Backwards Compatibility & Preserving Legacies

[TurtlePM]

14 hours ago, sepheroithisgod said:

I want to start off by saying many people really miss the point for a lot of remasters this gen.

 

It's to help newer gamers get their hands on classics.

 

Now I get it, if you're like me and keep up with gaming and all of the major releases, the ridiculous stream of remasters may seem overkill, but if you just got into gaming at some point this gen, you now have access to some really great games (and some really bad ports like Mafia 2).

 

 

I always defended that point of view about these remasters are for new players. However, after some years, after some many re-something, I got cosy with my PS4 and didn't want to play PS3 that much. So I ended up buy the same game on PS4, a game that was in a backlog for ages. I remember buying a Ni No Kuni game from someone on OLX (we used that website a lot in Portugal back in the day) for 20 euros, a game that was sold (in a Spanish Title in Portugal stores) for 70. It's my fault never picking up that game, but it was once again released on PS4.

So my doubt was: should I buy the same game again for the platform I use most or should I get some "boring" time with my PS3 to play that particular game. This is just an example, I had this feeling for a lot of videogames released in this era. That's why I "overreact" about it before, claiming Most games are remasters. I regret starting Bioshock Infinite or Saints Row 3 on PS3 :/ 

[Super-Fly Spider-Guy]

15 hours ago, majob said:

This is textbook marketing. Removing a product or service for a  period  only to "bring it back"

 

And Gamepass only ever has 100 titles at any given time, the bulk of which are just Microsoft first party games so the amount of unique offerings is actually much smaller. Even with complete Xbox one compatibility, the console doesn't have many of the titles that were made only available on the PS4 and Switch so it's debatable to claim they're coming out the gate with a larger library, especially when news on the ps5's own BC isn't concrete yet.

This post was so wrong that I had to come out of hiding to correct it.

 

1. Textbook marketing? They said they weren't adding anymore games at least until the next gen launches because they were focused on the next gen, they never said they were done, only that they were focusing on the next gen entirely right now, something you supposedly want them to do anyway.

2. Game Pass has around 250 at the moment in Australia and likely more in USA and other regions, so no. The official store has 376 games on there listed, though a few are doubles like Crackdown 3's SP and MP being listed separately, but well over "100 titles at any given time"

3. "The bulk of which are just Microsoft first party games"? Nope. Just scrolled through the first 50 or so to check and there was the Banjo trilogy, Crackdown 3, and the brand new Minecraft Dungeons... of those 3 things, Banjo is a N64 remake, Minecraft is multiplat, the only actual exclusive was Crackdown.

4. "Even with complete Xbox one compatibility, the console doesn't have many of the titles that were made only available on the PS4 and Switch" you're aware that 95% of the PS4 library is multiplats, right? And that those multiplats are, by definition of being *multi* platform, on more than one platform, ie, Xbox. The Switch, as much as I love the guy, has fuck all in the way of multiplats comparatively, he's the one with a limited selection. But no, almost all games you play on PS4, can be played on Xbox One, and then when you throw in the over 600 back compat titles (more than a quarter of the complete Xbox 360 library, which is pretty good when you consider how many games were cross gen and will never be back compat due to having an Xbox One version already, and how many were remastered / rereleased for Xbox One and also won't become back compat due to that), you're actually miles ahead of PlayStation 5 in raw numbers of compatible games. But go off, I guess.

5. "especially when news on the ps5's own BC isn't concrete yet" unless they're going to surprise us with another generation or two of back compat, and again, you're sitting here saying how useless back compat is, so even if they did, you can't flip flop and pretend it's worth something now when you've been shitting on it this whole time, unless they did that, the PS5 is 99.9999% just gonna work with PS4 games, and not even 100% of them at that, so no, you can't get anything extra, you can get MOST of the PS4 library to be back compat, and you will, as I just explained, be AT LEAST hundreds behind what the Series X is launching with out the gate day one at midnight.

 

...

 

Now for the whole thread response in general.

 

I bought an Xbox One SOLELY because of backward compatibility in 2016. They fucked the launch, I sold my 360 and got a PS4. They redeemed themselves, added an amazing feature I wanted, and kept adding to it. Game Pass as well is amazing now too. I'll be getting the Series X day one. I have years of Game Pass stacked up for next to nothing via some kickass deals, and I have tonnes of games that I picked up current gen to play on my Xbox One like Jedi Fallen Order and COD MW 2019, that I can't wait to replay in 4K on the Series X going from my humble OG Xbone model. And due to complete compatibility, I get to dump my current Xbox at the girlfriend's house at the end of the year and now I'll have all my games available there too via Game Pass. If the PS5 offers back compat beyond PS4, I will get it day one, but until then, I'll be waiting for Insomniac's Spider-Man 2 and not a single game will even get me to do a double take until then.

