Will Wright was one of the most innovative figures when it came to strategy building games. Depending on how well you managed your city, and whether you preferred an industrial metropolis or a small town, you can be overly successful or heavily in debt.

 

EA also played a large part in dumbing down the Dead Space series, particularly Dead Space 3. Mass Effect 3 didn't get all too good of reviews either, the initial ending was a huge letdown.

 

I understand all companies have to make money, but when you put everything aside just so you can earn a bigger chunk of cash to satisfy your shareholders, then we have a big problem.

Casey Hudson was the sole reason for the terrible writing and ending in mass effect 3, due to the original writer for 1 and 2 retiring before 3 went into development, he wrote his own version and bypassed all of the other staff, mass effect 3 was originally supposed to be about the dark energy causing stars to die quickly, and now he's back with bioware to ruin things again. 

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1 hour ago, SnowxSakura said:

Casey Hudson was the sole reason for the terrible writing and ending in mass effect 3, due to the original writer for 1 and 2 retiring before 3 went into development, he wrote his own version and bypassed all of the other staff, mass effect 3 was originally supposed to be about the dark energy causing stars to die quickly, and now he's back with bioware to ruin things again. 

 

I haven't been aware of this before, but I'm on the "dislike Hudson train" now! After 180 hours of choises, we got a 5 min "cutscene" that was all the same and uninspiring. God job! Saw a comment about everyone getting mad for shepard dieing, haha.

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I don't understand why people are blaming EA for Andromeda. Sure they pressured Bioware for ME3 (the main reason why Hudson write the ending on his own with the result we all know), but this time Bioware had 5 years. 5 YEARS, that's more than twice the development time for ME2 or 3, and I don't think EA has a responsibility in MEA poor writing, poor animations, bugs and glitches etc. Bioware is to blame for hiring incompetent people after Hudson and others left (they hired a game designer that spent more time on twitter than working or a cosplayer as lead facial animator :facepalm:). So in the end maybe the return of Hudson is not such a bad thing. But yeah they shouldn't mess that Anthem new IP or else EA won't like it at all... 

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Is it really who the developer is?. Look at Mass Effect, A fantastic SciFi Rpg. Look at Mass Effect 2, A corridor shooter with little to no rpg elements. What about Dragon Age 2? For the love of god that was a shocker. I understand we all have different tastes, I also understand that BioWare are inconsistent.

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I don't think the facial animation alone is what gave Andromeda a bad reputation....

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4 hours ago, DF007gamer said:

Just give me Dragon Age 4 before Bioware dies

Dragon age and mass effect were the only great games of bioware so we will not miss much. lol

 

4 hours ago, FrenchDevil54 said:

I don't understand why people are blaming EA for Andromeda. Sure they pressured Bioware for ME3 (the main reason why Hudson write the ending on his own with the result we all know), but this time Bioware had 5 years. 5 YEARS, that's more than twice the development time for ME2 or 3, and I don't think EA has a responsibility in MEA poor writing, poor animations, bugs and glitches etc. Bioware is to blame for hiring incompetent people after Hudson and others left (they hired a game designer that spent more time on twitter than working or a cosplayer as lead facial animator :facepalm:). So in the end maybe the return of Hudson is not such a bad thing. But yeah they shouldn't mess that Anthem new IP or else EA won't like it at all... 


I love andromeda and i'm a human after all so don't put the blame on me :)
 

Spoiler

 


 

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My understanding is that the Bioware A-team that made Mass Effect wanted out of the IP and to move on to something new. So EA let them do what they wanted, which evidently was to make Anthem. But the Mass Effect franchise still had the potential to be a moneymaker, so EA gave that to Bioware's B-team in Montreal, which previously had mostly handled DLC. They were allowed to make Andromeda, but EA's attitude toward them and their project was basically "If it dies, it dies," because they already had a much bigger bet placed on Anthem.

 

Bioware Montreal spectacularly blew their one chance. Andromeda died; Mass Effect died; Bioware Montreal died. But Anthem was always going to have more to say about the future of Bioware as an independent creative force, because that's where all their best minds were committed. If Anthem turns out to be a winner, then Bioware rides again.

Edited by rdhight
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6 hours ago, SnowxSakura said:

Casey Hudson was the sole reason for the terrible writing and ending in mass effect 3, due to the original writer for 1 and 2 retiring before 3 went into development, he wrote his own version and bypassed all of the other staff, mass effect 3 was originally supposed to be about the dark energy causing stars to die quickly, and now he's back with bioware to ruin things again. 

