Cassylvania

Cassylvania's Miserable Little Pile of Platinums

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12 hours ago, Cassylvania said:

Platinum #192 - Broken Age

https://i.psnprofiles.com/games/c5f1ee/trophies/1Laf72a5.png

 

 

One of the biggest problems with the genre over the years has been the obscurity of the puzzles. Remember: I grew up with the original King's Quest series. My usual strategy when it comes to point-and-clicks is to try using every item I have on every object I see. Sometimes the "solution" ends up being something utterly bizarre, that nobody but the writers would have considered. For the most part, I don't think that was the case here. Most puzzles can be solved by talking to yourself. If you don't know what I mean, just try stating the problem out loud. "I have to make this water more acidic. Where can I find something that contains acid?" Every time I did that, I instantly remembered something I came across not too long ago. The game reuses a lot of screens too, so you'll get to know every area fairly well.

 

I think a bigger problem is nobody has the patience to solve those puzzles anymore. At least not without getting frustrated and looking up a guide.

 

I had an uncle who is now in his late 60s buy Kings Quest V and Kings Quest VI on his own. Back then, because there was no real internet guides in those days, you pretty much had to rely on your own thinking and using whatever the manuals were saying. My sister and I got stuck on these games for pretty much forever. We gave up on the stupid desert section in Kings Quest V, and navigating the dungeon/catacombs in Kings Quest VI was a pain on its own.

 

Broken Age was just meh to me. The humor turned me off. The entire ship the boy was on was like having overly protective parents having to put safety tape on their kid because they wouldn't dare see him take any risks.

 

The crane mini game was stupid. Having that speedrun was just pointless. It's not a bad game if you're just casually playing without caring about trophies. Trophy wise it's just tedious.

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12 hours ago, det_gittes said:

Congrats on another plat and thanks for the recommendation, I even started this game a few years ago but completely forgot about it. Is the speedrunning trophy anything to worry about? Do you have to follow a guide while going for it or do you know the story well enough at this point that a guide is not required?

 

You have to beat the game in under 1 hour for the speedrun trophy, and it took me 55 minutes using a guide. You could do it without one, but there isn't a lot of leeway there. Fortunately, the timer does stop while the game is paused. The biggest time sinks are the knot and wire puzzles. Their solution varies from playthrough to playthrough, so you kinda want to create a backup save, figure them out, and then reload that save so you can solve them as quickly as possible.
 

After doing the Little Nightmares 1 hour speedrun (where a single death meant a game over), this was nothing.

 

6 hours ago, Spaz said:

I had an uncle who is now in his late 60s buy Kings Quest V and Kings Quest VI on his own. Back then, because there was no real internet guides in those days, you pretty much had to rely on your own thinking and using whatever the manuals were saying. My sister and I got stuck on these games for pretty much forever. We gave up on the stupid desert section in Kings Quest V, and navigating the dungeon/catacombs in Kings Quest VI was a pain on its own.

 

In my case, games like that were 6+ month long adventures. It seems ridiculous now, but back then I could only play video games during designated periods of time. It might only be like two hours every other week. You'd get to a map or screen where you couldn't advance, and you'd have the next two weeks to puzzle it over. The desert section in King's Quest V (and VII) was like that. Another one was the babysitter in The Adventures of Willy Beamish. There's one section where she (yeah, this is a spoiler -- I don't think anyone cares) turns into a bat and chases you around the house. For the life of me, I could not figure out what to do. I got the idea to suck up the babysitter using the vacuum cleaner in my sleep, and I was so excited to try it when I got to play the game again...only to find out that wasn't the right answer.

 

Years later, I know I was on the right track. You just had to find a mouse somewhere to use as bait.

 

It's funny, though, because the same thing happened to me with Broken Age. I got stuck at a part where Vella needed to convince somebody she was someone else using only her voice, and the idea came to me in my sleep to put the fish bowl over her head. That turned out to be completely wrong, but at least I was close.

 

I think that's why I loved puzzle games and point-and-clicks growing up. Even if you got stuck, you could still "play" the game in your head, trying to piece together what to do next. And if that didn't work, you'd have to find the one other person in town who owned the game or call Sierra directly for some tips. I remember my dad getting so mad one day (probably because he couldn't figure out what to do either) that he actually had them send us an entire guide for the game we were playing. I'm not talking an official guide. This was a step-by-step, 120+ page printout that they probably gave to their customer service reps to read off to customers who had questions about a particular section. This, of course, was back in the day where developers would actually respond to their fans.

 

I remember the part we were at too. It was also in Willy Beamish. There's one section where you get jumped by a gang of thugs and the only way to get by them is to make friends with a group of Asian tourists who turn out to be ninjas. Good times...

 

Come to think of it, that wasn't a very politically correct game.

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6 hours ago, Cassylvania said:

In my case, games like that were 6+ month long adventures. It seems ridiculous now, but back then I could only play video games during designated periods of time. It might only be like two hours every other week. You'd get to a map or screen where you couldn't advance, and you'd have the next two weeks to puzzle it over. The desert section in King's Quest V (and VII) was like that. Another one was the babysitter in The Adventures of Willy Beamish. There's one section where she (yeah, this is a spoiler -- I don't think anyone cares) turns into a bat and chases you around the house. For the life of me, I could not figure out what to do. I got the idea to suck up the babysitter using the vacuum cleaner in my sleep, and I was so excited to try it when I got to play the game again...only to find out that wasn't the right answer.

 

Years later, I know I was on the right track. You just had to find a mouse somewhere to use as bait.

 

It's funny, though, because the same thing happened to me with Broken Age. I got stuck at a part where Vella needed to convince somebody she was someone else using only her voice, and the idea came to me in my sleep to put the fish bowl over her head. That turned out to be completely wrong, but at least I was close.

