X-Cyberpunk

X-Cyberpunk's Dispute

83 posts in this topic

52 minutes ago, machaesthetic said:

Why not just make the user hide the game, but so long as he does, it doesn't count towards a flag? Obviously this should only apply to unique cases where they can provide evidence that they actually beat the game and accomplished the requirements and reasonable explanation of the glitch occurring. I think that is a good compromise since we don't know for sure it's legitimate, we are giving benefit of the doubt given the supplied proof, but it also ruins the integrity of the leaderboard when glitches/exploits occur that lead to impossible completion times and timestamps, whether these were malicious or accidental.

 

That's the idea behind the whitelist, but it's not a thing here yet. 

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9 hours ago, AffectatiousDonk said:

If he only has 1 more flag left then this is an even more important decision. If there is any grey here I don't see how you can not lift this. He is the #1 player in Australia by a margin with a basically unblemished record. I think he has more than earned some level of trust on this one.

 

Trust is irrelevant in the face of impossible timestamps that give him fastest achievement. Plus, if he has 1 flag already and is a team account, I would argue trust works against him.

2 hours ago, machaesthetic said:

Why not just make the user hide the game, but so long as he does, it doesn't count towards a flag?

 

Nothing stops him from unhiding it a few weeks later. If I'm not mistaken, once a flag is removed, that game cant be reflagged unless done by a mod.  Any regular user at that point will just not see the 'flag these trophies' button.

 

 

Impossible timestamps should be cut & dry. Isnt this part of the reason why there's a 3 flag leniency - Alleged once in a lifetime glitches?

Edited by AJ_-_808
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1 hour ago, AJ_-_808 said:

Nothing stops him from unhiding it a few weeks later. If I'm not mistaken, once a flag is removed, that game cant be reflagged unless done by a mode.  Any regular user at that point will just not see the 'flag these trophies' button.

 

 

Impossible timestamps should be cut & dry. Isnt this part of the reason why there's a 3 flag leniency - Alleged once in a lifetime glitches?

You are correct .

 

and you are correct...

 

'nuff said...

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15 hours ago, AuroraHistoire said:

Is the cheater removal team a democracy? I would like to know about the lesser know facts of the position. Also, I interpreted the official unofficial vote as 1 keep, 1 lift, 1 a white list feature would be nice.

 

I looked at all the data and I am not intelligent enough to do anything useful with it. Sorry, I can only share my thoughts and opinions on the matter.

 

Should claiming your illegitimate list was caused by a 1-1000 glitch and providing reasonable supporting evidence be grounds for getting lifted? Would it be a good practice to allow this practice going forward?

 

Holding the line and keeping it off the leaderboard is good practice. The list is illegitimate and should be treated as any other illegitimate list. The victums of Call of Duty and Grand Theft Auto hackers had their lists removed because they are illegitimate, despite the user not cheating. I don't see how this is any different from those other cases. Anything that is illegitimate should be removed, regardless of circumstances.

 

Glitches are okay by the official PSNP rules and this was, supposedly, a glitch. Despite there being no other know cases of this glitch, it should be treated the same as any other. The original poster did provide evidence to back up their story. The safe call would be to let them go free. It is better to let a cheater go free sometimes then convict a rule abiding PSNP member who just unlucky. If they are a cheater, they will keep cheating, mess up again and get caught. Even if they're a cheater, maybe they will stop after this close call and redeem themselves.

 

I'm frankly conflicted on this dispute. The white list system would be the best solution but we don't have it. We could keep this dispute open until that option exists or retroactively give the original poster the privilege. Hold the line or let it go? The result could shape the future or everyone will forget in a week.

 

It's a 60-40 for me. The 60 is in favor of letting him go. At the moment, there isn't any hard evidence supporting that the original poster is a cheater and/or they're lying. To my knowledge, they're 'dirty laundery' hasn't surfaced, therefore they're either really good at cheating or a honest rule abiding PSNP member. This situation is 'very odd' according to the experts, therefore I'm not confident to let them walk free. I feel like we are missing something but I'm not sure what the 'something' is.

 

In case you wonder, if this gets lifted, it will be less fun to experience this "glitch" again in the future, and the disputer better watch better out for it in the future. If this is a thing that happens again, we'll likely apply both flags.

 

I'm not going to go into all that many details about why I think it should be lifted public, but it's safe to assume I've talked with the other mods in private already. The evidence in this case does affect my opinion, but what they explain is the reason for the trophies being gone doesn't really make sense. I also wonder if the evidence can be tampered with to match what we see, and unfortunately, I think I did figure out a way.

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10 hours ago, Nitro said:

He has a game already hacked on his profile. It's not crazy to think he has been using this software for a while. I mean, who knows, maybe some games he does (or someone whom is part of his team/pays to get trophies for him) uses this software from time to time?

Or it could be an early mistake, I got flagged for a game from 2010/2011 way before I knew about this website, and the leaderboards. But judging someone because he has a flag in the past with no strong evidence? I don’t think it’s a good thing imo.

He might have cheated this one or it may truly be a glitch I don’t know, but you can’t flag someone on something that is unknown because he already had 1 flag in the past.

 

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2 hours ago, DarkAnimaa said:

Or it could be an early mistake, I got flagged for a game from 2010/2011 way before I knew about this website, and the leaderboards. But judging someone because he has a flag in the past with no strong evidence? I don’t think it’s a good thing imo.

He might have cheated this one or it may truly be a glitch I don’t know, but you can’t flag someone on something that is unknown because he already had 1 flag in the past.

 

This isn't specifically a one person operation. So HE might not have used the software and done it, but someone ELSE may have on his account.

 

Moreover, the point of my post was its not crazy to think someone has a program that costs $60 if they have cheated before. It could've been a mistake, but there is no evidence between any of them to say he hasn't used it.

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10 hours ago, B1rvine said:

 

The problem is I can prove (see BamBam’s post, eerily similar) when someone does cheat, the result would be the same as what the OPs timestamps are. Essentially he’s trying to say his timestamp pattern, a known cheater pattern, and possibly the errors occurring, also a cheating issue, is a glitch. 

 

I do know he’s a team, and just all the information I already mentioned just puts OP in a bad light. As I said earlier, just because I don’t know how to recreate one aspect of this dispute — blurry photos that are possible forged, doesn’t mean we should ignore what is likely impossible, especially with evidence when the contrary is true.

 

The one piece of evidence that would help me determine if he had a trophy syncing error, or other game errors — basically the facts of his story — has been deleted.

 

I just can’t in good conscience remove this flag. 

 

 

That all seems logical. It sounds like there has been plenty of thought gone into it. Personally I thought the AU board had sort of died away but there is obviously still a little life left there. Keep up the good work.

Edited by AffectatiousDonk
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