 

Xbox won this generation. Not in sales, but they won it. They took a piece of shit console launched by a fucking retard talking about TV this and sports that, and they turned it into something that almost everyone universally recognizes as the best value in gaming. And they are looking only to further that ideal into the next gen next year, I for one, cannot wait. 

[Dry_Plumbus]

53 minutes ago, Super-Fly Spider-Guy said:

Xbox won this generation. Not in sales, but they won it. They took a piece of shit console launched by a fucking retard talking about TV this and sports that, and they turned it into something that almost everyone universally recognizes as the best value in gaming. And they are looking only to further that ideal into the next gen next year, I for one, cannot wait. 

 

They "won" in the value department but they have no games. No NEW exclusive games. And as much as everyone bitches and whines about exclusive games are bad for some reasons that usually just boil down to "I want everything all the time no matter what console I own", they are the number #1 reason for alot of gamers to buy a specific console.

 

If I want to play the latest call of duty or whatever than it doesn't matter what console I buy. But if I want to play Spiderman? Horizon? The Last of Us?

 

No, all I get on xbox platform is a bunch of old games I already bought when they were on sale for cheap on PSN, or one of the 5 mediocre exclusive xbox titles. Ok lemme give one to Microsoft, I really enjoyed Gears 5 and Forza Horizons, which I played for FREE on a gamepass or whatever they call it trial on PC. Unsubscribe for 3 more years till there is the new Halo on there and that's all folks I just saved you hundreds of dollars.

Edited May 30, 2020 by Jables_The_Hutt

[majob]

2 hours ago, Super-Fly Spider-Guy said:

snip

When they stopped the service, they never mentioned a return date.

 

I actually have Gamepass and yes you're right they do have more than 100 games but you do know that  the Banjo Kazooie IP is owned by Microsoft yes because they own Rare and they also own Minecraft. I'd say at least 30% of Gamepass is nothing but Microsoft studio games with the rest being a smattering of indies and a handful of new games.

 

And the games I refer to are actually the japanese games that tend to not release on the Xbox, largely because it still sells like a joke there. The amount of exclusives available on the Xbox One is small which is partly why Sony outsold them, along with things like price and poor marketing.

 

And Microsoft laying claim to older titles being compatible day one doesn't give them a large edge, or much of an edge really as no system has ever made been successful for its ability to play older games. The PS2's marketing highpoint was that it was a cheap DVD player and the PS3 launch was actually muddied due to their inclusion of high quality BC. People make the feature to be a bigger factor than it actually is.

 

Xbox won? Well they certainly didn't fail, they've sold 50 million units after all, but won would be a stretch. They've had to focus less on their hardware line and more on streaming and digital services, not to mention making all of their titles available on PC actually harmed the brand more than it helped. Why buy an Xbox if you have a gaming PC?

[Super-Fly Spider-Guy]

8 hours ago, majob said:

When they stopped the service, they never mentioned a return date.

 

I actually have Gamepass and yes you're right they do have more than 100 games but you do know that  the Banjo Kazooie IP is owned by Microsoft yes because they own Rare and they also own Minecraft. I'd say at least 30% of Gamepass is nothing but Microsoft studio games with the rest being a smattering of indies and a handful of new games.

 

And the games I refer to are actually the japanese games that tend to not release on the Xbox, largely because it still sells like a joke there. The amount of exclusives available on the Xbox One is small which is partly why Sony outsold them, along with things like price and poor marketing.

 

And Microsoft laying claim to older titles being compatible day one doesn't give them a large edge, or much of an edge really as no system has ever made been successful for its ability to play older games. The PS2's marketing highpoint was that it was a cheap DVD player and the PS3 launch was actually muddied due to their inclusion of high quality BC. People make the feature to be a bigger factor than it actually is.

 

Xbox won? Well they certainly didn't fail, they've sold 50 million units after all, but won would be a stretch. They've had to focus less on their hardware line and more on streaming and digital services, not to mention making all of their titles available on PC actually harmed the brand more than it helped. Why buy an Xbox if you have a gaming PC?

Oh I do so miss online communication where I don't get called a dickhead, or default to calling the other guy a dickhead, so Imma try to approach this with a bit less of an aggressive looking style because re-reading my shit I seem a bit forward ayy. Anyway,

 

They didn't announce a date, no, but they said it would be back, that it had not been put on ice permanently. When KFC bust out a $5 box for a month and then get rid of it and say it's gone forever, that sucks... but they've done it a bunch (and canned one less than a month ago too, RIP), and every time without fail it's back again in 6 months or so. Saying something isn't coming back is a lot different to "well look we're focused on X right now, but we'll get back to Y when we're done with X some time soonish"

 

You can phrase it either way really. I can say it's a bunch of multiplats, you can say it's a bunch of Xbox first party stuff, we're not really wrong either of us. But if I was to play Senua (which I wouldn't, because for the record, did not grab me and I didn't bother finishing it), on Switch, I'm not playing an Xbox game per se. But honestly, I'd prefer all the Xbox first party stuff than ONLY third party stuff be on Game Pass. Think about the Sony stuff you're going to mention later, if Sony did Game Pass, you'd want them on there wouldn't you? It would be a major reason to get the service, wouldn't it?

