Getting really tired of this generation and Sony

[fbdbh]

1 minute ago, Silencer0004 said:

What bothers me the most is there market position. They simply don't need to think about new things or make an effort. They earned this position with PS4 and their exclusive line up without a doubt, but I'm 100% sure, that we would see backwards compatibility for PS3 titles at least for PS5 if Xbox was dominant in the market. 

The censorship annoys me in general, because developers probably censor themselves too strongly rather than risk a rejection from Sony.

 

PS3 has a completely different architecture than PS4, if backwards compatibility would be possible, it would've happened already. And since PS5 will be based on PS4 architecture, there's little chance for it to emulate previous generations.

[Silencer0004]

1 minute ago, fbdbh said:

 

PS3 has a completely different architecture than PS4, if backwards compatibility would be possible, it would've happened already. And since PS5 will be based on PS4 architecture, there's little chance for it to emulate previous generations.

 

I don't buy this excuse. Yes, the architecture is (very) different. But if some random guys on the internet are able to develope a mediocre PS3 emulator for PC, the creator of the original PS3 and holder of every source-code should be able to develope an emulator for the upcoming generation with hardware like 100x faster than the original PS3. It might be a challenge, sure, but you can't argue that it's impossible.

[fbdbh]

7 minutes ago, Silencer0004 said:

 

I don't buy this excuse. Yes, the architecture is (very) different. But if some random guys on the internet are able to develope a mediocre PS3 emulator for PC, the creator of the original PS3 and holder of every source-code should be able to develope an emulator for the upcoming generation with hardware like 100x faster than the original PS3. It might be a challenge, sure, but you can't argue that it's impossible.

 

That's not exactly that simple, PCs are more versatile. They could do it, but there are multiple problems:

• Do the games run on higher framerate? Would that cause more problems? (Such as the double item degradation bug in Dark Souls 2 when the framerate was doubled)
• Could they ABSOLUTELY guarantee that ALL games ran well and as intended?
• What are they going to do with games that doesn't support trophies? Because Sony now has a mandatory trophy support for all games.
• Do they have exclusivity rights for that generation only? Could the ability of playing some PS3 games cause legal troubles for Sony?

Because when it comes to Sony, they need to get all of this this right or don't bother. "Random guys on the internet" don't guarantee any of this, and you will see incredibly problematic emulations. All games are being optimized separately, still.

 

And the PS5 hardware isn't that strong you might believe, either. Recently they confirmed that it won't even play PS4 games faster (except for load times), but it will keep them on the same graphical and framerate level, and exactly the same.

Edited June 6, 2019 by fbdbh

[Silencer0004]

1 minute ago, fbdbh said:

 

That's not exactly that simple, PCs are more versatile. They could do it, but there are multiple problems:

• Do the game run on higher framerate? Would that cause more problems? (Such as the double item degradation bug in Dark Souls 2 when the framerate was doubled)
• Could they ABSOLUTELY guarantee that ALL games ran well and as intended?
• What are they going to do with games that doesn't support trophies? Because Sony now has a mandatory trophy support for all games.
• Do they have exclusivity rights for that generation only? Could the ability of playing some PS3 games cause legal troubles for Sony?

Because when it comes to Sony, they need to get all of this this right or don't bother. "Random guys on the internet" don't guarantee any of this, and you will see incredibly problematic emulations. All games are being optimized separately, still.

 

And the PS5 hardware isn't that strong you might believe, either. Recently they confirmed that it won't even play PS4 games faster (except for load times), but it will keep them on the same graphical and framerate level, and exactly the same.

 

1. If you emulate the PS3 as it is, you wouldn't change the addressable ressources. Therefore, the framerate would be the same or could be limited to 30fps by default.

2. Same as above but I agree that they had some testing to do.

3. 95% of the PS3 Games have trophies and there are many games on PS4 without trophy support from the PS2 generation. Seems like Sony doesn't bother as long as you pay for it again.

4. That's the only valid point but this does not apply to their own games.

[Mori]

5 minutes ago, fbdbh said:

And the PS5 hardware isn't that strong you might believe, either. Recently they confirmed that it won't even play PS4 games faster (except for load times), but it will keep them on the same graphical and framerate level, and exactly the same.

 

Source?

[fbdbh]

https://www.vg247.com/2019/06/03/ps5-backwards-compatibility-patent-running-legacy-games-on-new-hardware/

 

They are experimenting with performance boost, though.