 

I think that's why I loved puzzle games and point-and-clicks growing up. Even if you got stuck, you could still "play" the game in your head, trying to piece together what to do next. And if that didn't work, you'd have to find the one other person in town who owned the game or call Sierra directly for some tips. I remember my dad getting so mad one day (probably because he couldn't figure out what to do either) that he actually had them send us an entire guide for the game we were playing. I'm not talking an official guide. This was a step-by-step, 120+ page printout that they probably gave to their customer service reps to read off to customers who had questions about a particular section. This, of course, was back in the day where developers would actually respond to their fans.

 

I remember the part we were at too. It was also in Willy Beamish. There's one section where you get jumped by a gang of thugs and the only way to get by them is to make friends with a group of Asian tourists who turn out to be ninjas. Good times...

 

Come to think of it, that wasn't a very politically correct game.

 

My play time was very limited back then. Mostly it was my 38 year old sister playing those games. I didn’t pick up on them until later on. Both Kings Quest games caught my attention. Reason being is because they were a lot like Disney animated movies. 

 

There were other point and clicks, but it was so long ago I’ve completely forgotten what they were. 

 

I definitely appreciate what Tim Schafer wanted to do because like you probably, he has a fondness for the genre. Day of the Tentacle and Full Throttle were real fun, but Broken Age for how the trophies were set up left me a bad taste.

 

That knot puzzle is definitely a throwback to old school point and clicks. In fact a number of puzzles pretty much hark back to those old games. 

 

The modern point and click game is TellTale and Life is Strange. Easier, but a lot less original and innovative. 

 

What you said about developers speaking to their fans is definitely something you really don’t see anymore. Which is a shame. 

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28 minutes ago, Spaz said:

I definitely appreciate what Tim Schafer wanted to do because like you probably, he has a fondness for the genre. Day of the Tentacle and Full Throttle were real fun, but Broken Age for how the trophies were set up left me a bad taste.

 

The trophies in Broken Age are pretty bad for a point-and-click. Personally, I wouldn't have any trophy that is missable. I actually liked how older games kept "score" by having you lose points if you used hints. There was another game on the PS4 (maybe Grim Fandango?) that required you to beat the whole game without using hints for a trophy. I'm okay with that. Naturally, people will just cheat and look up the solutions online, but at least the option to play it honestly is there. It just undermines the legitimacy of puzzle-based platinums, which is unfortunate. I liked how The Witness handled this, by allowing you to look up the solution to every puzzle online, but punishing players who did so with a gauntlet at the end that required mastery over every major type of puzzle. I don't really know how you'd do this in a point-and-click, but RNG puzzles are a start, I guess...

 

You're probably right about interactive stories being the modern take on the genre. It's hard to say if that's because they appeal to a wider audience or because the internet has made it too hard to make good puzzles. If anything, I think it's that point-and-clicks have always been a flawed genre, and the gaming community has become a lot less accepting of that.

 

Anyway...

 

I've been thinking what I want my 2020 approach to video games to be, but looking over the games I've played this past year...you know, there isn't a lot I'd change. I didn't care for Hidden Agenda. Bubsy was obviously crap. The two Pic-a-P games were okay, but I think I'm done with Picross on the PS4. Mahjong is more or less the same. The Unfinished Swan, Plague Road, and Hue were all kinda meh...which makes me think I should research non-platinum games a little more. And I clearly had issues with Lara Croft's latest adventure, but I wasn't going to leave my collection incomplete. Other than that, though... I dunno. I kinda liked everything. Yeah, you could probably say some games left me a little underwhelmed, but I don't think there was anything that I was excited about that didn't at least make it feel like it was worth my while.

 

I might do an awards ceremony for the 2019 games. Maybe like a "best soundtrack" or "best story" or "most likely to make me vomit" (there are so many good candidates for that one). I think it'll be good to look back, because there really have been some solid titles this year. At least that I've played. I don't really do the whole buy-games-when-they-release thing.

 

What do you think? Best story, best music, most fun gameplay? Most annoying trophy? Worst female protagonist with a British accent? The possibilities are endless.

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That’s just how it is anymore. People today, especially some of the kids I work with and attend college with, are so impatient they freak out if they can’t use their phone every 10 minutes. Some of them do play video games, although mostly it’s sports games and Madden. 

 

I cannot possibly imagine them trying to play through an old point and click. They’d be turned off in a few minutes. Pretty crazy how we would spend weeks on trying to solve a puzzle. Nowadays people have so little patience they get frustrated rather quickly. I guess that’s why AAA games have to have pop up tutorials and them holding your hand. Which I don’t think is necessarily all that bad, but it just makes them more boring. 

 

Yeah that’s definitely the thing with The Witness. Seeing so many people try to Share Play that ‘Challenge’ trophy is a sign most of them can’t do puzzles, and giving up a hour or two in. 

 

I basically spent all of this year and a portion of last year reducing my backlog. I have games I haven’t added to my list yet but it makes me happier knowing I have 80 games instead of 110 - 120+ games like I did at one point. 

 

Hue was alright. It’s short and easy, but one puzzle that involved two platforms spilling paint took me well over a hour to solve. The others you mentioned I haven’t played, so I can’t comment. 

 

2019 was a bit lame for me to be honest. Sekiro, Resident Evil 2, Death Stranding, Devil May Cry V are the only big games I have an interest in. Days Gone may have seemed alright, but seeing it is yet another collectathon open world game with zombies is a huge turnoff. The challenges look like something. But I have too many games and too little time to be playing that at the moment. 

 

Wolfenstein: Youngblood definitely has the worst female protagonists for this year. Anthem I was going to skip anyway. The latest Ubisoft Tom Clancy game I hear is still a technical mess. 