 

I'll be 100%, Xbox's bullshit during and around the launch, hell pretty much everything until Spencer got in, is what sunk them. They fucked up hardcore and Sony had it easy from there, all they had to do was say "here's a box, it plays games, it's cheap(ish), go for it, fuckers!" and they did, and they stuck the landing great. Ideologically (which for this generation doesn't mean much but hopefully will affect next gen HARD) Xbox won the generation by constantly improving itself. While the PS4 has SINCE LAUNCH had trouble getting the store to load (usually won't at all) if the machine's been on for more than 10 minutes, had the same basic UI with no updates, had a shittier online experience (which they also upped the price on and halved the number of games included), and so on, Xbox has introduced Game Pass, backward compatibility, constant regular UI updates (RIP Snap though, you are missed), removed the need for Kinect and all that shit, made varying SKUs to provide more availability and competition, and so on. They've taken their image from the TV sport moron who says "if you don't have good internet, we still sell 360 consoles" to the image of the good guy, and Sony aren't going to have the advantage of taking on the idiot who dropped the ball HARD this time, they're going up against the guy who knows how bad they fucked up, and knows how easy and quick it is to fuck up again, and doesn't want to do it. 

 

"no system has ever made been successful for its ability to play older games" I mean back in the day a lot of people upgraded to the PS2 not just because of the DVD player, but because they knew they could keep buying games for their PS1 now, and when they have money for the PS2, all their shit will work on it. A LOT of people. 

 

Look I got all over the place, but I kind of covered the win in an earlier bit. I mean to really clarify, they lost this gen day one. What they've done is set themselves up to win the next gen. They won this gen in every single thing except sales (which realistically, though short term thinking here, is all that matters). Also hey, you didn't mention the Sony exclusives, that was the other post I'm about to reply to, sorry for lumping that in with you, I forgot where though so can't be arsed taking it out, but soz.

 

11 hours ago, Jables_The_Hutt said:

 

They "won" in the value department but they have no games. No NEW exclusive games. And as much as everyone bitches and whines about exclusive games are bad for some reasons that usually just boil down to "I want everything all the time no matter what console I own", they are the number #1 reason for alot of gamers to buy a specific console.

 

If I want to play the latest call of duty or whatever than it doesn't matter what console I buy. But if I want to play Spiderman? Horizon? The Last of Us?

 

No, all I get on xbox platform is a bunch of old games I already bought when they were on sale for cheap on PSN, or one of the 5 mediocre exclusive xbox titles. Ok lemme give one to Microsoft, I really enjoyed Gears 5 and Forza Horizons, which I played for FREE on a gamepass or whatever they call it trial on PC. Unsubscribe for 3 more years till there is the new Halo on there and that's all folks I just saved you hundreds of dollars.

No games... like all those Forza's (7 plus a standalone DLC this gen), Ryse, Sunset Overdrive, all the Halos (10 or so if you count all the individual MCC games), Gears 4/5/Tactics, Ori, Quantum Break, CUPHEAD, Crackdown (I liked it), Dead Rising 3 (fave one), RARE REPLAY, Killer Instinct, Wasteland, and so on... PS all of those are on Game Pass as well. But then you've got all the past entries in those series, and maaaaaany more that you can't play anywhere else via back compat, like for example, the original Star Wars Battlefront 2, since it went back compat it's been one of my most played games this generation. 

 

It doesn't matter where you play your multiplats, I mean objectively playing on XBOX (fuck, I typed it in caps to signify I meant the One X but then realized it just spells Xbox, fuck), anyway, playing on that is the best way, but I'm rocking the Xbox One SAD edition so fuck that too. But if I want to play Spider-Man, you've got me, that's it. Horizon and Last of Us didn't ever interest me enough to play them (I did play the DLC for Last of Us though, wouldn't bother with the full game based on that). It's like gaming preferences are subjective or something and I think playing a new Halo (a series I don't really care for either, and have only ever finished the first one), and (hopefully) Forza this Christmas is way more interesting than TLOU2 and whatever the Horizon sequel is called. Strictly speaking numbers, both platforms have plenty of exclusives as always. I never played God of War, Horizon, Last of Us, and whatever else Sony put out beyond Spider-Man, Uncharted, and I guess Gravity Rush if you count that. Oh and DriveClub, I did like that. But LBP3 blew chunks, MotorStorm was absent this whole gen, the new Killzone sucked ass, I did unironically enjoy Knack enough to platinum it though, so me this gen with PS4 exclusives this gen would basically just be Spider-Man, Uncharted, and Knack. And DriveClub I guess. Xbox with Sunset, Gears, Halo, Forza, Cuphead & PUBG (when they were exclusive), was way more up my alley. 