5 hours ago, Silencer0004 said:

 

2. Same as above but I agree that they had some testing to do.

 

 

2. This also has to be done by the developers, who might have been long gone. Sony can't access source codes and has no right to mess with them. 

[scemopagliaccioh]

On 5/6/2019 at 11:19 AM, fbdbh said:

 

 

 

Except, this is not true. That would be a dream!

 

Just a quick rundown of titles you can't play on your PlayStation 4: (some of them are on PC and Xbox, but that's not the point, especially for trophy hunters):

• Red Dead Redemption
• Killzone trilogy
• Resistance trilogy
• LittleBigPlanet 1-2
• Demon's Souls
• Ratchet & Clank future series
• Mass Effect trilogy
• Dragon Age 1-2
• Dead Space trilogy
• Metal Gear Solid 2, 3, Peace Walker, 4, Rising
• Ninja Gaiden 1, 2, 3, Yaiba Z
• Heavenly Sword
• Enslaved
• God of War 1, 2, A, GoS, CoP
• Any Sly Cooper game
• and so on

I wouldn't call DA2 successful, a good deal of titles you're referring to aren't even ps3 games, and some others like RDR can be played on PSNow. Demon's Souls hurts, but frankly, I'd rather avoid having another lazy remaster like Dark Souls 1, especially if it reminds me of the cut contents, which we'll never  see.

I agree with you, regarding the ps2  era, I considered it the best Playstation era, but "remastering" ps2 games "remastered" already on the ps3 has become a joke, the industry needs to focus more on new things, be it IP or sequels.

Edited June 6, 2019 by scemopagliaccioh

[Gommes_]

On 5.6.2019 at 3:56 AM, djb5f said:

People can crap on this generation and there are valid concerns that a certain formula for games is being overused for both story/game progression and DLC/microtransactions (no putting the genie back in the bottle on that one).

 

But there is a reason that my PS3 sits and collects dust despite an ample backlog. I prefer PS4 games.  Some of it is technology-based but they are generally deeper, more immersive experiences.  Gaming continues to evolve.  I wish I was a kid now, instead of when NES came out, it was fun, but fun like riding a moped.

 

Go back and try playing a PS1 or PS2 game now.  Largely, they were so simple/basic.  PS3, the games got deeper/longer but still pales in comparison to what we see today.

 

Perhaps, we want the games to evolve faster, which is fine, but we are clearly ahead of last gen.

 

 

I kinda made the same topic as OP quite some time ago just with a slightly different focus. I have to say, the PS3 generation was much better. If you care you can check out all the games and especially new IPs that came out during that generation in this thread. And yes, even the first years were much better imo.

 

 

 

[Valtekken173]

On 4/6/2019 at 8:32 AM, Spaz said:

Then you're just lazy, because you can't bother to do your research to find a hidden gem.

 

I say this all the time to people on Twitter who bitch about modern music. They need to do their research and not just assume all modern rap is the same gimmicky garbage.

 

I agree with most that Lil Wayne, Future and Kayne West are all shit. Their music sucks, and one easily thinks Hip Hop is basically that because they listened to their music and didn't listen to anything else. There are rappers out there who do good music, but it's probably likely they're not the ones selling millions of records and setting some YouTube phenomenon because their music video got over 100 million views.

 

There is shit in the underground music scene, but there's some pretty good music that I frankly think is better than most of anything out today that is mainstream. And I feel the same way with video games.

 

People who say they're tired of the AAA game industry need to look beyond what Ubisoft, EA, Activision, Square and Konami put out. Capcom has made some good stuff but they still make a lot of crap, I just think they're a little better than the others. The Yakuza series looks far more interesting and I hope to play those games at some point.

 

Of course, I have a soft spot for the older games, because they were from a simpler time. That's just me.

Of course I am lazy. Do you expect me to work for my entertainment/leisure time, in addition to uni assignments and exams (and eventually, later, work)?
 

And I'm not proper tired of the AAA industry, I just wish there were more variety in it...but when the AAA game industry puts out a real masterpiece it blows any indie out of the water completely, that's the shit I like to play.

[fbdbh]

6 hours ago, scemopagliaccioh said:

some others like RDR can be played on PSNow

 

Well, not in Hungary ?

[AJ_Radio]

10 hours ago, scemopagliaccioh said:

I wouldn't call DA2 successful, a good deal of titles you're referring to aren't even ps3 games, and some others like RDR can be played on PSNow. Demon's Souls hurts, but frankly, I'd rather avoid having another lazy remaster like Dark Souls 1, especially if it reminds me of the cut contents, which we'll never  see.