 

*sigh*

Edited by Spaz
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5 hours ago, Cassylvania said:

Anyway...

 

I might do an awards ceremony for the 2019 games. Maybe like a "best soundtrack" or "best story" or "most likely to make me vomit" (there are so many good candidates for that one). I think it'll be good to look back, because there really have been some solid titles this year. At least that I've played. I don't really do the whole buy-games-when-they-release thing.

 

What do you think? Best story, best music, most fun gameplay? Most annoying trophy? Worst female protagonist with a British accent? The possibilities are endless.

 

I would definitely enjoy your awards ceremony :) I can't say that I'd have much to say, since I have played exactly one game that was released in 2019 😂 (Sekiro). I have a couple of games that were released towards the end of last year, but they obviously don't count... 

 

Regardless, would be great to see which games you enjoyed the most! 

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7 hours ago, Spaz said:

I guess that’s why AAA games have to have pop up tutorials and them holding your hand. Which I don’t think is necessarily all that bad, but it just makes them more boring.

 

No, it's the fallacy that not including a detailed handbook for everything one needs to know like they used to do in the days of yore is the reason why games need to have tutorials. Whatever the saved cost on a booklet is, surely it cannot match the effort programmers have to make to program introductory levels for the tutorial(s).

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Sorry to interrupt the awards ceremony, but I have an announcement to make!

 

Platinum #193 - Frost

https://i.psnprofiles.com/games/aa7ec9/trophies/1L1645ac.png

 

Where do you find these games?

 

That image tells you everything you need to know about this game. But since "Frost' is generic enough to be the title of a Disney movie, let me propose an alternate name: how about The Long Dark: The Card Game: The Fuck You Edition? Yes, if you thought The Long D bent you over backwards, wait until Frost puts your head between your legs. What I thought was going to be a short and easy platinum turned out to be a hair-pulling experience, as everything in this game wants you dead. Seriously. Just look at this screen.

 

Image result for frost ps4 game

 

I won't try to explain what all that means. The game actually has an excellent tutorial and gradually eases you into the game. But just know that everything on that screen is gunning for you. The Frost? Yeah, you're dead if it reaches zero. Cannibals? That can't be good. Thought you'd have a gun? No, you only have the cards in your hands, and even those will screw you over.

 

This is as much of a puzzle game as it is a survival game. That's actually a really cool concept. I've never played a deck builder before (I didn't even know that was a term until I stumbled across the forums), but there's a surprising amount of complexity here. Each "hero," I guess you can call them, has unique abilities that help you to advance through the game. The basic idea is to complete Region cards using the resources in your hands. You have food, wood, and survivors. You also have fatigue, which is a wasted card. You don't want those. You can rest at the beginning of your turn to clear all the fatigue cards you're holding, but that advances The Frost. Every time you clear a region, you move one step away from The Frost. So, it would behoove you to move quickly. To assist with that, there are Idea cards (shown at the top) that you can purchase for resources. These are randomly distributed after each turn. For example, the Ointment there can be purchased for two foods, and it will heal you for 1 HP. However, both foods with be lost in the transaction, and the card is only good for one use. You can also send your survivors to scavenge for resources (the button to the right of the Region card), but what they come back with is random. And sometimes they die. Actually, a lot of times they die.

 

The game has a fairly good trophy list. You basically get a trophy for beating the game on each difficulty (and what's nice is you can create a custom game to tailor these towards your preferred play style), and a trophy for beating each scenario. More scenarios (and more cards) are unlocked as you play the game. A typical "game" is only about 20 minutes, so you can do this in one sitting. In fact, you almost HAVE to do this in one sitting. I had my save file get corrupted MANY times while playing this. If you try to quit out in the middle of a game (because you're trying to save scum, you filthy cheater), there's a good chance the game won't start up again. I'm not the only one with this problem. I actually talked to the dev about this, so hopefully they'll come out with a patch soon. Otherwise, back up your game frequently. This wasn't a huge problem for me because I could beat a scenario, get the relevant trophy, and then reload an earlier save to do the next scenario, but it did mean I was locked out of using those heroes for custom games. This kinda sucked because the Frigomancer would've made Endless and Impossible a lot less endless and impossible.

 

The hardest scenario is probably the Priest. I'm just going to post my solution here because there isn't a ton of information about this game, and I came up with a pretty good strategy. Basically, what makes her hard is that you have to raise the temperature to maximum in five legendary regions. She has a skill that does this, but it requires a human sacrifice. And since the average temperature is 5, you'll need at least four sacrifices per region. That's where her other skill comes in use. She can consume one wood to allow you to draw three cards. So, what you want is at least one Singer (gives you a 75% chance to find another survivor, but always adds a fatigue card), one Tinkerer (chance to draw multiple wood or fatigue cards), one or two Fire cards (lets you draw one card for free or three cards for one wood), and a Shelter card (removes one fatigue card). You want food and a weapon too, but you can break the game using these. See, what you do is get ALL the cards in your hand at the same time. You can use the Priest's second skill for that. You just need enough wood to get it started. Once you have that, you use one Shelter card (to eliminate fatigue), followed by a Fire+Wood combo. Because wood isn't consumed in the process, you're automatically going to draw the only three cards in the discard pile: Shelter, Fire, and Wood. You can repeat the process until all the fatigue cards are gone. MEANWHILE, you can be using the Singer to create a chain of human sacrifices. Doesn't matter if it succeeds or not, as your turn will never end, and you can scavenge as much as you want. The Tinkerer is just there to help you get started. If he finds three wood, that's nine cards you can draw right away. I find a smaller deck is easier to work with for most heroes.

