Alihsan621

Should Big Leagues be a flaggable trophy?

528 posts in this topic

Imagine if you could cheat 4 trophies in every game you played.

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I think single trophies like this should be whitelisted or whatever, it’s an easy trophy and to me is the same as the gonespy thing that went down not too long ago. If it was a difficult trophy which took hours and hours of game time then fair enough but this one I think should be ok. 

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26 minutes ago, UNLEADED_BRONZE said:

Its achievable

Though mod menus

 

Yes, and that's what gets flagged. 

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Has anyone been working out those guide lines for whitelisting someone mentioned a few pages back?

 

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52 minutes ago, MMDE said:

Imagine if you could cheat 4 trophies in every game you played.

You could if you wanted to, theres nothing stopping anyone from doing that. Just dont care about the leaderboard😜.

Just now, Alihsan621 said:

Has anyone been working out those guide lines for whitelisting someone mentioned a few pages back?

 

The person stopped replying and the topic got ignored from that point onwards. 

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2 minutes ago, Alihsan621 said:

Has anyone been working out those guide lines for whitelisting someone mentioned a few pages back?

 

 

No. No one coherently made a set of guidelines to propose a whitelist that would encompass the conditions and the games currently being requested to be whitelisted as well as RDR. This is a group project, no one will be assigned to participate or lead it. If people really want it, they'll put in the effort and critical thinking necessary.

 

Feel free to take it over if you'd like to.

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On 6/19/2020 at 3:12 AM, CriptoNorge said:

Why not just remove the whole bo2 game from the leaderboards? Like you don’t get any points towards the leaderboards for this game. There no more illegitimate leaderboards. Problem solved. As for the precious ultra rare platinum people who got the ultra platinum in 2015 or before get to keep the rarity for there platinum frozen for those people. Then for people who earn it currently let it increase in percentage accordingly you can then distinguish people who got it in 2015 and people got it currently. I feel this is a win win for everyone. Nobody loses out. Just my thought on it anyways.


Haven’t read this thread in a while, but this makes a lot of sense to me.

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On 19/06/2020 at 9:12 AM, CriptoNorge said:

Why not just remove the whole bo2 game from the leaderboards? Like you don’t get any points towards the leaderboards for this game. There no more illegitimate leaderboards. Problem solved. As for the precious ultra rare platinum people who got the ultra platinum in 2015 or before get to keep the rarity for there platinum frozen for those people. Then for people who earn it currently let it increase in percentage accordingly you can then distinguish people who got it in 2015 and people got it currently. I feel this is a win win for everyone. Nobody loses out. Just my thought on it anyways.

I have to agree,this seems like a good idea.

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1 hour ago, DaivRules said:

 

Yes, and that's what gets flagged. 

At least some or most of ppl/gamers/users that used mods was either truthful about or not

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Posted (edited)

1 hour ago, charxsetsuna said:

You could if you wanted to, theres nothing stopping anyone from doing that. Just dont care about the leaderboard😜.

The person stopped replying and the topic got ignored from that point onwards. 

Because I made two seperate lists in that style and nohing really happened with them. 

1 hour ago, DaivRules said:

 

No. No one coherently made a set of guidelines to propose a whitelist that would encompass the conditions and the games currently being requested to be whitelisted as well as RDR. This is a group project, no one will be assigned to participate or lead it. If people really want it, they'll put in the effort and critical thinking necessary.

 

Feel free to take it over if you'd like to.

I think there have been quite a few lists by now, I'm just not sure anymore what is even wrong with those? It would help if you could at least point out which points you like, reprhase the things that you find too imprecise etc. We won't be getting anywhere if everyone just says no without even stating why. 

 

2 hours ago, MMDE said:

Imagine if you could cheat 4 trophies in every game you played.

Yeah, not really realistic considering this is the only game in over 11 years of trophy hunting now, where you are able to unlock a mod menu completely by yourself without having to use a CFW. So I really don't think this will be a regular occurence. I mean at the moment it would be like 3 games, including GTA V and RDR. 

 

I mean what is even the difference between Conan Exile and that Jax and Dexter game and this case? An in-game mode menu should be considered cheating too, if everyones argument is that you don't even have to complete the original requierements with this method. 