I agree with you, regarding the ps2  era, I considered it the best Playstation era, but "remastering" ps2 games "remastered" already on the ps3 has become a joke, the industry needs to focus more on new things, be it IP or sequels.

 

I’m all for retouching a classic like Dark Souls, but the remaster was done a lot better than the job Ubisoft has put out. 

 

All they did with the Assassins Creed games was give them a higher resolution. I experienced no increase in frame rate when I played the Ezio trilogy. They look better, but that’s basically it. 

 

You need to say new IPs that introduce a new way of gaming. Something that is original and captivating. God of War 2018, Marvel’s Spider-Man and Days Gone aren’t anything original, I’m sorry. They take a format that’s already been done dozens of times in other games. 

 

People like to say Assassins Creed Odyssey is one of the best games they ever played. What I see is a giant open world sandbox that makes Origins look small in comparison. Bigger and more content doesn’t mean better. 

 

Out of what I’ve seen, the Japanese developers have done a better job creating something original and stimulating. New sequels aren’t going to cut it if all they do is make the same tired format, like what a lot of open world games have been doing. 

 

6 hours ago, Valtekken173 said:

Of course I am lazy. Do you expect me to work for my entertainment/leisure time, in addition to uni assignments and exams (and eventually, later, work)?
 

And I'm not proper tired of the AAA industry, I just wish there were more variety in it...but when the AAA game industry puts out a real masterpiece it blows any indie out of the water completely, that's the shit I like to play.

 

So it’s too much work to take five 

minutes of your time doing an internet research?

Edited June 7, 2019 by Spaz

[Valtekken173]

13 hours ago, Spaz said:

 

I’m all for retouching a classic like Dark Souls, but the remaster was done a lot better than the job Ubisoft has put out. 

 

All they did with the Assassins Creed games was give them a higher resolution. I experienced no increase in frame rate when I played the Ezio trilogy. They look better, but that’s basically it. 

 

You need to say new IPs that introduce a new way of gaming. Something that is original and captivating. God of War 2018, Marvel’s Spider-Man and Days Gone aren’t anything original, I’m sorry. They take a format that’s already been done dozens of times in other games. 

 

People like to say Assassins Creed Odyssey is one of the best games they ever played. What I see is a giant open world sandbox that makes Origins look small in comparison. Bigger and more content doesn’t mean better. 

 

Out of what I’ve seen, the Japanese developers have done a better job creating something original and stimulating. New sequels aren’t going to cut it if all they do is make the same tired format, like what a lot of open world games have been doing. 

 

 

So it’s too much work to take five 

minutes of your time doing an internet research?

My tastes are finicky as fuck and the indie scene puts out WAY too much crap for me to efficiently find a thing to like in 5 minutes, so things aren't like you're making them out to be.

[AJ_Radio]

On 6/7/2019 at 7:40 AM, Valtekken173 said:

My tastes are finicky as fuck and the indie scene puts out WAY too much crap for me to efficiently find a thing to like in 5 minutes, so things aren't like you're making them out to be.

 

We can bitch about this all you want... but there is good stuff out there. 

 

As I said before someone who never really listened to rap before listens to rappers like Lil Wayne and Future and say they either suck or they’re the greatest. 

 

I found underground rappers who can blow chunks out of both these guys, they just happen to be the most successful and popular. 

 

Indies aren’t your thing. Fine, for a lot of people don’t bother with them and just play a few AAA games a year. But don’t try to discredit the indie scene as a whole. There’s a lot of crap as there always has been. There’s good games worth playing. 

 

I’m just going to drop this here because there’s no point talking about this any further.

[fbdbh]

9 hours ago, Spaz said:

I’m just going to drop this here because there’s no point talking about this any further.

 

I kinda get that point though, so okay, fine, let's talk indies... and then I go there, and be like: "I like 3D platformers, survival horror and stylish hack'n'slash". And then the indie scene is like... "uhh... here's my 2D soulslike metroidvania, care to take a look?"

[Valtekken173]

19 hours ago, Spaz said:

 

We can bitch about this all you want... but there is good stuff out there. 

 

As I said before someone who never really listened to rap before listens to rappers like Lil Wayne and Future and say they either suck or they’re the greatest. 

 

I found underground rappers who can blow chunks out of both these guys, they just happen to be the most successful and popular. 