 

That paragraph will make sense to 0% of you, but I just wanted to give you an idea of the kind of mental gymnastics you have to do to survive in this game.

 

Would I recommend it? Eh.. It's not for everyone. If they patched some of the bugs, I think this would be a good purchase for those of you who like deceptively complex strategy games, but understand there's a lot more luck and RNG involved here than The Long Dark or even The Flame in the Flood. At least those games warned you when the soap was slipping from your hands. Frost just knocks it out and tells you to pick it up.

Edited by Cassylvania
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On 11/22/2019 at 4:43 AM, Rally-Vincent--- said:

 

No, it's the fallacy that not including a detailed handbook for everything one needs to know like they used to do in the days of yore is the reason why games need to have tutorials. Whatever the saved cost on a booklet is, surely it cannot match the effort programmers have to make to program introductory levels for the tutorial(s).

 

You didn't understand what I meant.

 

I meant tutorials that interrupt your gameplay as you're playing through the game. I absolutely cannot stand that shit.

 

If you want a good example of tutorials done right, God of War (original) and Prince of Persia: Forgotten Sands are ones I can think of. In God of War you get icons for QTEs and you'll get a simple message for what button did which attack. Prince of Persia: Forgotten Sands gave you little messages for platforming and performing certain attacks on enemies. Gameplay wasn't interrupted and I considered it to be good messages. The game itself is fairly easy.

 

There's a difference between simple tutorials like those and then having tutorials that freeze the game.

 

The newer Ubisoft games have a pop in tutorial which is basically 'go here, press X to do this, now perform this'. They interrupt the gameplay and it's unnecessary and annoying. We're not stupid. Most of us trophy hunters on this website have had many years of gaming experience. But some of these new games treat me like a 12 - 14 year old kid who is playing the PS4 console for the very first time and is just starting to learn how the PS4 controller works. We need a pop in tutorial like I really need that to begin with. Especially when it's a first person shooter or an open world game, both genres I'm pretty familiar with.

 

Dark Souls and the other games in the series don't really have tutorials. You're just thrown out into the environment, free to pick your own build, set of armor, gear and supplies you need. I commend From Software for that. If the game was a bunch of pop in tutorials at the very start, I would of been greatly turned off with them.

 

Pop in tutorials freeze the game and I get the impression that 'I'm playing the game wrong'. Well, if your audience is little kids and people who haven't played too many video games in their life, then they're probably necessary. But for a veteran gamer like myself who has over 20 years of gaming experience, they just frustrate me and piss me off to no end.

Edited by Spaz
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3 hours ago, Spaz said:

 

You didn't understand what I meant.

 

I meant tutorials that interrupt your gameplay as you're playing through the game. I absolutely cannot stand that shit.

 

If you want a good example of tutorials done right, God of War (original) and Prince of Persia: Forgotten Sands are ones I can think of. In God of War you get icons for QTEs and you'll get a simple message for what button did which attack. Prince of Persia: Forgotten Sands gave you little messages for platforming and performing certain attacks on enemies. Gameplay wasn't interrupted and I considered it to be good messages. The game itself is fairly easy.

 

There's a difference between simple tutorials like those and then having tutorials that freeze the game.

 

The newer Ubisoft games have a pop in tutorial which is basically 'go here, press X to do this, now perform this'. They interrupt the gameplay and it's unnecessary and annoying. We're not stupid. Most of us trophy hunters on this website have had many years of gaming experience. But some of these new games treat me like a 12 - 14 year old kid who is playing the PS4 console for the very first time and is just starting to learn how the PS4 controller works. We need a pop in tutorial like I really need that to begin with. Especially when it's a first person shooter or an open world game, both genres I'm pretty familiar with.

 

Dark Souls and the other games in the series don't really have tutorials. You're just thrown out into the environment, free to pick your own build, set of armor, gear and supplies you need. I commend From Software for that. If the game was a bunch of pop in tutorials at the very start, I would of been greatly turned off with them.

 

Pop in tutorials freeze the game and I get the impression that 'I'm playing the game wrong'. Well, if your audience is little kids and people who haven't played too many video games in their life, then they're probably necessary. But for a veteran gamer like myself who has over 20 years of gaming experience, they just frustrate me and piss me off to no end.

 

Actually, the 'good' type of tutorial is a tutorial section that is separate from all gameplay or which you can opt to turn off. They used to have that when games were shipped with handbooks. You could read the handbook for control schemes and mechanics, and then could easily play the game without any interruption. If someone felt a bit unsure, they could do the tutorial stuff beforehand.

 

The simple messages that pop up somewhere during gameplay are not as suitable as the other types, because they rarely stay long enough on the screen (and even worse if they are designed not to be obstrusive). You are concentrating on the gameplay, and it is easy to miss the content of the message because you can only read half of it before it blends out. Even worse if it refers to in-game terminology that you don't know yet. I remember well the times where I played video games without any handbook or tutorial - I actually preferred that because tutorials bore me - but the freeze tutorials are more suitable to their purpose.

 

Of course tutorials are calibrated to the sake of new or casual players. Otherwise they'd be useless. If I ever watch a game of cricket, I wouldn't want the commentary to be aimed at twenty-year-plus viewers. I need them to explain the fucking rules because I am new to the game.

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2 hours ago, Rally-Vincent--- said:

Actually, the 'good' type of tutorial is a tutorial section that is separate from all gameplay or which you can opt to turn off. They used to have that when games were shipped with handbooks. You could read the handbook for control schemes and mechanics, and then could easily play the game without any interruption. If someone felt a bit unsure, they could do the tutorial stuff beforehand.

