What is the big brain strategy for trophy hunters

[mipdii]

I'm about 20 runs into this game and its just not clicking for me yet. 

 

I get the concept of trying to build synergies etc. but either I'm not seeing it or am having horrid RNG. 

 

I am expecting to platinum this one will be a monumental win if I can manage it, but no afraid of the challenge with some of the other games I've done.

 

Any advice? Were you in the same boat at the start of the game?

[AJ_-_808]

There are a number of threads in this forum with various tips and strategies.

 

Otherwise, it's largely trial by fire

[Elegy]

The game gets easier when you understand what all the enemies and bosses do and how they typically behave from turn to turn.  If you want to play optimally you will need to do math and think ahead on potential outcomes.  Though I found it faster to just save scum different potential paths than to accept defeats because of bad RNG.  Many cards and relics are not unlocked at the start until you earn a certain amount of experience with each of the different classes as well, so that is also something to consider.  Act 3 is pretty easy to beat on low ascension levels with nearly any build though if you play smart.  Act 4 is where I felt like you needed a specific sort of deck to win and I found that more frustrating.  You not only needed a deck that could do massive amounts of damage and scale block at the same time, but you also needed to have it focused enough to get your engine going within 2 or 3 turns max before you are overwhelmed with damage.

You also just gotta get to the point where you can make what the game gives you work rather than going for your optimal strategy every time.  You will lose occasionally if you do the latter.  However, when going for the various miscellaneous trophies you have no choice but to go for a particular strategy for a lot of those.  It would take me sometimes 4-8 hours or more trying to get a single miscellaneous trophy if the RNG wasn't working out in my favor.

Overall, I think it took me about 50 hours to do all miscellaneous trophies and true endings with all 4 characters. Then another 20ish hours to do ascension 20 with the watcher.  I would say my best tip is to keep your decks focused.  Try to remove all of your strikes and defends ASAP, don't take curses unless you have a damn good reason for it and don't add cards if you don't need them.  Take cards that fix or alleviate particular issues you are having.  The thing is you won't really know what your deck does and doesn't need without just playing a lot of games with each class.  Knowing what cards to pick also ties in heavily to the first point I made about knowing the enemies and bosses.  You pick cards based on the enemies and bosses you will be facing and spending time at the beginning of each Act evaluating the route you will take by using the map is essential to not making mistakes (i.e. do not take an early shop route if you are not taking extra starting gold, don't go to the shop with less than 150 gold is a general rule or you are wasting a floor that could have given a card pick or event that could have helped you more).  Taking lots of events/shops can be viable though if your deck sucks at hallway fights but you know you can beat bosses with it, so there aren't really hard rules so much as just make sure to think about what your goal for the run is and the state of your deck before just clicking on a path.

 

One final thing.  Do not be afraid to take Snecko Eye boss relic on Ironclad if you are starting off with Ironclad.  I won nearly every run I took Snecko Eye on Ironclad and I also used it for the 20 minute speedrun.

Edited November 15, 2023 by Elegy

[exsentry]

On 11/15/2023 at 4:00 PM, mipdii said:

I'm about 20 runs into this game and its just not clicking for me yet. 

 

I get the concept of trying to build synergies etc. but either I'm not seeing it or am having horrid RNG. 

 

I am expecting to platinum this one will be a monumental win if I can manage it, but no afraid of the challenge with some of the other games I've done.

 

Any advice? Were you in the same boat at the start of the game?

 

Unfortunately it's going to take way more than 20 runs to understand the game. For context, it took me about 300 hours to platinum, but I wasn't really trying to be fair. It then took me another 300 just be more consistent. It's my favorite PS4 game, so I am a bit biased and have sunk in over 1,000 hours so far.

 

I understand your frustrastion, as I actually quit the game twice initially. I highly suggest checking out the YT channel Baalorlord: he still plays today and has a ton of guides, vods and challenges. He also covers basics and answers questions despite playing the game for a very long time.

 

I guess my only advice to learn and have fun over going for the platinum.

Edited November 17, 2023 by exsentry

[asdfghjkl95]

Using Ironclad as reference for all Ascension levels

 

Rule number 1: Always swap the starting relic with a random boss relic if it's an option. In later ascension levels, the staring relic is useless. You want one of the relics that gives an extra energy with some penalty or snacko eye. Ideally the one that gives 2 wounds in deck or disable option to use smith. You will not use the smith at all in ascension lvl 10+.  The only ones that are a potential disadvantage in order is the one that disable gold, healing, and future rewards. Those are manageable but not suitable. Especially gold, as you want to buy a lot of relics during your run, especially the lucky one is 50% discount on everything.

 

Rule number 2: High risk/High reward in act 1. Since you are starting a run, a loss can initiate another run quickly without lossing much time. You want to clear out as many Elites as possible, preferably 3 or 4 to get those relics. Finish off the boss in act 1 and then you should be more careful in later acts. Of course in earlier ascension levels, 4 elites in one act is not possible, so there you should take out everything possible.

 

Rule number 3: Adapt your card choice to the relics you obtain. There is no strategy that is bulletproof in terms of builds, you will have to adapt as the run goes on.