 

 

Like I said before, this is just suppsoed to be used for Big Leagues as the very last trophy, not for all these people that unlocking like half the story trophies alongside it. I know this an unorthodox case, but we can't always see everyhting so black and white, otherwise there would be arguments against other things like glitches/ downgrading patches/ computer programs etc. 

 

I just don't understand what anyone would even be afraid of if those games were whitelisted. It's not like there will be a similair method found in every 2nd game from that point on and I don't even think that so many people would even go back for some of these old games. 

Edited by CriesOfFurya
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59 minutes ago, DaivRules said:

 

No. No one coherently made a set of guidelines to propose a whitelist that would encompass the conditions and the games currently being requested to be whitelisted as well as RDR. This is a group project, no one will be assigned to participate or lead it. If people really want it, they'll put in the effort and critical thinking necessary.

 

Feel free to take it over if you'd like to.

Can I ask you a question?  please answer honestly. Will a list of guidelines ever be good enough for you? Is it even worth us trying to make one if it keeps being shot down?

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4 minutes ago, charxsetsuna said:

Can I ask you a question?  please answer honestly. Will a list of guidelines ever be good enough for you? Is it even worth us trying to make one if it keeps being shot down?


You’re not doing it for me. You’re proposing the current business owner (Sly) to spend his resources implementing a change you want. If you can’t make a serious proposal, you won’t be taken seriously. 
 

Right now you’re saying you want something, but you want someone else to put in all the effort of thinking about all the specifics. 
 

No one shot you down. Don’t be dramatic. 

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Posted (edited)

6 minutes ago, DaivRules said:


You’re not doing it for me. You’re proposing the current business owner (Sly) to spend his resources implementing a change you want. If you can’t make a serious proposal, you won’t be taken seriously. 
 

Right now you’re saying you want something, but you want someone else to put in all the effort of thinking about all the specifics. 
 

No one shot you down. Don’t be dramatic. 

I never said you did shoot me down , I'm talking about the people before me who all proposed ideas that were shot  down.

And yes I did propose a serious idea,

 

1) you must not have cfw on your own console,theater mode and red dead is fine.

2)if your using theater mode or red dead then you must record yourslef doing it as proof.

3)must be accessible to everyone.

(Red dead and theater mode are just examples)

 

Or a second idea.

 

1)have two leaderboards, one that allows modded lobbies and one that doesnt.

 

Or the idea I quoted just a few posts back where people who owned the plat without it has their rarity frozen.

 

Or the idea where we just remove this game from the leaderboards all together.

 

Theres been so many ideas proposed by so many people , none have gotten anywhere.

 

Notice I said "us" Not "me".

Edited by charxsetsuna
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12 minutes ago, charxsetsuna said:

I never said you did shoot me down , I'm talking about the people before me who all proposed ideas that were shot  down.

And yes I did propose a serious idea,

 

1) you must not have cfw on your own console,theater mode and red dead is fine.

2)if your using theater mode or red dead then you must record yourslef doing it as proof.

3)must be accessible to everyone.

(Red dead and theater mode are just examples)

 

Or a second idea.

 

1)have two leaderboards, one that allows modded lobbies and one that doesnt.

 

Or the idea I quoted just a few posts back where people who owned the plat without it has their rarity frozen.

 

Or the idea where we just remove this game from the leaderboards all together.

 

Theres been so many ideas proposed by so many people , none have gotten anywhere.

 

Notice I said "us" Not "me".


Look at how detailed the flagging rules are and what they consider. Do your proposals provide that level of detail? Do you propose methods for testing what you’re proposing?

 

If you’re not committed to fleshing out one of your ideas in more detail and just throw out several ideas without explanations for how they affect or are affected by the rest of the site, how do you expect these to be implemented?

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5 minutes ago, DaivRules said:


Look at how detailed the flagging rules are and what they consider. Do your proposals provide that level of detail? Do you propose methods for testing what you’re proposing?

 

If you’re not committed to fleshing out one of your ideas in more detail and just throw out several ideas without explanations for how they affect or are affected by the rest of the site, how do you expect these to be implemented?

Let's flesh out my first idea then, even though I fleshed it out a few pages back.

 

1)no cfw installed on your own console (simple enough to understand.)