 

The last time they really did this was back in the PS2 era. By the PS3/360 era they were already doing away with game manuals. Still you were pretty much expected to "learn" the game, with only a couple quick messages here and there explaining what to do.

 

2 hours ago, Rally-Vincent--- said:

The simple messages that pop up somewhere during gameplay are not as suitable as the other types, because they rarely stay long enough on the screen (and even worse if they are designed not to be obstrusive). You are concentrating on the gameplay, and it is easy to miss the content of the message because you can only read half of it before it blends out. Even worse if it refers to in-game terminology that you don't know yet. I remember well the times where I played video games without any handbook or tutorial - I actually preferred that because tutorials bore me - but the freeze tutorials are more suitable to their purpose.

 

They're listed right on the screen, Prince of Persia: Forgotten Sands did this wonderfully. That's really what it should be.

 

Assassins Creed Syndicate did those freeze tutorials. I'm several hours into the game, I reach a new area I haven't been to yet, and I get a freeze tutorial. If I recall none of the information in the tutorial was necessary.

 

Beginning tutorial levels are fine. We've had those for a long time. But those freezing tutorials that show up when you're already well into the game is just stupid.

 

2 hours ago, Rally-Vincent--- said:

Of course tutorials are calibrated to the sake of new or casual players. Otherwise they'd be useless. If I ever watch a game of cricket, I wouldn't want the commentary to be aimed at twenty-year-plus viewers. I need them to explain the fucking rules because I am new to the game.

 

That's not the same.

 

I've watched over 20 years of American Football and Baseball. In those sports, you can learn the games as you watch them. As a kid I didn't understand the finer details of either sport, but as a former casual softball player and as someone who has seen this stuff on television for so many years, I understand a lot more now.

 

The rules are rarely laid out in an obvious fashion. You're better off reading about a sport on Wikipedia and understand how the game is played and reading the rules. Commentators on television will generally comment on the current situation, they don't have time to lay out all the essential rules. Besides, you watch to have fun, whether it's being there at the stadium or watching/livestreaming it on television. Yes it can be a learning experience, as it was for me.

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33 minutes ago, Spaz said:

That's not the same.

 

I've watched over 20 years of American Football and Baseball. In those sports, you can learn the games as you watch them. As a kid I didn't understand the finer details of either sport, but as a former casual softball player and as someone who has seen this stuff on television for so many years, I understand a lot more now.

 

The rules are rarely laid out in an obvious fashion. You're better off reading about a sport on Wikipedia and understand how the game is played and reading the rules. Commentators on television will generally comment on the current situation, they don't have time to lay out all the essential rules. Besides, you watch to have fun, whether it's being there at the stadium or watching/livestreaming it on television. Yes it can be a learning experience, as it was for me.

 

If commentators do not have the time to discuss rules during a game of American Football - what the hell are they doing during those three and a half hours?

 

You won't learn what is considered a catch or not if the ball touches the ground or what is a "football move" to differentiate between an incomplete pass and a fumble unless someone explains it at least once. That is part of a commentator's job, and it is also in the best interest of the TV channel so that viewers new to the game won't switch off because they don't know what is going on. If people don't know that it isn't a catch - although the receiver caught the ball - unless both his feet are not inbounds, they'll lose interest because they can't follow what is going on.

 

So, what do you want to tell me? That tutorials are unnecessary because you pick up stuff as you go along if you do or watch it long enough? That is quite a view - why do they need to tell stuff you know well enough? Why are you insulted by something that is clearly not aimed at you in the first place? A time-stop tutorial takes no more than 30 seconds at a time. A pee break is longer.

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39 minutes ago, Rally-Vincent--- said:

If commentators do not have the time to discuss rules during a game of American Football - what the hell are they doing during those three and a half hours?

 

They're not going to lay out the rules too obviously.

 

They'll comment on the certain situation whether a football team is 10 yards from the goal line or they are 50 yards from the goal line. They make the occasional comment on whether a quarterback of a team made a pass to somebody while he's getting tackled by five big defensive linemen. What they might say is "Tom Brady was hesitant to make the pass to one of his best receivers". Knowing Tom Brady as well as I do, he's not going to do that much at all. He's a rock hard veteran of the game.

 

It takes more than one game of watching to really learn it. I watched baseball day in and day out for many years, and I still don't understand many of the rules the game has in place. Football at least has rules that are a bit more straightforward, but there are moments where a penalty is judged and debated, which doesn't always makes sense.

 

39 minutes ago, Rally-Vincent--- said:

You won't learn what is considered a catch or not if the ball touches the ground or what is a "football move" to differentiate between an incomplete pass and a fumble unless someone explains it at least once. That is part of a commentator's job, and it is also in the best interest of the TV channel so that viewers new to the game won't switch off because they don't know what is going on. If people don't know that it isn't a catch - although the receiver caught the ball - unless both his feet are not inbounds, they'll lose interest because they can't follow what is going on.

 

Yes, but you're probably not going to learn all that just watching one game. You have to watch several games, and the commentators will tell you how a catch is made.

 

I definitely don't think American Football or a lot of sports in general aren't too hard to follow once you know how they are generally played. Unless these people are watching bad commentators. I watched plenty of Soccer, what Europeans refer to as Football or Futbol.

 

39 minutes ago, Rally-Vincent--- said:

So, what do you want to tell me? That tutorials are unnecessary because you pick up stuff as you go along if you do or watch it long enough? That is quite a view - why do they need to tell stuff you know well enough? Why are you insulted by something that is clearly not aimed at you in the first place? A time-stop tutorial takes no more than 30 seconds at a time. A pee break is longer.

 

I never said tutorials are unnecessary.

 

I'm saying a tutorial that pops up on the screen and freezes your gameplay, especially when you're several hours in, is annoying and unnecessary in my opinion. I'm fine with tutorials in what they generally try to show. I just don't like the way some of them are implemented, especially in Ubisoft games.

