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So..how hard are the hard time attacks?


PhantomFear94

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UPDATE:  COMPLETED ALL TIME ATTACKS (NORMAL AND HARD)

 

New to this game, but it looks amazing.  Was more xbox growing up so just missed it. 

 

Every guide I've seen has been giving this a 6 or 7/10.    Presume that is really determinant on the hard attack and items and was wondering if anyone could provide some background advise. 

 

Was wondering how hard these attacks truly are?   People keep saying the game is easy, and the hard mode speed run is actually a doddle, yet roadmaps keep marking the game a 6 or 7/10.   Is it just trial and error? Is it punishing?   Is it being over exaggerated?  

 

Some perspective would be appreciated :) 

Edited by phantomfear9494
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43 minutes ago, phantomfear9494 said:

New to this game, but it looks amazing.  Was more xbox growing up so just missed it. 

 

Every guide I've seen has been giving this a 6 or 7/10.    Presume that is really determinant on the hard attack and items and was wondering if anyone could provide some background advise. 

 

Was wondering how hard these attacks truly are?   People keep saying the game is easy, and the hard mode speed run is actually a doddle, yet roadmaps keep marking the game a 6 or 7/10.   Is it just trial and error? Is it punishing?   Is it being over exaggerated?  

 

Some perspective would be appreciated :) 

 

Just got it today, although I played the original on PS2 several times.

 

It’s not that hard, really. It’s much easier than in the original for sure. I got 90% of them on first try. Just 2-3 where I almost ran out of time. If you play the game on normal first and do normal time attacks then you should be well prepared for the hard difficulty. Only a couple of them have extra weakpoint(s) you need to get to and it just takes extra 2-4 hits compared to normal. Strategy is always the same. And if you don’t wanna bother with finding them yourself, you can always search for videos even from the original, which always work and are easy to follow. Except for Gaius where I didn’t use the famous sword launch jump but just jumped on his “belt” and then on his arm. Good tip for Resist the Wrist trophy too. 

 

It is challenging but if you don’t screw anything, it should be easy. 

Edited by Lowlliet
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1 hour ago, phantomfear9494 said:

New to this game, but it looks amazing.  Was more xbox growing up so just missed it. 

 

Every guide I've seen has been giving this a 6 or 7/10.    Presume that is really determinant on the hard attack and items and was wondering if anyone could provide some background advise. 

 

Was wondering how hard these attacks truly are?   People keep saying the game is easy, and the hard mode speed run is actually a doddle, yet roadmaps keep marking the game a 6 or 7/10.   Is it just trial and error? Is it punishing?   Is it being over exaggerated?  

 

Some perspective would be appreciated :) 

 

Hey man. I already got the trophy. So they're a little bit less difficult than the ps3/ps2 ones but there are still some that are a bit hard. i'd say like a solid 6 out of 10 as, let's be honest, the controls on the game are a bit complicated and the AI isnt very good IMO. I recommend you watch ps4trophies' videos on each colossus as he goes over a strategy for every one of them. You can do it.

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Got hard time attack done yesterday in 4 hours 30 minutes(yes I'm slow). New to the games and never touched them.

Some bosses were a 1 shot and a complete joke and some took me a few tries. Boss #15 took me almost an hour alone and I really dont know why..

 

Finish this and the game turns into a 1/10 as you can 1 shot everything with a weapon you receive after hard time attacks.

 

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5 minutes ago, phantomfear9494 said:

Would it be fair to say that if you legitimately got blue ribbon champ on BioShock infinite this would be within my skill range?  Doesn't seem too bad if you can keep retrying. 

 

Well, that’s something completely different but yes, you can do it. 

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3 hours ago, Deluziion90 said:

Boss #15 took me almost an hour alone and I really dont know why..

This honestly doesn't surprise me. They subtracted time for this one, and it was one of the more difficult time attacks to do on the PS3 version. Easier with the improvements, I'm sure. But not a total walk in the park. 