 

This is a good point. A lot of setup for this potential scenario in Mass Effect 3 was left in Mass Effect 2 if you remember Veetor, Tali, Legion and many others all reference "dark energy". The writers name is Drew Karpyshyn and last I heard he was back at Bioware in some capacity, someone will correct me if I'm wrong on that.

 

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14 hours ago, Undead Wolf said:

 

You clearly don't know what you're talking about. It wasn't the fact that Shepard died at the end of ME3 that fans had it a problem with, it was how in the end, NONE of the choices you made actually mattered, and for a series like Mass Effect, that's pretty damn important. We got three different endings which basically came down to what colour filter do you want over the last cutscene; red, green, or blue? The ending was some deus ex machina bullshit. It made no sense, it introduced a whole lot of plot holes, and then we're told just to accept it. So yes, when a series as beloved as Mass Effect ends like that, the fans are bound to get upset. Oh, but sure, Shepard's death was the thing that caused people to be outraged, lol. 1f60f.png

as someone who only played and platted ME3... and heard about how long ass other ME stories are but sadly never got to try them.. i think there's an end for everything... i mean you don't expect a ME10 for example... holding on to a series which focuses on story just makes no sense, i never saw or played the latest ME so i'm not a person to judge... but i think their move to make another game which was supposed to relate with the original series was a good step, until it actually made no sense to the original series... i mean you don't expect Nathan Drake in Uncharted for example living in like 8 Uncharted games... that's why Naughty Dog made The Lost Legacy as a game (not a DLC) which hopefully seems to be focusing on Chloe and Nadine who are related to the Uncharted series...

 

and Also... that's why they're coming with a very awesome series which is TLOU Part II to avoid letting their Uncharted fanbase die from their community.

Edited by SniperEliteDido
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I personally think one of the problems with ME:A was actually the lack of Reapers. Now, hear me out. I know that Shepard's trilogy revolves around defeating the Reapers but Andromeda's story direction by having it not in the same galaxy could have lead to some involvement about the Reapers which could have made sense.

 

It's like having a Dragon Age game without darkspawn, it doesn't feel right, it feels like something key to the series is missing. I know they wanted to take the series in a new direction though so it wasn't too similar to Shepard's story but it just didn't feel like a Mass Effect game to me at all.

 

And of course, all the alien spieces have exactly the same face which was creepy as hell. Did they really think we wouldn't notice all the asari look like our ship's doctor apart from Pee Bee? I found it quite insulting that they thought they could get away with that. Even the first game had more variety in character models. It was just lazy, imo. 

 

Also Andromeda pretty much felt like DA:I with a science fiction skin.

 

I don't think Bioware will die any time soon but they've really stuck a knife in the Mass Effect series, which is infinitely saddening to me, since the original series before Andromeda are way up there as some of my favourite games.

 

 

Edited by LiaraLight
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46 minutes ago, LiaraLight said:

I personally think one of the problems with ME:A was actually the lack of Reapers. Now, hear me out. I know that Shepard's trilogy revolves around defeating the Reapers but Andromeda's story direction by having it not in the same galaxy could have lead to some involvement about the Reapers which could have made sense.

 

It's like having a Dragon Age game without darkspawn, it doesn't feel right, it feels like something key to the series is missing. I know they wanted to take the series in a new direction though so it wasn't too similar to Shepard's story but it just didn't feel like a Mass Effect game to me at all.

 

And of course, all the alien spieces have exactly the same face which was creepy as hell. Did they really think we wouldn't notice all the asari look like our ship's doctor apart from Pee Bee? I found it quite insulting that they thought they could get away with that. Even the first game had more variety in character models. It was just lazy, imo. 

 

Also Andromeda pretty much felt like DA:I with a science fiction skin.

 

I don't think Bioware will die any time soon but they've really stuck a knife in the Mass Effect series, which is infinitely saddening to me, since the original series before Andromeda are way up there as some of my favourite games.

 

 

I mean, Dragon Age II didn't have the dark spawn as a central focus and the game was wholly stronger for it. Neither did Inquisition, for that matter.

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4 hours ago, Rose Amicitia said:

Dragon age and mass effect were the only great games of bioware so we will not miss much. lol
 

  Reveal hidden contents

 


 

 

Oo! I guess you are a young gamer then, KOTOR and 2 was one of the best games ever and even their MMO version SWOTOR is great.