 

Indies aren’t your thing. Fine, for a lot of people don’t bother with them and just play a few AAA games a year. But don’t try to discredit the indie scene as a whole. There’s a lot of crap as there always has been. There’s good games worth playing. 

 

I’m just going to drop this here because there’s no point talking about this any further.

I didn't discredit the whole scene, though. I very accurately said that a fuckton of indies are low budget and low quality and I can't be arsed to sift through the pile to find the few diamonds. It's a completely different thing. Besides, my initial point was that I wanted more variety in Sony's (and in general in the AAA/AA space's) lineup, so I'm not even sure why indies were brought up in the first place.

[AJ_Radio]

10 hours ago, fbdbh said:

 

I kinda get that point though, so okay, fine, let's talk indies... and then I go there, and be like: "I like 3D platformers, survival horror and stylish hack'n'slash". And then the indie scene is like... "uhh... here's my 2D soulslike metroidvania, care to take a look?"

 

I completely understand if indies aren’t your thing. They generally cater to a niche audience when I think you and the guy I was arguing with are truthfully more into the mainstream stuff, AAA games. 

 

But honestly I think a lot of AAA games have gotten old and stale in terms of innovation. The PS2 and early PS3 generations had more variety. 

 

Death Stranding which was a game I was anticipating is already looking to be yet another HBO drama spectacle because apparently that’s what sells these days. It’s already offering preorder bonuses which I absolutely hate and now I’m just not that interested in it. 

 

I delve in the indie market because at least I can experience something different.  I feel that a few indie games I’ve played are deeper and more difficult to master as opposed to AAA games which are generally catered to a general audience. 

 

Japanese developers I think are helping keeping gaming alive and some stuff like Sekiro does keep me interested. But as far as western companies go I feel that a lot of creativity and passion has virtually disappeared in place of investors and profit margins. Partly because video games now cost a lot more to make than they did back in the PS2 era, and a lot of genres that once occupied the spotlight are either dead or have gone indie. 

 

I loved Tony Hawk growing up. Watched the X Games and played basically all the Tony Hawk games. Now the franchise is dead and there’s virtually no real skateboarding game for me to play, other than Pro Skater 5 but I think I’ll pass on that. That’s just one genre out of a number that were popular that I feel has largely vanished. 

 

Dante’s Inferno looks fun and has that fix that has been mostly missing this generation. Vanquish is another game that looks to be quite good and I look forward to playing it. 

Edited June 12, 2019 by Spaz

[Valtekken173]

10 hours ago, fbdbh said:

 

I kinda get that point though, so okay, fine, let's talk indies... and then I go there, and be like: "I like 3D platformers, survival horror and stylish hack'n'slash". And then the indie scene is like... "uhh... here's my 2D soulslike metroidvania, care to take a look?"

Ironically, for two of those genres there are very good indie examples: A hat in time and Lost Soul Aside. Maybe not the best genres to pick? Lol

[fbdbh]

8 hours ago, Spaz said:

Vanquish is another game that looks to be quite good and I look forward to playing it. 

 

It's amazing. Aaaaand yet another game that's stuck on the PS3 with it's shitty framerate. I'd be much-much more happier with the PS4 if high framerate required action games were ported from last gen.

[AJ_Radio]

30 frames per second isn’t terrible. 60 frames per second is ideal but 30 frames isn’t as awful as people make it out to be. 

 

Anything below that isn’t acceptable. But the limitations are there because of the limitations.

Edited June 12, 2019 by Spaz

[fbdbh]

10 minutes ago, Spaz said:

30 frames per second isn’t terrible. 60 frames per second is ideal but 30 frames isn’t as awful as people make it out to be. 

 

Anything below that isn’t acceptable. But the limitations are there because of the limitations.

 

In a fast-paced action game it actually matters, at least on a game-feel level. It's day and night, really. But with PS3, when we talk about 30 frames per second, we really talk about 24-29.

 

So when they keep announcing remasters like Ni No Kuni, which is perfect as it is, instead of games that actually benefit from better framerate... I'm like, ugggh.

[Mori]

9 hours ago, Spaz said:

Death Stranding which was a game I was anticipating is already looking to be yet another HBO drama spectacle because apparently that’s what sells these days.

 

I am sorry, what? How did you come to this conclusion? There are tons of rumours and speculations but still, nobody really knows what to expect in November. I think its funny that people expect games to reinvent the wheel and then DS comes up and you cannot really categorize it into a genre after seeing four or five trailers and apparently its still no good. 