 

The next Halo is coming out at the end of the year though, so grab a trial code, kiddies. 

[ziggypossum]

 

https://www.hepsiburada.com/staticpage/755668107574384

[XxIsa-GxX]

2 hours ago, ziggypossum said:

 

https://www.hepsiburada.com/staticpage/755668107574384

It seems like they removed "Eski ile Yeniyi Birleştiren Eşsiz Tasarım" part from the website where was stating the backwards compatibility on the page. So I would say it's either an error/mistake that they had to fix or they accidentally leaked it and then fixed it. PSNow isn't an option for everyone as well since it's still not available worldwide (such as Turkey).

[Maverick6146]

i am more in the middle for this matter. 

For one thing, i despise the decision of not including any backward compatibility for PS4. New console or not, i don't want to ditch all the game i plan to play and start fresh. Therefore I never buy new console day 1.

 

On the other hand. After some time, the game from older generation got dated and i lost interest in playing them, naturally. I hardly play any PS3 game now even though it was hooked to this exact monitor i was typing in. The backward compatibility can (and should) only go so far. I don't want the new consoles to be dragging down by technical challenges  of backward compatibility.

 

And to be honest, i am skeptical on what Microsoft can do. You can NOT run all PC games 15 years ago without twitching the system. To hope that all the hardware architecture can last forever w/o change seems to be futile. Let alone people are hoping for running old games with improved graphics, speed etc.

[DaivRules]

27 minutes ago, Maverick6146 said:

For one thing, i despise the decision of not including any backward compatibility for PS4. New console or not, i don't want to ditch all the game i plan to play and start fresh. Therefore I never buy new console day 1.

 

The PS5 at the developer event, they said the PS5 will be compatible with all PS4 titles. Only some PS4 titles (so far) will be able to used "Enhanced mode" and take advantage of the advanced hardware of the PS5. 

Edited June 1, 2020 by DaivRules

[Maverick6146]

10 minutes ago, DaivRules said:

 

The PS5 at the developer event, they said the PS5 will be compatible with all PS4 titles. Only some PS4 titles (so far) will be able to used "Enhanced mode" and take advantage of the advanced hardware of the PS5. 

There may be a misunderstanding. I was referring to the decision that no backward compatibility was included for the PS4 console when it first launched. I remember arguing with people in a forum i went to at that time. 

I am aware of that PS4 games can be played on PS5.

[TJ_Solo]

18 minutes ago, Maverick6146 said:

There may be a misunderstanding. I was referring to the decision that no backward compatibility was included for the PS4 console when it first launched. I remember arguing with people in a forum i went to at that time. 

I am aware of that PS4 games can be played on PS5.

 

 

They were fresh from a console that had full BC and no one bought until said BC was removed and price dropped.

That console also used an unpopular CPU that most devs never really learned well.

They learned their lesson and released the PS4, cheaper than the competition and using tech devs were more familiar with. The latter meant voiding BC/emulation with PS3 without expensive chips...which was proven to be something consumers were not going to pay for.

 

Also, all consoles this gen launched without any form of BC.

[Seraphim_Rez]

If a console has backwards compatibility, enhancements are nice all, but as long as it doesn't play worse that it did on the original console like some OG Xbox games did on 360 or PS1 games on PS3 suffering from input lag, then I'm fine. If Sony can do with PS5 like they did with PS2 where only a very tiny percentage of the previous gen's games don't work or have issues then that'd be great. I don't mind remasters either since not everyone played the original and because they are a good opportunity to release content to people that wasn't available previously (KH Final Fix and FF International outside of Japan) and devs getting to do things for a game they couldn't before (Last of Us Remastered).

[djb5f]

 

On 5/30/2020 at 10:02 PM, Super-Fly Spider-Guy said:

No games... like all those Forza's (7 plus a standalone DLC this gen), Ryse, Sunset Overdrive, all the Halos (10 or so if you count all the individual MCC games), Gears 4/5/Tactics, Ori, Quantum Break, CUPHEAD, Crackdown (I liked it), Dead Rising 3 (fave one), RARE REPLAY, Killer Instinct, Wasteland, and so on... PS all of those are on Game Pass as well. But then you've got all the past entries in those series, and maaaaaany more that you can't play anywhere else via back compat, like for example, the original Star Wars Battlefront 2, since it went back compat it's been one of my most played games this generation. 