2) must be accessible to everyone without asking a modder.( think red dead where all you had to do was go into a lobby and shoot some corpses )

3) record yourslef doing it as proof in disputes, it's not like you do it by accident so its not unreasonable to ask people to record it. Use anything that has a camera.

4) the method must be tested by a CRT member to confirm it works.

 

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2 minutes ago, UNLEADED_BRONZE said:

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

I dont think your quoting worked 

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8 minutes ago, charxsetsuna said:

Let's flesh out my first idea then, even though I fleshed it out a few pages back.

 

1)no cfw installed on your own console (simple enough to understand.)

2) must be accessible to everyone without asking a modder.( think red dead where all you had to do was go into a lobby and shoot some corpses )

3) record yourslef doing it as proof in disputes, it's not like you do it by accident so its not unreasonable to ask people to record it. Use anything that has a camera.

4) the method must be tested by a CRT member to confirm it works.

 


Again, I ask you for a repeatable testing method for these same initial ideas you present that are possible by the Cheater Removers.

 

How do we get definitive proof of number one?

 

What are the scenarios that are or are not permitted for number 2?

 

Etc...

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Dude, i got this trophy On my original account when it came out and i STILL couldn't care less.....people wanna hack a bronze, Let em. Fuckin pathetic to trip about a dead trophy that countless others cried over. It won't bring it back, lock this shite.....

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8 minutes ago, DaivRules said:


Again, I ask you for a repeatable testing method for these same initial ideas you present that are possible by the Cheater Removers.

 

How do we get definitive proof of number one?

 

What are the scenarios that are or are not permitted for number 2?

 

Etc...

Would recording your ps4 screen prove that theres no cfw, honestly I dont know what cfw looks like. I pass this idea on to people who know more.

 

As for point 2 ,its simple. Do you need a modder to randomly pop it for you? If so it's not ok.

 

If all you need to do is go to theater mode or shoot corpses then it's ok 

Basically if you need to get lucky by running into a modder=not allowed.

Exploit anyone can use without any element of luck=allowed.

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Posted (edited)

wow, this thread is not what I expected at all...having been a vocal advocate for the usage of gonespy and also whitelisting, I'm curious about this theater mode method for the big leagues trophy and how it works...furthermore, I see a distinct difference between run like the wind and big leagues which would classify them differently in my opinion...I'd almost be willing to argue that using theater mode (as far as I understand its application) should be considered as a fair way of earning the trophy in terms of leaderboard participation...

 

I think for an acceptable method to be considered, it should meet several criteria...these are not set in stone as I haven't given it much thought, but a 2-minute brainstorm led me to:

 

1 -  everyone should have access to the feature that allows the process of unlocking the trophy without modifying their console or game's state and should also have the ability to activate it freely and independently...it should appear as though it is a permanent feature...another way to see this is that there should be no restrictions to anyone playing the game with a regular console and copy of the game in earning their trophy...

 

2 - the trophy must be unobtainable...

 

3 - after activating said feature, the actual earning of the trophy must be according to its original requirements...

 

this would mean that big leagues would qualify as "legit" and, for the time being, run like the wind would not...lists that appear auto-popped in games like blops 2 where a hacker could force this upon players unwillingly, and trophies that require someone to actively use cfw to obtain like run like the wind should be considered for whitelisting imo...why the distinction?...I guess to me it feels like a public vs private domain type thing and public feels like the only way that is fair to any and everyone who wants to earn the trophy...

 

as far as I'm concerned things like dev menus, turbo controllers, rdr, modded weapons, etc. do not belong in this category of discussion since they are different and practically impossible to distinguish as earned illegitimately based on time stamps alone...

 

just trying to post some unique ideas here...not particularly interested in another fruitless "whitelist thread" type debate that goes around in circles indefinitely...much like it though, I don't see there being a right answer here...

Edited by ProfBambam55
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Posted (edited)

If I have gotten banned for this stupid ass thing that is absolutely not my fault and there was nothing I could do about it, why did I get banned and then there are some other people who got in 2019 and 2020 who haven’t gotten banned for the leaderboards? What makes them different from me or anyone else who gets bullshitted by something out of their control?