 

I dont know about you guys, but I think its really exciting and a breath of fresh air, compared to other AAA games that usually can be defined instantly after a reveal trailer drops.

 

 

Regarding topic, I dont know how someone could be tired of this generation. You have more game offers than ever, more variety than ever, more, more, more. There is more to gaming than the annual Ubisoft/Activision releases.

[Arcesius]

11 minutes ago, Mori said:

Regarding topic, I dont know how someone could be tired of this generation. You have more game offers than ever, more variety than ever, more, more, more. There is more to gaming than the annual Ubisoft/Activision releases.

 

Totally agree with this. Personally, it might be because I don't have the urge to play every single game that gets released, but there definitely is a large variety of games to choose from. I'm sure that if I forced myself to play all 320+ Assassins Creed games I would get tired as well, but there is so much more to discover than sequels to franchises that have been around forever! 

 

Also, I read that some ignore the indie market and that's totally fine, but you're missing out on some of the best games to be found on PSN. Only because you choose to ignore those games doesn't mean they don't exist, and saying that there ain't enough variety in gaming while only focusing on AAA releases invalidates the argument. 

 

i can only speak for myself, but I am having a blast with the current generation, discovering fantastic and varied games. And don't forget PSVR, which brings fantastic games like Beat Saber to the mix!

 

Edited June 12, 2019 by Arcesus7

[AJ_Radio]

39 minutes ago, fbdbh said:

 

In a fast-paced action game it actually matters, at least on a game-feel level. It's day and night, really. But with PS3, when we talk about 30 frames per second, we really talk about 24-29.

 

So when they keep announcing remasters like Ni No Kuni, which is perfect as it is, instead of games that actually benefit from better framerate... I'm like, ugggh.

 

The PC market is the best choice for that. 

 

Even Wolfenstein II: The New Colossus, which actually runs reasonably well on a PS4, benefits more so on a PC, very notably the aiming controls because you can be a lot more precise with a mouse and keyboard as opposed to a controller. 

 

What grinds my gears is when remasters do nothing but do slight touch ups to the graphics. As I found out when I played The Ezio Auditore Trilogy (AC2, AC:B, AC: R) a couple years ago. 

 

17 minutes ago, Mori said:

Regarding topic, I dont know how someone could be tired of this generation. You have more game offers than ever, more variety than ever, more, more, more. There is more to gaming than the annual Ubisoft/Activision releases.

 

That’s true if you look at the indie game market. 

 

But as far as the big western releases are concerned there isn’t anything that really interests me as they typically take what other games have done and not really innovate. 

 

More doesn’t mean better. 

 

The Japanese have stuff I feel is more original and captivating. The big western releases have been open world, which we’ve seen dozens of times in other games to where the format is getting old.

[Chocolat_GiddyUp]

If you are tired, get your teddy bear and your blankey, and take a nap

 

Edited June 17, 2019 by Chocolate GiddyUp

[iriihutoR84]

We're a year before next gen starts so naturally there aren't many new announcements until they actually do announce the PS5. Microsoft basically didn't announce anything at E3 this year either. Same with Nintendo the year before the Switch launched. E3 was about Breath of the Wild which was mostly pushed as a Switch title, not for the Wii U. Wikipedia's article about E3 2012 mentions that Sony showcased already announced games and made a single new first party title reveal: Beyond: Two Souls. The Xbox 360 was nothing but low effort Kinect games in its twilight years. This is not abnormal and part of the console cycle. 

 

Personally, I would disagree about Sony's first party games not delivering. I've never cared much for them as a publisher before this gen really apart from some odd ducks like God of War 1-3, Shadow of the Colossus and Demon's Souls. This gen they have taken a giant leap and become one of the top publishers in the industry. Just plowed through some first party backlog and had a blast. They've gone from making good games to making important games in my opinion. PSVR was a game changer too unlike the stand-alone Move and brought some legitimately fantastic games to the table like Astro Bot, Déraciné and Until Dawn: Rush of Blood. All unique and creative titles. And I disagree that Ratchet & Clank, God of War (2018) and The Last of Us are anything alike. There aren't really that many perspectives to choose from if you want to make a blockbuster, it's first or third person. You will find those two perspectives dominating in mainstream games from virtually every single publisher: Nintendo, Microsoft, Bethesda, EA, Activision, Ubisoft etc.