 

29 minutes ago, phantomfear9494 said:

I meant a comparison of difficulty > similarity.   

I think the problem there is, it's hard to tell if someone can do something in another genre, simply because they completed something with the same difficulty rating in another. I've completed games with higher ratings than some of the games I thought maybe I could do based on their lower difficulty ratings, but came up short, for instance. Difficulty is really subjective.

 

But it's supposed to be way easier than the PS3 version, and I've seen many toss around 5/10. I wouldn't think it would prove too difficult for you.

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@phantomfear9494

Practice makes perfect and for this game you should be able to do it especially when you mentioned that you can keep retrying. The loading screens aren't bad so no waiting time, you can keep going till you get the bosses

There's only 16 bosses and only a handfull can be annoying but there are some great guides from ps4trophies and powerpyx for each boss.

 

 

Edited by Deluziion90
typo
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Honestly OP, I think you should go and try it. If you get it, you’ll get it. If you don’t then you won’t. Simple. 

 

Nobody can tell you if can do it or not. We don’t know what kind of skills you have. All we can tell you is that It’s really not that difficult and It’s doable after a few tries. 

Edited by Lowlliet
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Not hard at all - except Gaius (Colossus 3) who was always a pain in the ass for me. Did it on the PS2 though in sub 5 minutes so 6.30 is more than manageable. My time the other day was 5.17 and that was despite losing 30 seconds due to falling down his shoulder. 

Edited by screenwriter91
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36 minutes ago, Lowlliet said:

Honestly OP, I think you should go and try it. If you get it, you’ll get it. If you don’t then you won’t. Simple. 

 

Nobody can tell you if can do it or not. We don’t know what kind of skills you have. All we can tell you is that It’s really not that difficult and It’s doable after a few tries. 

 

I feel it's within my skillset, and thanks for your responses :) My post is really to clarify because I'm a completionist and I don't want to get my fingers burnt.   I love challenging completions, I was just slightly confused as the game doesn't seem intrinsically difficult in itself. 

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Is there some kind of damage boost for HTA?

The guys from ps4trophies or other guides deal way more damage than me?

 

 Example: Barbas (6th)

To destroy the weakpoint on the head they need 3-4 full stabs, I tried several times and I always need 6 full stabs in the center.

 

Same thing with ALL the colossi I already beat ( 8 colossi)

 

 

 

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Hum... from all your statements i am starting to think this plat won't be ultra rare for long.
Colossi 3, 6 and 15 are the hardest ones so no surprise some ppl are have a little difficulty. But hey, if u all managed to do it in 1 hour, i am sure it's not that hard. third colossus gaius took me around 6 hours do get in hta in ps3...

Any1 here that got the plat also got the plat in the ps3 version to compare for us both versions?

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3 minutes ago, BG_painter said:

Hum... from all your statements i am starting to think this plat won't be ultra rare for long.
Colossi 3, 6 and 15 are the hardest ones so no surprise some ppl are have a little difficulty. But hey, if u all managed to do it in 1 hour, i am sure it's not that hard. third colossus gaius took me around 6 hours do get in hta in ps3...

Any1 here that got the plat also got the plat in the ps3 version to compare for us both versions?

Plat rarity on ps4 is almost doubled compared to ps3.And the game was released 12 days ago.I think it will reach 15% in 6 months

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1 hour ago, sephiroth4424 said:

Plat rarity on ps4 is almost doubled compared to ps3.And the game was released 12 days ago.I think it will reach 15% in 6 months

I guess they made the game more "friendly" to make it more popular and sell more (?) after all it's pratically the third release :giggle:

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13 hours ago, BG_painter said:

Any1 here that got the plat also got the plat in the ps3 version to compare for us both versions?

 

I've been playing both PS3 and PS4 versions in conjunction together alternating between the two.