Edited by Spaz
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4 hours ago, Rally-Vincent--- said:

The simple messages that pop up somewhere during gameplay are not as suitable as the other types, because they rarely stay long enough on the screen (and even worse if they are designed not to be obstrusive). You are concentrating on the gameplay, and it is easy to miss the content of the message because you can only read half of it before it blends out. Even worse if it refers to in-game terminology that you don't know yet. I remember well the times where I played video games without any handbook or tutorial - I actually preferred that because tutorials bore me - but the freeze tutorials are more suitable to their purpose.

 

I think it really depends on the game too. In a game like the original Super Mario Bros, a tutorial wasn't necessary because there were only a few buttons on the controller, and the layout of the first level was designed in such a way that the player could understand the basic controls and core concepts (e.g. move right, jump over enemies, and collect mushrooms to power up) in just a few seconds. Even Super Mario 64, which was much more complex, started with the player in a safe and fun-to-explore environment. Everybody started that game by running around the field, jumping, climbing trees, and swimming in the moat, even though none of that was necessary to reach the first level. I'm not sure if there were in-game tutorials (I know Lakitu would give you tips, but nobody read those), but Nintendo has a knack for designing games with intuitive controls.

 

But I think when a game is TOO complicated, tutorials are important. Like I said in my previous post, Frost has a good one. Nobody's going to figure that screen out on their own. The game also prevents the player from getting overwhelmed by introducing new cards and mechanics slowly. Dark Souls probably has my favorite kind of tutorial, where it teaches you everything you need to know within the first ten minutes, and then throws you into a battle that you're physically unready for, even though you mentally have a grasp on how to win. This is different than most games that expect you to fail at the end of the tutorial, because you actually CAN win. That is how Dark Souls establishes it will be a tough but fair game.

 

One of the most bizarre "tutorials" I've seen recently is (surprise) Shadow of the Tomb Raider. You think it's weird to freeze the game for a pop-up message? How about seeing the button prompt plastered across the environment? I'm not just talking about the white paint that conveniently covers every wall you can climb. You'll actually see "JUMP USING THE X BUTTON AND THEN PRESS SQUARE TO GRAB ON TO THE NEXT WALL" attached to the side of a realistic-looking cliff. The first time I saw it, I actually burst out laughing. I mean, I guess it looks cool (and I think I prefer it over stopping the game), but it's so jarring and out of place.

 

It's always interesting to me to see how a game handles the obvious fourth wall break between needing the character on-screen to do something and teaching the player how to perform that action. Can we at least agree that in-game dialogue is the most awkward way to go about it? Pokemon games do this constantly, and I love it. No shame there.

 

1 hour ago, Rally-Vincent--- said:

If commentators do not have the time to discuss rules during a game of American Football - what the hell are they doing during those three and a half hours?

 

That's what I wonder every time Booger McFarland opens his mouth. 😂

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I've been lurking in this thread for a while as there are some great conversations here, but when I saw that you platinumed Frost, I felt like i needed to post. That is the most frustrating deck building game I've played and I have played quite a few, as I like that genre. I would say it's at least 50% luck, which started to turn me off to it.

 

How much play time would you think it took to platinum that and did you use any guides? I try not to use any guides for those sort of games, as figuring out how to build the decks and experiment is half the fun.

 

If you anyone likes those sort of games I would recommend "Hand of Fate 2 (don't need to play the first and the 2nd has more content and improvements), "Throne Breaker: The Witcher Tales" (don't need to have played Witcher, but it would fill in some of the back story) and "Iron Clad Tactics" (more of a real-time card strategy game).

 

Congratulations on that platinum, I've meaning to go back and try again, maybe with some 4 leaf clovers.

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2 hours ago, Together_Comic said:

Getting close to 200 here @Cassylvania anything big planned?

 

Oh, geez. I've been so anxious to get to 200 that I forgot I don't have any games planned for that milestone.

 

Well... I guess I'm open to suggestions. If we're trying to squeeze it in before the end of the year, time is going to be a factor. I still need to finish Cosmic Star Heroine (should be done this week), Mutant Year Zero (no clue how long this game is), Arkham City (if I'm lucky, I'll have it at 100% on Christmas Day), and three more games. For the winter event, I need a game that involves spending a lot of money, one that deals with religion, and another that is light-hearted. That opens the door to basically any game I want for #200.

 

I think I'm going to try to squeeze in one more quick game before Thanksgiving. I want to at least be halfway to my goal by the end of the month.

 

1 hour ago, Grotz99 said:

I've been lurking in this thread for a while as there are some great conversations here, but when I saw that you platinumed Frost, I felt like i needed to post. That is the most frustrating deck building game I've played and I have played quite a few, as I like that genre. I would say it's at least 50% luck, which started to turn me off to it.

 

How much play time would you think it took to platinum that and did you use any guides? I try not to use any guides for those sort of games, as figuring out how to build the decks and experiment is half the fun.

 

I read on our sister site that the platinum should take around 10 hours. I'm calling BS on that. I probably spent closer to 30, and I save scummed a few times. (You have to be really careful with that, though. Quitting out in the middle of a game can corrupt your save.)

 

I couldn't find any guides out there. If you go to the game's Steam forum, you'll see some general advice, but nothing like what I posted for the Priest scenario. It does seem like luck plays too much of a role. There are many times I HAD to pull a wood/food/survivor card or I'd lose. To be honest, I don't think it's worth trying to finish a game if the first two or three regions go poorly. There are certain Idea cards (e.g. Pot Plant, Assegai) that are so critical to winning that you might as well quit if you don't get them. And unfortunately, as the game adds more cards, you're less and less likely to get those.