Edited by riolaaaey
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Posted (edited)

22 hours ago, ProfBambam55 said:

this would mean that big leagues would qualify as "legit" and, for the time being, run like the wind would not...lists that appear auto-popped in games like blops 2 where a hacker could force this upon players unwillingly, and trophies that require someone to actively use cfw to obtain like run like the wind should be considered for whitelisting imo...why the distinction?...I guess to me it feels like a public vs private domain type thing and public feels like the only way that is fair to any and everyone who wants to earn the trophy...

 

I see your thinking here, and I get what you want to do. You want people to be able to earn the trophy legitimately again. As I understand the trophy was related to "league play", whatever that is. It sounds like something that should be a global thing, but no longer is. Let's say we could come to some agreement about how it could be earned legitimately eventually, some method available to everyone and would relatively similar to what it originally was like.

 

Even if this was implemented, be aware this will not be applied backwards. That means anyone doing it before any such method is agreed upon is not considered legitimately.

 

I would also like to stress that about 90%, if not way more, of the people who has earned the trophy after it became unavailable has earned other trophies illegitimately too. None of these would fall under such an agreement either.

 

On 6/30/2020 at 10:12 PM, charxsetsuna said:

You could if you wanted to, theres nothing stopping anyone from doing that. Just dont care about the leaderboard1f61c.png.

 

On 6/30/2020 at 11:09 PM, CriesOfFurya said:

Yeah, not really realistic considering this is the only game in over 11 years of trophy hunting now, where you are able to unlock a mod menu completely by yourself without having to use a CFW. So I really don't think this will be a regular occurence. I mean at the moment it would be like 3 games, including GTA V and RDR. 

 

I think you missed the actual point I was making. My fault probably, because I didn't refer to the relevant posts. It was a response to the comments about the requirement of 5 cheated trophies to flag a trophy list.

Edited by MMDE
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The majority of people just use a jailbreak system to put the big leagues back to 2015 or before which should be flagged more than someone accidently getting it whilst playing Bo2 in 2020 

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Posted (edited)

 

On 6/30/2020 at 11:09 PM, CriesOfFurya said:

Yeah, not really realistic considering this is the only game in over 11 years of trophy hunting now, where you are able to unlock a mod menu completely by yourself without having to use a CFW. So I really don't think this will be a regular occurence. I mean at the moment it would be like 3 games, including GTA V and RDR. 

 

I mean what is even the difference between Conan Exile and that Jax and Dexter game and this case? An in-game mode menu should be considered cheating too, if everyones argument is that you don't even have to complete the original requierements with this method. 

 

 

Like I said before, this is just suppsoed to be used for Big Leagues as the very last trophy, not for all these people that unlocking like half the story trophies alongside it. I know this an unorthodox case, but we can't always see everyhting so black and white, otherwise there would be arguments against other things like glitches/ downgrading patches/ computer programs etc. 

 

I just don't understand what anyone would even be afraid of if those games were whitelisted. It's not like there will be a similair method found in every 2nd game from that point on and I don't even think that so many people would even go back for some of these old games. 

 

I'm fairly certain the menu in BO2 is a mod menu where you need to modify files and resign saves etc. The menu you refer to in Jak & Daxter is a debug menu, which you can access by just inserting the correct button inputs. I've actually personally discovered two such debug menus, only shared one. :P The second game is a PS2 game which I hope gets a release with trophies, but it probably won't considering it's by Ubisoft.

 

29 minutes ago, riolaaaey said:

If I have gotten banned for this stupid ass thing that is absolutely not my fault and there was nothing I could do about it, why did I get banned and then there are some other people who got in 2019 and 2020 who haven’t gotten banned for the leaderboards? What makes them different from me or anyone else who gets bullshitted by something out of their control?

 

You're not banned. You're currently removed from the leaderboards, and can come back if you just hide the game, and it's not outside your control, that's why it's not ignored. I also think you knew it was unobtainable when it happened. You also got two other trophies illegitimately.

 

15 minutes ago, Delta-OscarMike said:

The majority of people just use a jailbreak system to put the big leagues back to 2015 or before which should be flagged more than someone accidently getting it whilst playing Bo2 in 2020 

 

If you think this way of getting the trophy is a good idea, you're sorely mistaken. When I have the time for it these days, I almost exclusively go for the people who edit timestamps.

Edited by MMDE
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