 

It doesn't matter where you play your multiplats, I mean objectively playing on XBOX (fuck, I typed it in caps to signify I meant the One X but then realized it just spells Xbox, fuck), anyway, playing on that is the best way, but I'm rocking the Xbox One SAD edition so fuck that too. But if I want to play Spider-Man, you've got me, that's it. Horizon and Last of Us didn't ever interest me enough to play them (I did play the DLC for Last of Us though, wouldn't bother with the full game based on that). It's like gaming preferences are subjective or something and I think playing a new Halo (a series I don't really care for either, and have only ever finished the first one), and (hopefully) Forza this Christmas is way more interesting than TLOU2 and whatever the Horizon sequel is called. Strictly speaking numbers, both platforms have plenty of exclusives as always. I never played God of War, Horizon, Last of Us, and whatever else Sony put out beyond Spider-Man, Uncharted, and I guess Gravity Rush if you count that. Oh and DriveClub, I did like that. But LBP3 blew chunks, MotorStorm was absent this whole gen, the new Killzone sucked ass, I did unironically enjoy Knack enough to platinum it though, so me this gen with PS4 exclusives this gen would basically just be Spider-Man, Uncharted, and Knack. And DriveClub I guess. Xbox with Sunset, Gears, Halo, Forza, Cuphead & PUBG (when they were exclusive), was way more up my alley. 

 

The next Halo is coming out at the end of the year though, so grab a trial code, kiddies. 

The only XBox exclusive I miss is Forza.  I think those would be fun.  Maybe Alan Wake if they still have those?  But I can’t imagine not having access to the Uncharted series, The Last of Us, Spider-man, MLB The Show, etc.  Unless you are a Halo nut (zero interest here), I don’t see the lineups as remotely comparable.

 

But in the end, hopefully Xboxers enjoy their lineup better but I am happier than ever that I started and continued with PlayStation.   

 

 

Edited June 1, 2020 by djb5f

[Jelly Soup]

I honestly don't care too much about if the system can read every Sony disk ever made.

I do care about the system having backwards compatibility for the PSN. Pile and piles of digital goods that are locked behind two different consoles at this point. 

[TJ_Solo]

14 minutes ago, Jelly Soup said:

I honestly don't care too much about if the system can read every Sony disk ever made.

I do care about the system having backwards compatibility for the PSN. Pile and piles of digital goods that are locked behind two different consoles at this point. 

 

Technically, PSN supports PSP and Vita too.

The content is locked behind licenses too that you have to buy.

Not sure of simply buying a game and console is locking content tho.

2020 is crazy

[Kevvik]

On 5/29/2020 at 5:05 PM, DaivRules said:

2,623 titles for PS4 and you’re claiming most of them are Remakes/Remasters/Ports?

 

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_PlayStation_4_games

While I agree there may be a bit of exaggeration here, you can’t deny there were a lot.  I started counting, I’m just finished E and I’m at 60.  And I’m probably missing some.  Guessing maybe 10% of this list?
 

Anybody want to keep counting?

[Jelly Soup]

43 minutes ago, TJ_Solo said:

 

Technically, PSN supports PSP and Vita too.

The content is locked behind licenses too that you have to buy.

Not sure of simply buying a game and console is locking content tho.

2020 is crazy

 

I hadn't even thought about the PSP and Vita, but both are accessible from a Vita by default, right? If yes, so long as you can still buy used Vita, which will eventually run out, you've still got access to all those licences. Regardless, I'd like it if all my digital content across the entire PSN could be accessible from one place. But then, that might require the fabled PSN rebuild, where we move the network from a brick of Atari Jaguars to something that makes more sense.

2020 is a strange year indeed. :/

[Havok_Knight]

It is easier for Xbox to try and preserve the legacy stuff since by the time the first Xbox came out Sony already had about 2000 games released on the PS1 alone, and almost 400 on the PS2, which was only a year old when the first Xbox landed. Even looking at the total releases of both companies, Xbox has much less to work with and organize.

PS1 - 7,918

PS2 - 10,035

PS3 - 1,448 (unsure if this one is accurate as it seems a bit low)

PS4 - 2,624

 

Total - 21,725 (Not counting PSP or Vita games)

 

 

Xbox - 1,000

360 - 2,086

One - 2,493

 

Total - 5,579

 

 

This is also why backwards compatibility is an issue for Sony, as they would have to give all those PS1 & PS2 games trophy support with how they do things now.

[Super-Fly Spider-Guy]

19 hours ago, TJ_Solo said:

Also, all consoles this gen launched without any form of BC.

Wii U was fully backward compatible with Wii games (and hard the hardware to play GC games natively too, but weirdly was locked off)

 

17 hours ago, djb5f said:

The only XBox exclusive I miss is Forza.  I think those would be fun.  Maybe Alan Wake if they still have those?  But I can’t imagine not having access to the Uncharted series, The Last of Us, Spider-man, MLB The Show, etc.  Unless you are a Halo nut (zero interest here), I don’t see the lineups as remotely comparable.

 

But in the end, hopefully Xboxers enjoy their lineup better but I am happier than ever that I started and continued with PlayStation.   