 

I have finished the HTA's for the PS4 and I've been trying the HTA's for the PS3 and the PS4 version is by FAR much much easier. On PS3 I cannot for the life of me get some of these HTA's. I have tried for several hours and the improvements are really noticeable. They seem to have made improvements with the AI and the gripping. On PS4 it is much easier to grip and hold onto so that you can stab. On PS3 as soon as you grip, you can get shaken loose really quickly and easily. And I'm using the exact same strategies that I did in the PS4 version.

 

So if you are worried about the PS4 HTA's, don't at all. They are really really simple to do and easily achievable than the PS3 version. I don't even feel that the adjusted times are necessary on the PS4 version.

 

I've just got to try and finish the HTA's for PS3 then I will have the Plat. And for PS4 I just got to play the game on Normal for one or two more times to max my stats and climb the tower.

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12 hours ago, BG_painter said:

I guess they made the game more "friendly" to make it more popular and sell more (?) after all it's pratically the third release :giggle:

 

I can also see it being attributed to the game being the most fluid out of the bunch. I skipped the PS3 version, but comparing the PS2 version (which I played religiously up until about PS4's launch) to this version is like comparing night and day. Far more responsive, less jerky and touchy, even accounting for some of the protagonist's trademark frantic falls and stumbles, I'm not shocked to hear that people are finding the TA's easy even factoring in the TA times in HTA were actually lessened for a lot of the bosses in the PS4 version compared to the PS3 version.

 

Don't know how much of it is a streamlining effect to appeal to the masses as you say, or how much of it is just overall a better technical presentation that makes it feel more fluid than it did before, but neither would surprise me.

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10 hours ago, DysectorZA said:

 

I've been playing both PS3 and PS4 versions in conjunction together alternating between the two.

 

I have finished the HTA's for the PS4 and I've been trying the HTA's for the PS3 and the PS4 version is by FAR much much easier. On PS3 I cannot for the life of me get some of these HTA's. I have tried for several hours and the improvements are really noticeable. They seem to have made improvements with the AI and the gripping. On PS4 it is much easier to grip and hold onto so that you can stab. On PS3 as soon as you grip, you can get shaken loose really quickly and easily. And I'm using the exact same strategies that I did in the PS4 version.

 

So if you are worried about the PS4 HTA's, don't at all. They are really really simple to do and easily achievable than the PS3 version. I don't even feel that the adjusted times are necessary on the PS4 version.

 

I've just got to try and finish the HTA's for PS3 then I will have the Plat. And for PS4 I just got to play the game on Normal for one or two more times to max my stats and climb the tower.

That's the opinion i have been waiting to hear!! Thank you very much! ? ?

9 hours ago, iamjax said:

 

I can also see it being attributed to the game being the most fluid out of the bunch. I skipped the PS3 version, but comparing the PS2 version (which I played religiously up until about PS4's launch) to this version is like comparing night and day. Far more responsive, less jerky and touchy, even accounting for some of the protagonist's trademark frantic falls and stumbles, I'm not shocked to hear that people are finding the TA's easy even factoring in the TA times in HTA were actually lessened for a lot of the bosses in the PS4 version compared to the PS3 version.

 

Don't know how much of it is a streamlining effect to appeal to the masses as you say, or how much of it is just overall a better technical presentation that makes it feel more fluid than it did before, but neither would surprise me.

Yeah i agree, could be that too. the controls on ps2/3 were a little cluncky... If it's better now, then the fluid controls are going to help improve gameplay, yep!  ?

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As a first timer... (never ever played the game or watched playthroughs)

I did Normal-->New game+ Normal-->NTA-->New game+ Hard-->HTA

Normal time attack for me were first try for all minus Malus.

Hard time attack, all first try minus Gaius and Malus.

I'd say it's alot easier than what i expected, i even went in blind.

You can fuck up alot even on HTA and still make it before time limit. I fell down from Argus (15th) after EVERY sigil i destroyed and still made it.