 

My suggestion is to beat each scenario as you unlock them. If you have earlier scenarios you still need to beat, delete your save file and start over. You can quickly unlock cards/scenarios by creating a custom game, setting it to 1 turn, and winning.

 

I might try some of the games you've suggested. I like the concept of Frost a lot. I just wish the game (and difficulty) was a little more stable.

 

Oh, and I see you played The Count Lucanor recently. That's one of the games I had in mind for the winter event, but I heard it can crash and delete your save file too. Not sure I want to put up with that again. 😂

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19 minutes ago, Cassylvania said:

Oh, and I see you played The Count Lucanor recently. That's one of the games I had in mind for the winter event, but I heard it can crash and delete your save file too. Not sure I want to put up with that again. 1f602.png

 

Figured once I posted, my ecliptic profile will be looked at :). I try to complete games that I enjoy playing (some i powered through since they didn't take long). Started really trying to complete games this past year, really need to knock down my backlog and want to revisit and polish off some games.

 

That game was just frustrating. I played it through it about 4 times fully to get most of the trophies then another 4 times because of crashes in the middle. If they game crashes, the save corrupts completely, meaning all saved checkpoints. Some places will say 4 hours, probably was more of around 8. If you do play it, try to do it in 1 sitting, closing the game or sleeping the console has a high chance of corrupting the save.

 

Other than that, it was a neat story with kind of a Binding of Isaac feel except without being able to shoot things.

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53 minutes ago, Cassylvania said:

 Mutant Year Zero (no clue how long this game is),

 

It is a short game.

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On 11/24/2019 at 7:58 AM, Spaz said:

Dark Souls and the other games in the series don't really have tutorials. You're just thrown out into the environment, free to pick your own build, set of armor, gear and supplies you need. I commend From Software for that. If the game was a bunch of pop in tutorials at the very start, I would of been greatly turned off with them.

 

Of course Dark Souls has tutorials. Alone in the first corridor after opening the cell you have around 15 messages telling you what to do with each button. But the good thing about that tutorial is that you can skip it. 

 

 

On 11/24/2019 at 5:13 PM, Cassylvania said:

I think it really depends on the game too. In a game like the original Super Mario Bros, a tutorial wasn't necessary because there were only a few buttons on the controller, and the layout of the first level was designed in such a way that the player could understand the basic controls and core concepts (e.g. move right, jump over enemies, and collect mushrooms to power up) 

 

But I think when a game is TOO complicated, tutorials are important. Like I said in my previous post, Frost has a good one. Nobody's going to figure that screen out on their own. The game also prevents the player from getting overwhelmed by introducing new cards and mechanics slowly. Dark Souls probably has my favorite kind of tutorial, where it teaches you everything you need to know within the first ten minutes, and then throws you into a battle that you're physically unready for, even though you mentally have a grasp on how to win. 

 

I think that games need still to consider that not everyone has already played 100+ games when they pick it up. I'll leave a video in spoiler-tags for the interested :)

 

 

This video I linked is an experiment I found interesting... Some dude decided to make his wife, who never plays games, play 10 or so games (Dark Souls, Portal, Celeste, ...). He wanted to learn how games teach a new player how they should be played, and where they fail to make things clear. Super Mario Bros makes an appearence in that video as well, and while the woman in the video learned how to jump, she never learned how to sprint... 😅

 

So always think about inclusion and accessibility. I find the best kind of tutorials to be those that can be skipped by someone that already knows that you jump with :cross:, but is still there for someone with less experience. 

 

Magicka 2 for example has a tutorial area, but after the first 5 minutes you already are capable of casting spells combining 8 different elements, some combinations create new elements, you can use a spell to enchant your weapon, do AoE attacks, cast shields, place bombs... It is overwhelming to say the least.

 

On the other hand, do you know what game has a fantastic tutorial? Furi. Which brings me to my next point...

 

 

12 hours ago, Cassylvania said:

Oh, geez. I've been so anxious to get to 200 that I forgot I don't have any games planned for that milestone.

 

Can you guess my suggestion? 😬 Honestly, I think Furi would be a worthy game for #200, and since you say that time is a factor: it only should take 15-20 hours. 

 

 

 

I'm surprised to see Dragon Quest win the first category! Especially considering all other games that you've played this year. Like yourself, I would have expected something more childish... Never played a DQ game, though. 

Would you want us to give our winners among our games for your categories as well? Of course only one-liners :) Don't want to spam your thread. 

Edited by Arcesius
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19 hours ago, Grotz99 said:

Figured once I posted, my ecliptic profile will be looked at :). I try to complete games that I enjoy playing (some i powered through since they didn't take long). Started really trying to complete games this past year, really need to knock down my backlog and want to revisit and polish off some games.

 

I like your profile. You're obviously missing some of the Cassentials (e.g. XCOM, Valkyria Chronicles, Shantae), but everybody's got their own tastes. You have just as many unearned trophies as earned, though! That's a huge backlog, if you plan to get to them all.

 

On the other hand, I imagine that's what my account would've looked like when I was a teenager, if trophies were a thing on the SNES/N64.

 

9 hours ago, Arcesius said:

Can you guess my suggestion? 1f62c.png Honestly, I think Furi would be a worthy game for #200, and since you say that time is a factor: it only should take 15-20 hours. 

 

I knew you and @Mori would try to push Furi/Hollow Knight on me. You just can't let me have an easy 200, can you? In the words of Rag'n'Bone Man, I'm only human after all.

 

(Just kidding. You know I'm going to do something epic.)

 

9 hours ago, Arcesius said:

Would you want us to give our winners among our games for your categories as well? Of course only one-liners :) Don't want to spam your thread. 