Honestly I'm defending the Xbox lineup, because there's a boat load of games on it and people who say they have no games are objectively wrong. But there hasn't been that many of interest to me either. Like Halo and Gears are fine but if they weren't on Game Pass I'd never touch them. Stuff like Titanfall (1), Sunset Overdrive, Cuphead, and so on were great but they either got a multiplat sequel, ported to PC, or dumped on Nintendo of all things so they're kind of all over the place anyway. tbh this whole generation the only exclusive from anyone I cared about was Spider-Man and he was (and should continue to be) a multiplat game until that last entry. Uncharted was good and dandy but I didn't race out for it or anything, borrowed it from the library a good deal after release. Never cared about Last of Us, Horizon, God of War, Bloodborne, baseball at all, and so on. Release a new Ratchet and Clank already, fuckers! But also, to be fair, Mario Odyssey was basic, Breath of the Wild is no shit THE most overrated game I've ever played, Splatoon 2 was basically a re-release with new content, Pokemon and Animal Crossing can both fuck off, and so on. Halo is generic, Gears is bland, Forza comes out every year (minus 2019) and has nothing new that I notice at least, and so on. Really this whole generation there was Spider-Man and third party stuff, and Spidey should have been one of those third party stuffs if you ask me. 

 

10 hours ago, TJ_Solo said:

 

Technically, PSN supports PSP and Vita too.

The content is locked behind licenses too that you have to buy.

Not sure of simply buying a game and console is locking content tho.

2020 is crazy

I've been playing a few games on PPSSPP on the NVIDIA Shield lately with all the upscaling and shit turned to max and they look hella good, I'd love if Sony had have included a PSP emulator and upscaler for the PS3, the hackers managed it. The PSTV (which I also used recently) is such a bitter disappointment, no upscaling so PSP games look fucking ugly as balls, but I can understand not doing it for Vita since PSTV was a thing, but if the PSP digital stuff could have been played on the tele via PS3 that would have been great. Or if you could have plugged the console into the USB or something and then used the DS3 to control it (the PSP Go did this sort of with Bluetooth but you needed a cable and a dock if you wanted to have power while on the tele too, was not perfect).

 

9 hours ago, Jelly Soup said:

I hadn't even thought about the PSP and Vita, but both are accessible from a Vita by default, right? If yes, so long as you can still buy used Vita, which will eventually run out, you've still got access to all those licences. Regardless, I'd like it if all my digital content across the entire PSN could be accessible from one place. But then, that might require the fabled PSN rebuild, where we move the network from a brick of Atari Jaguars to something that makes more sense.

2020 is a strange year indeed. :/

Not everything, plenty of games don't work on the Vita. One of my favorite PSP time sinks, Rock Band Unplugged, does not for example. Which is a real fucking bummer because I love that damn game. 

 

8 hours ago, Havok_Knight said:

It is easier for Xbox to try and preserve the legacy stuff since by the time the first Xbox came out Sony already had about 2000 games released on the PS1 alone, and almost 400 on the PS2, which was only a year old when the first Xbox landed. Even looking at the total releases of both companies, Xbox has much less to work with and organize.

[number of games on various consoles that are very likely to not be that accurate because there's been so many damn conflicting reports on numbers over the years i hate it]

 

This is also why backwards compatibility is an issue for Sony, as they would have to give all those PS1 & PS2 games trophy support with how they do things now.

Well really it should be easier for Sony, especially since they had a blanket PS1 emulator for every game on the PS3 day one, even further back they had it on the PS2 years earlier. PS1 can be emulated on a potato, I was running games full speed on a basic bitch Android phone from 2010 years ago. PS2 is a little harder but no real effort, if Sony were repackaging and selling PS2 games on PS3 years ago and hackers at home made a pretty damn near perfect emulator on their own, then Sony definitely could. Repackaging and including trophies helps give them money, obviously, but there's no reason they can't do that still, and also make the discs work on a blanket "as is" kind of emulator. Don't even update it. Get it running and say "here you go, try your luck, fuckers" like they did with the OG PS3 BC, OutRun 2006 and Force Unleashed for example are missing enough textures you can't get through the menu on OR06 or through the first level on TFU. There's no reason Sony couldn't do that, it would take fuck all effort and money, and it would shut Microsoft (and people like me) the fuck up. If they told me I could jam my copy of Vice City, Tony Hawk 3, Spider-Man 2, Battlefront 2, and Hit & Run into the PS5 day one and have it be upscaled and shit, I'd be there at midnight.