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19 hours ago, Undead Wolf said:

It wasn't the fact that Shepard died at the end of ME3 that fans had it a problem with, it was how in the end, NONE of the choices you made actually mattered, and for a series like Mass Effect, that's pretty damn important.

 

While I won't say that everyone felt this way, this certainly clarifies the situation for me.

 

Anyway, in regards to the thread, it's a convenient narrative to blame EA for the seeming death of Bioware, but I imagine there's plenty of blame to go around. I mean, we're talking about video game companies and developers. Even among business people (who aren't exactly the sharpest tacks to begin with), these guys are the dumbest of the dumb.

36 minutes ago, Morfea said:

 

Oo! I guess you are a young gamer then, KOTOR and 2 was one of the best games ever and even their MMO version SWOTOR is great.

 

Bioware didn't develop KOTOR 2. That was Obsidian.

Edited by starcrunch061
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2 hours ago, Morfea said:

 

Oo! I guess you are a young gamer then, KOTOR and 2 was one of the best games ever and even their MMO version SWOTOR is great.


What do you mean "young gamer"? Are you trying to insult me softly? Lol read the "about me" on my profile before saying nonsense things..

And KOTOR was not developed by bioware but rather by the obsidian / aspyr media partnership. 
And it's FAR from being the best game ever, neither from far nor near
 

1 hour ago, starcrunch061 said:

 

Bioware didn't develop KOTOR 2. That was Obsidian.

 
Remind me the other guy who had a discussion with me stating that konami was a resident evil developer :P 
 

Edited by Rose Amicitia
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5 hours ago, HaSoOoN-MHD said:

I mean, Dragon Age II didn't have the dark spawn as a central focus and the game was wholly stronger for it. Neither did Inquisition, for that matter.


I gotta say I don't think the lack of darkspawn helped DA II out. Killing the same pointless enemies around the same (few) areas wasn't nearly as interesting as fighting darkspawn, who had great lore behind them, in both Origins and Awakening. 
This is all opinion based of course so I understand that you felt differently.

Edit: @Rose Amicitia Resident Evil was too developed by Konami! Here he is right here, Mr. Shinji Konami. 😜
shinji2_9091.jpg

Edited by RVMcypress_grave
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10 minutes ago, RVMcypress_grave said:



Edit: @Rose Amicitia Resident Evil was too developed by Konami! Here he is right here, Mr. Shinji Konami. 1f61c.png
shinji2_9091.jpg



And here mr. Hideo Konami :D

491.jpg

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On 8/2/2017 at 7:57 AM, HaSoOoN-MHD said:

I mean, Dragon Age II didn't have the dark spawn as a central focus and the game was wholly stronger for it. Neither did Inquisition, for that matter.

 

In fact, I would say that Inquisition was at its weakest when the Darkspawn showed up. 

 

I really liked DA2, though I fully understand why many didn't. The recycled dungeons, houses, etc. really felt lazy. Why did every single race on Thedas decide to buy the same painting?

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On 8/2/2017 at 6:47 PM, starcrunch061 said:

 

Bioware didn't develop KOTOR 2. That was Obsidian.

 

My bad, sorry!

 

22 hours ago, Rose Amicitia said:


What do you mean "young gamer"? Are you trying to insult me softly? Lol read the "about me" on my profile before saying nonsense things..

And KOTOR was not developed by bioware but rather by the obsidian / aspyr media partnership. 
And it's FAR from being the best game ever, neither from far nor near
 

 
Remind me the other guy who had a discussion with me stating that konami was a resident evil developer :P 
 

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Star_Wars:_Knights_of_the_Old_Republic

Developer Bioware, though I was wrong as you and Starcrunch061 pointed out that KOTOR 2 was Obsidian that developed.

No, was not meant as an offence, sorry if it was taken that way. More that it felt like a "younger gamer", because it was their newer developments, even though I love them too. Haven't started Adromeda yet though.

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8 hours ago, starcrunch061 said:

 

In fact, I would say that Inquisition was at its weakest when the Darkspawn showed up. 

 

I really liked DA2, though I fully understand why many didn't. The recycled dungeons, houses, etc. really felt lazy. Why did every single race on Thedas decide to buy the same painting?

The central idea was so strong that I can overlook all of that. It's a very unique game in BioWare's catalogue.

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