For some of the HTA you need to have a plan on which sigil you go for first, to manage stamina...

Like the 3rd or the second one.

 

I also found that for some reason when i play TA without sound, everything goes smoother.

The dramatic music with the time limit was stressing me out at first.

Edited by SnizelPS
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Yeah, I'm about 2/3 of the way through the HTA, and I think the only that posed any sort of threat was Avion (which I rarely see anyone commenting having trouble with, which is weird). He would always buck me off his wing, and there's a "dead zone" one his left wing where you seem to run a very high possibility of falling off it even while holding grip down when he's doing his barrel rolls and flapping around like crazy after a successful stab, which effectively murders your run. So far he was the one and only one to give me any sort of push back, and even Gaius wasn't particularly challenging, and I got him done a couple of seconds after the harder PS3 time.

 

My advice is to anyone that wants this platinum to be as simple and easy as possible (or might be in TC's position wondering if this might be too much or too frustrating): the simpler your run is, the better (try to make it as clean as possible, but don't worry about a stumble or two, as that doesn't always mean your run is doomed). Don't worry about famous speedrun moves from the pros over the years, e.g. the sword jump and whatnot. Unless something comes up towards the last third of my HTA, it seems like there is enough time to play out every encounter as they were intended without any of the overly fancy exploits that have cropped up over the years, but if you want to try some of them out for the hell of it just to give you more time to work with, go for it, just don't think you have to kill yourself with obtaining an ultra high level of mastery in this game, since it's definitely not required.

 

On a semi-related note: I have been watching some of Brian at PS4Trophies videos since he's been kind of on this kick with this game, and just want some comparisons to my runs, and, as much as I have loved the dude's work for a very, very long time now (my favorite trophy guide creator, by far), I think he tends to over complicate a few of the bosses. I think what I learned from watching his HTA vids and comparing them to my much faster times (well, on some of them) is that picking out your vital point order is almost more important than how clean your run is. For example, on colossus 2, he starts with the belly and then uses the beast's momentum to propel him on to the colossus' backside, but only after spending 30 seconds climbing back over to a ledge nearby and regaining his stamina. He barely comes with in the target time, but I had no troubles just simply climbing up the colossus' back leg to his sigil on his back, then his head, then working my way down his side, thus keeping it simple, AND saving myself about 30-40 seconds. So yeah TL;DR moral of the story: choose your vital points in the most logical and least dangerous way possible.

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2 hours ago, iamjax said:

Yeah, I'm about 2/3 of the way through the HTA, and I think the only that posed any sort of threat was Avion (which I rarely see anyone commenting having trouble with, which is weird). He would always buck me off his wing, and there's a "dead zone" one his left wing where you seem to run a very high possibility of falling off it even while holding grip down when he's doing his barrel rolls and flapping around like crazy after a successful stab, which effectively murders your run. So far he was the one and only one to give me any sort of push back, and even Gaius wasn't particularly challenging, and I got him done a couple of seconds after the harder PS3 time.

I agree so f**king hard.  Research seemed to indicate that 3 and 15 are the hardest, but 3 was easy and I haven't tried 15 yet but in OG I did it on my 1st try within 8 minutes and that was with tonnes of mistakes.   Spent yesterday going through normal after my 1st playthrough, and I have done 13/16 - I have the only one I didn't do within my first 2 attempts was, you guessed, Avion.  Took me 10 tries going wing, to wing, to back.   Everything you said; would release grip at weird times and would buck off the wing.  In the end, I ignored advice and did 1 wing and then went to his back.  Figured if I fell off after that, it would be quicker to get back on and do the final wing rather than have to go all the way to his back.  In fact, it was the only time I didn't fall off at all.

 

The only other one that caused me issues was Celosia (#11).  Strategy is easy but time is quite tight considering how much he bucks.   When the AI is in your favour, you can do it with 1m 30s left, when it isn't its very tight on time.

Edited by phantomfear9494
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