[Havok_Knight]

4 hours ago, Super-Fly Spider-Guy said:

Well really it should be easier for Sony, especially since they had a blanket PS1 emulator for every game on the PS3 day one, even further back they had it on the PS2 years earlier. PS1 can be emulated on a potato, I was running games full speed on a basic bitch Android phone from 2010 years ago. PS2 is a little harder but no real effort, if Sony were repackaging and selling PS2 games on PS3 years ago and hackers at home made a pretty damn near perfect emulator on their own, then Sony definitely could. Repackaging and including trophies helps give them money, obviously, but there's no reason they can't do that still, and also make the discs work on a blanket "as is" kind of emulator. Don't even update it. Get it running and say "here you go, try your luck, fuckers" like they did with the OG PS3 BC, OutRun 2006 and Force Unleashed for example are missing enough textures you can't get through the menu on OR06 or through the first level on TFU. There's no reason Sony couldn't do that, it would take fuck all effort and money, and it would shut Microsoft (and people like me) the fuck up. If they told me I could jam my copy of Vice City, Tony Hawk 3, Spider-Man 2, Battlefront 2, and Hit & Run into the PS5 day one and have it be upscaled and shit, I'd be there at midnight.

I'd argue that it wouldn't be easier for Sony because Microsoft went forward with the idea that backwards compatibility was a must have as the 360 launched with few games and everyone was hesitant to move to the 360 immediately. Sony was relying on pure loyalty on selling it's following consoles and just threw in those emulators as more of an afterthought than a true selling point, which in retrospect they should have made it a core thing.

 

Sony having an emulator for their games isn't an issue, the issue is that the way they are doing things, they are completely converting older games to digital so they play on PS4 (and hopefully PS5) so they don't have to have the emulator software on the systems. And doing that take significant times, and in the process of doing that, they also are adding trophy support,and depending on game, might have to renew some licenses to get specific games. Would it be more convenient to the people that still have the physical games to just shove it into their PS5 and boot it up, sure. But it isn't realistic because a lot of people don't have those old physical games anymore they are a minority in the gaming pool just like trophy hunters are, and the age of going over completely to digital games is getting closer. So while people will gripe about being able to play their old discs in the next gen, in all likelihood if you still have old physical games, you most likely have the console as well to play it on.

 

Also those game numbers I got came from Wikipedia. And considering that those articles are monitored hardcore for accuracy and citations, I'd trust them over most other sources. And it is very believable that Sony would have four to five times more games than Microsoft since they have been in the industry much longer.

Edited June 2, 2020 by Havok_Knight

[Super-Fly Spider-Guy]

On 6/2/2020 at 10:44 PM, Havok_Knight said:

I'd argue that it wouldn't be easier for Sony because Microsoft went forward with the idea that backwards compatibility was a must have as the 360 launched with few games and everyone was hesitant to move to the 360 immediately. Sony was relying on pure loyalty on selling it's following consoles and just threw in those emulators as more of an afterthought than a true selling point, which in retrospect they should have made it a core thing.

 

Sony having an emulator for their games isn't an issue, the issue is that the way they are doing things, they are completely converting older games to digital so they play on PS4 (and hopefully PS5) so they don't have to have the emulator software on the systems. And doing that take significant times, and in the process of doing that, they also are adding trophy support,and depending on game, might have to renew some licenses to get specific games. Would it be more convenient to the people that still have the physical games to just shove it into their PS5 and boot it up, sure. But it isn't realistic because a lot of people don't have those old physical games anymore they are a minority in the gaming pool just like trophy hunters are, and the age of going over completely to digital games is getting closer. So while people will gripe about being able to play their old discs in the next gen, in all likelihood if you still have old physical games, you most likely have the console as well to play it on.

 

Also those game numbers I got came from Wikipedia. And considering that those articles are monitored hardcore for accuracy and citations, I'd trust them over most other sources. And it is very believable that Sony would have four to five times more games than Microsoft since they have been in the industry much longer.

This a good reply and I want to reply to it, but it's 4am and I am tired, but I'mma edit this in the morning. Or tomorrow sometime. I don't know.

 

Alright, I'm back. "Sony was relying on pure loyalty on selling it's following consoles and just threw in those emulators as more of an afterthought than a true selling point" Um, no? They had the literal guts of a PS2 in EVERY PS3 for a good while there, didn't turn to emulation for a while, it was 1:1 hardware baby.

 

"they are completely converting older games to digital so they play on PS4 (and hopefully PS5) so they don't have to have the emulator software on the systems. And doing that take significant times" Yeah, it does. Which makes a great case for the "fuck it, let's just put a blanket emulator on there and leave it as is", less money spent, less time spent, more good PR earned, and you can still do the re-releases you're already doing (that are done by the devs/publishers, not Sony anyway) to make exactly as much money as you currently are off it.

 

"But it isn't realistic because a lot of people don't have those old physical games anymore they are a minority" You'd be surprised, but nonetheless, even then, that would just go to show that they wouldn't lose all that much in the way of money off a minority then, hey. But again, I'm not saying to stop doing what they're doing, I mean they only released like 30 odd PS2 games on the PS4 in the 7 years (almost) that it's been out, and skipped their own iconic stuff like Sly and Ratchet & Goddamnclank, they have dropped the ball big time on those PS2 to PS4 conversions, at least with a blanket emulator, people would have the option to jump on eBay and pick up Metal Arms, Psi-Ops, or whatever other obscure lil game you'll never get the rights to re-release.