 

Sure, just stick to the same rules as me. (You know, games you've played this year, not that recently came out.)

 

And yeah, DQ11 was a surprise to me too. I start writing these without any preconceived notion of who is going to win. Will the next round of nominations bring more surprises? Let's find out!

 

Best Animation of 2019

 

I'm calling this category "animation" instead of "graphics" because I'm much more impressed by hand-drawn creations and imaginative use of colors and light than your typical AAA studio work. Doing more with less will ALWAYS win out in my eyes, and I could probably list two dozen games just in the last six months that should make this list. But, since that's against the rules, I'll just go with these four: GuacameleeKing's QuestThe Banner Saga 2Forgotton AnneDragon Quest XI: Echoes of an Elusive Age, and The Liar Princess and the Blind Prince. These were all beautiful to look at, and I think a case could be made for any of them to take home the gold, but I gotta give it up to my girl Red. (No, not Alette. Not Aloy either. The other redhead. Stop pointing the camera the wrong way!)

 

L896d00.png

 

Forgotton Anne fell just short of making my Best Story nominations, but it wasn't going to slip here. This was the closest thing to playing a Disney game without it being...you know, a licensed Disney game. Yes, the platforming is awful and Anne is about as good at following directions as a house cat, but I was in love with the visuals from the opening cutscene. The characters, the backgrounds, and the animations are as fluid as I've seen in a video game done in this style. If they haven't made an anime out of this, they should. I'd watch it. And you should too.

 

Worst Animation of 2019

 

L2ce93d.png

 

Is it even fair to pick this one? I mean, I LIKE the horrible pixelated artwork in these games. The fact that you can't even tell what a picture is supposed to be when you're finished is part of the fun. The problem with Pic-a-Pix Classic, though -- and why it gets the nod over Pic-a-Pix Pieces -- is that every puzzle in this collection is monochrome. Basically. I mean, they're all white and then one other color. You might think that would make the solutions even harder to figure out (and thereby funnier), but it really just means the puzzles are simpler and less interesting to look at.

 

I look forward to what you guys will nominate as the worst in every category. 😂

Edited by Cassylvania
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1 hour ago, Cassylvania said:

 

I like your profile. You're obviously missing some of the Cassentials (e.g. XCOM, Valkyria Chronicles, Shantae), but everybody's got their own tastes. You have just as many unearned trophies as earned, though! That's a huge backlog, if you plan to get to them all.

 

On the other hand, I imagine that's what my account would've looked like when I was a teenager, if trophies were a thing on the SNES/N64.

 

Would have looked better if I was a teenager I think, work and life definitely took a toll on my gaming. I also played a bunch more on PC until a few years ago (working all day on a computer makes gaming less desirable on a PC now a days, need that comfy couch with my big TV). I have played XCOM, XCOM 2 and Valkyria Chronicles on my PC through Steam, all great games. XCOM 2 on my PS4 is on the very long list I have.

 

I wish I can delete any games I trophies that I want, although I see why it would be a problem. At least letting me delete games with 1 trophy would help as I wanted to try some of the PS+ games and like 5 mins in you get a trophy, then after 30 mins I decide it's not worth playing. My goal currently is to get above 50% completion, as i see going back to all those games isn't worth it at the moment with so many good games queued up, I'll send you a link to the list.

 

My account doesn't reflect the unplayed games I have queued up on my spreadsheet. I left some 0%s in there as a reminder and just to see what the trophies will be like when I take them on soon.

 

As far as my nominations, Gravity Rush Remastered wins it for best animation for me. I know it's a bigger studio game and this is a remake, but I loved the art style. Otherwise the only Indy game I played which I liked the art in was The Coma: Recut.

 

Worst animation would be The Count Lucanor for me. The 16-bit syle actually wasn't bad, but there were parts where the game would still choke and slow down.

Edited by Grotz99
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On 26.11.2019 at 6:11 PM, Cassylvania said:

Sure, just stick to the same rules as me. (You know, games you've played this year, not that recently came out.)

 

Alright, here we go 🙂 I'll also stick to games that I both started and finished in 2019, so Red Dead Redemption 2 is out: 

 

 

Best Story of 2019: 

S61a5c1.png - Pyre

 

This was a close one. But I think I have to give the win to Pyre for many of the same reasons you gave it to DQ XI. The characters are fantastic, all with their quirks and unique characteristics. The way they find together, the way they evolve over the course of the game... I really enjoyed this game more than I would have thought, and I think that's not due to the fantasy-basketball part, but really due to the great story and perfect storytelling. 

 

 

Worst Story of 2019:

Sc719c5.png - Immortal: Unchained

 

I might be cheating a bit here, since I honestly don't have a clue what the story is about (so how could it be the worst?). If you read my review, then you know that I found the voice acting so fucking monotonous that I couldn't listen to it and would always drift away whenever some story bit was unveiled. Don't play this one for the story. Or, you know what? Don't play this one at all 😂

 

 

 

Best Animation of 2019:

Sa8744b.png - Hollow Knight

 

This one was easy. The visuals resp. the artstyle of Hollow Knight is without a doubt top-tier. And while this game would be among my favorites even if it looked like Little Adventures on the Prairie thanks to the stellar gameplay and lore, its animation elevates this game to a perfectly crafted masterpiece which excels in all aspects I can think of.  

 

 

Worst Animation of 2019: 

S7a0af6.png - Downwell

 

I feel bad for nominating this game for being the "worst" at something... But yeah, it has the worst animation of 2019, and it's not even close 😅 Granted, the game can become quite chaotic at times, so having a simple artstyle works in its favor... Still, this game looks like something for the original Game Boy...

Edited by Arcesius
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