 

Rule number 4:  Go for as many rest sites, random encounters as possible after act 1. Act 1 is used to collect cards and relics. Act 2 and onward is a matter of damage control. Rest sites give option to heal, random encounters gives option improve in unusual areas and avoid enemies. 

 

Rule number 5: Plan route ahead, especially for the shop. You want to enter a shop with large funds available. Avoid shops if you know it's highly likely to be below 150-200 gold when you would enter a shop, then don't pick that route, and save the money for later use. 

 

We could go on, but in many ways it's just a matter of playing and knowing the game from bottom to top. There is no lazy way to get the platinium. 

[modest_undue1]

oh yeah, this is big brain time

[RedbeardRik]

On 11/15/2023 at 10:00 PM, mipdii said:

I'm about 20 runs into this game and its just not clicking for me yet. 

 

I get the concept of trying to build synergies etc. but either I'm not seeing it or am having horrid RNG. 

 

I am expecting to platinum this one will be a monumental win if I can manage it, but no afraid of the challenge with some of the other games I've done.

 

Any advice? Were you in the same boat at the start of the game?

I was definitely in the same boat bit have now 100% it 3 times. Xbox, ps4 & mobile. Best advice I can give is watch some baalorlord videos on YouTube. This guy is the best teacher you could ask for. 

[TIReckoningIT]

The only big brain strategy I can give you is that you gonna main the watcher. She is the most broken tool the game gives you. Besides that far too much to explain and theres a couple spire youtubers that do a far better job than me writing an encyclopedia in a forum post. Some good things to look out for as a starter: learn the bosses and build your deck accordingly ( if you see time-eater pop up don't take more 0 cost cards or cycling cards even if it synergizes with your deck as he counters that playstyle for example). Pathing is very important, take as many elites as possible as relics make you strong. ALWAYS! remove at shops, removing cards is more invalueable than you would think, smaller deck means getting your good cards more often. Don't make your deck too bloated, skipping cards is often the right choice. For act1 you wanna hardcore focus on dmg cards as strikes suck ass(unless you're watcher she can be more picky of what to pick up early because wrath is fair and balanced). Core Idea is making fights last as short as possible as most enemies ramp up so the more damage you take, allthough if you are sure you take less dmg by prolonging a fight then do so. Personally I try to avoid question marks in general as there are way worse events than good ones are worth. Resting at a rest spot is an emergency situation and should almost never be picked( upgrades are far more important, if you dont have deck defining cards yet, always upgrade the card that gives the most damage). Lastly use your potions( every fight you have a 10% chance of getting a potion that increases by another 10% for each fight you take, sooner or later you will get potions so use them!). And on another note monsters always follow a set pattern(for the most part, some have a bit of rng to them but plenty use a spell or buff after 2 turns of attacking) the more you play the more you learn about those there's for too many instances too go more in-depth.

 

If you are really struggling with later ascensions or some trophies in particular you can shoot me a dm on psn I dont mind explaining some stuff, have well over 1000hrs on pc and speedran the plat on ps5. Knowledge is key in this game. Hope that helps, Happy trophy hunting

[Creamium]

On 11/21/2023 at 4:18 AM, asdfghjkl95 said:

Rule number 1: Always swap the starting relic with a random boss relic if it's an option. In later ascension levels, the staring relic is useless. You want one of the relics that gives an extra energy with some penalty or snacko eye. Ideally the one that gives 2 wounds in deck or disable option to use smith. You will not use the smith at all in ascension lvl 10+.  The only ones that are a potential disadvantage in order is the one that disable gold, healing, and future rewards. Those are manageable but not suitable. Especially gold, as you want to buy a lot of relics during your run, especially the lucky one is 50% discount on everything.

I'd say this is bad advice for the most part, especially if you're starting out and not an advanced player. Even though boss swap is very good on certain characters, it's an advanced play and pretty risky. Sure you could get Snecko on Clad, but there are a lot of ways for it to go sideways. Silent in particular does not handle boss swaps well. Even Clad is not the best for boss swap since burning blood is so good. Burning Blood is a way better starting relic than Mark of Pain which you mention. Mark of Pain is a relic you go for when your deck/build can already deal with wounds (evolve/true grit + dark embrace/second wind, stuff like that), but it is one of the worst starting relics since those 2 wounds are a nightmare at the start. The wounds immediately go to your draw pile, not discard. You will see them right away and your draws will be worse for it, until you find a way to mitigate that (like Evolve).

 

Best characters for boss swap are definitely Defect and Watcher, since their relic has less impact. But I'd still only do it regularly if you're getting more familiar with the game.

 

I wrote up a bunch of tips here, I'd recommend to take a look at those YT guides I list down there. Baalor is a good teacher and you'll quickly learn more about the character and the game in general if you watch his guides and runs. I've gotten so much better at the game just watching his stream/YT. He also has guides on all the challenge trophies too.

 

Biggest advice I can give you is to actually not think of the platinum and play the game for fun, since you need to get to A20 anyway and that involves quite a few wins. Then later you can focus on the challenges. I do love the design of some of the achievements, since they force you to look at the game in a different way. Minimalist is there to prove that you can win in this game with a very small deck, while 'Common Sense' shows how efficient common cards can be.