 

"in all likelihood if you still have old physical games, you most likely have the console as well to play it on." Only because we have to. I'd much prefer not to. If my fat PS3 dies, or when, I should say (which again, further points to how you can't just rely on old consoles forever), I'll have to go back to an actual PS2, with an AV cable and shit, looking like ass on a modern TV. I mean I have the component cable and it's better, but still not even close to the PS3 doing it on HDMI.

 

"it is very believable that Sony would have four to five times more games than Microsoft since they have been in the industry much longer." 4 to 5 times as many? Nah. They weren't there for the PS1 generation, there's a good deal of games missed, but that's it, otherwise the majority of games you could buy on a PlayStation system, you could buy on an Xbox system.

 

 

Edited June 4, 2020 by Super-Fly Spider-Guy

[Golem25]

On 30/05/2020 at 0:38 AM, TJ_Solo said:

 

They won't let you down.

They will show an hours worth of new PS5 games.

This, sadly, aged really badly (with no offense to TJ) ?

 

I care strongly about backwards compatibility, especially what with having skipped the PS4 so far beyond a few weeks of borrowing one, but I know seeing physical PS3 games work on PS5 is a pipe dream; that cell is not easy to work with, and even if it is possible to get PS3 titles running I think it's not worth the cost to Sony. I'm clinging to hope that that one patent, of Trophies being applied to pre-PS3 games, ends up being used, but I very much doubt it.

[TJ_Solo]

21 minutes ago, Golem25 said:

This, sadly, aged really badly (with no offense to TJ)

 

I care strongly about backwards compatibility, especially what with having skipped the PS4 so far beyond a few weeks of borrowing one, but I know seeing physical PS3 games work on PS5 is a pipe dream; that cell is not easy to work with, and even if it is possible to get PS3 titles running I think it's not worth the cost to Sony. I'm clinging to hope that that one patent, of Trophies being applied to pre-PS3 games, ends up being used, but I very much doubt it.

 

The current events don't change my comment or the quality of the games they will end up showing.

Times are unstable right now. My comment didn't need a caveat about "if no riots happen" and it is not part of any backwards compatibility argument. 

If you want to play old games, then use your old systems. 40 years of gaming works that way and doesn't change because Xbox picks a few BC games

I skipped all PS consoles until PS4. I bought  PS2- PS4 in about a month, still have them all. I decided to try out old games and instead of waiting for some handholding or complete BC,...I just bought what I wanted.

 

Quote

 

I've been playing a few games on PPSSPP on the NVIDIA Shield lately with all the upscaling and shit turned to max and they look hella good, I'd love if Sony had have included a PSP emulator and upscaler for the PS3, the hackers managed it. The PSTV (which I also used recently) is such a bitter disappointment, no upscaling so PSP games look fucking ugly as balls, but I can understand not doing it for Vita since PSTV was a thing, but if the PSP digital stuff could have been played on the tele via PS3 that would have been great. Or if you could have plugged the console into the USB or something and then used the DS3 to control it (the PSP Go did this sort of with Bluetooth but you needed a cable and a dock if you wanted to have power while on the tele too, was not perfect).

 

 

Well the hackers don't have to pay for shit for game production or legal fees and aren't subject to any consumer protection laws. 
You'd find a lot of amazing things after hacking devices that a regular company wouldn't outright due.

You won't find a game worth a damn from a hacker group tho

 

Edited June 3, 2020 by TJ_Solo

[starcrunch061]

If BC was a thing in the PS4 generation, I think poor Squeenix would have long gone bankrupt, and what a catastrophe that would be.

 

But anyway, like others, I used to care a lot about BC. And now I don’t. Sure - if full BC was there, I would buy the ps5 day 1. But it won’t be, so it will save me a hundred or so when I buy it a couple of years later.

[Super-Fly Spider-Guy]

4 hours ago, TJ_Solo said:

Well the hackers don't have to pay for shit for game production or legal fees and aren't subject to any consumer protection laws. 
You'd find a lot of amazing things after hacking devices that a regular company wouldn't outright due.

You won't find a game worth a damn from a hacker group tho

 

K?

 

Well if the regular company doesn't see profit in doing something, then they're not losing any money when I go and play my old games, the vast majority of which I bought way back when money *actually* went to said companies (whereas now it would go solely to the preowned market), are they?

 

I mean, off the top of my head, Brian Provinciano (soz, I forgot the spelling), was a lil hacker who made emulators and other fun things, he ALONE (so not even a group) made Retro City Rampage and Shakedown Hawaii, two of the more fun open world games I've played in recent memory.