ProfBambam55 Posted May 29, 2017 Share Posted May 29, 2017 so someone is actively monitoring all the sessions?...highly doubt it...and there's no report button for gaming session as of now so you would need to pm a mod, no?...as i said, i could've created it to start 15 minutes from now...i can guarantee the chance of anyone noticing is like 5%...i can even try to time it when i know there is less likely to be mods online...also, is someone going to be going through all of the feedback reports to make sure they're legit?...if i disagree with a rating should i also pm a mod?...seems like this could turn into more of a moderation nightmare than i first anticipated...curious to see if any preventative measures are put into place... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mekktor Posted May 29, 2017 Share Posted May 29, 2017 1 hour ago, ProfBambam55 said: is there a prevention system for things like this?...this was to highlight possible exploits... I'm not sure which exploit you're highlighting here (is it using an alt account to boost ratings?) but whatever it is, the feedback system should obviously be designed in a way that prevents exploits. I think rather than saying "here's an exploit, a feedback system won't work", maybe we should be saying "here's an exploit, how can we counter it?" So what's the best way to deal with fake sessions, using alts etc? Reporting could help, but you could get around that by creating the session right before it starts. 1 hour ago, ProfBambam55 said: how would anyone know otherwise that we in fact had a "great" session?...are we relying on people to be honest for this to work?...couldn't i just kick anyone i felt would give negative feedback?... I think the way to deal with rogue negative feedback is to use a system where your rating only decreases if the majority of players in the session rate you negatively. A dispute option seems a bit over the top, but if it is implemented it should probably only be for cases where there is clear proof of sabotage (eg. a PSN message) so as not to waste everyone's time. And if you're worried, don't join one of your PSNP nemesis' sessions. 1 hour ago, ProfBambam55 said: i'd have to keep a spreadsheet to give an honest rating to all of these people...i'd rather spend the time on my console helping during the limited hours that i have available for gaming, which is my hobby...giving feedback, is not... If the feedback is positive by default, then you really just need to take a note of anyone who didn't pull their weight. Keep in mind that the session you're talking about isn't really the type this feedback is designed for. This type of session doesn't rely on having reliable boosters in order to work. Maybe with that in mind, the host should be given the option to disable feedback or it could be disabled automatically when there are a certain number of players in the session (as these are usually just the "gathering players" kind of sessions anyway). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfBambam55 Posted May 29, 2017 Share Posted May 29, 2017 (edited) Perhaps just create 2 places for sessions then...the "traditional" ones which could be rated...and the "exceptional" ones without rating...let people choose...would that please all?.... Otherwise brainstorming needed on preventing deletion of members or sessions before feedback occurs...creating fake sessions via pm/alt accounts to boost/lower ratings...people joining via pm, session post, other boosting sites, psn "friendship" and participating but not eligible for, while possibly affecting, feedback...placeholder sessions...people with busy lifestyles or who just can't be bothered to give feedback not participating...sessions that only require 2 people (or equal number of opposing groups) that have an unsuccessful session both requesting positive feedback and blaming each other for the failure...sessions where the host or other members don't add each other and then possibly don't show up leaving segregated members who were ready to participate on time with a potential negative rating..."noobs" joining a session full of "experts" or vice versa...single fathers (it's a joke, although anyone with a newborn knows how difficult it can be to commit to anything)...any other exceptions?...seems like an awful lot of work to weed out a minority... To me, it's quite simple..."you didn't show up?"..."you were a d1ck?"..."well you missed out on a fun/great session and still need the trophies"...to those that ding and dash..."expect to be deleted from all future sessions"...much simpler than wondering if a person's feedback rating actually represents how fun/productive it would be to game together...if an unsuccessful session ruins your day?..."I wish I had your problems"...haha... Side note: would also recommend a thread on boosting tips as it recently occurred to me that some people may not have a clue how to run a session or what to do when they join one...might also help give some key phrases to those whose native language is not English.. Edited May 29, 2017 by ProfBambam55 Added thoughts... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mekktor Posted May 29, 2017 Share Posted May 29, 2017 @ProfBambam55 you're right, there are a lot of potential issues to work out. I've added some thoughts to your points below. Not saying I have all the answers, just doing my best to think of possible solutions: deletion of members or sessions before feedback occurs - The host could have the option to lock in the session when enough people have joined, or it locks automatically at some point before the session (eg. 12 hours). At this point it can't be deleted and no one can leave without permission. If the host wants to delete the session earlier, then no one gets feedback as if the session never existed. What's the issue here? creating fake sessions via pm/alt accounts to boost/lower ratings - Give us the option to report fake sessions. Maybe disable positive feedback unless a trophy was earned by either the feedback giver or receiver. If no trophies were earned then the session was either a failure or should probably be a different session type without feedback (see below). people joining via pm, session post, other boosting sites, psn "friendship" and participating but not eligible for, while possibly affecting, feedback - If you want feedback, join the session. placeholder sessions - Should be classified as a different type of session eg. "Boosting Interest session" which has no time/date or feedback and possibly even less restrictions on joining and leaving. people with busy lifestyles or who just can't be bothered to give feedback not participating - Set up the system to give positive feedback by default sessions that only require 2 people (or equal number of opposing groups) that have an unsuccessful session both requesting positive feedback and blaming each other for the failure - Seems like a rare occurrence. sessions where the host or other members don't add each other and then possibly don't show up leaving segregated members who were ready to participate on time with a potential negative rating - If they don't show up to the session will they actually bother to give negative feedback for people they didn't even speak to? "noobs" joining a session full of "experts" or vice versa - What's the worry here? That people will get negative feedback for not being good enough? 2 hours ago, ProfBambam55 said: To me, it's quite simple..."you didn't show up?"..."you were a d1ck?"..."well you missed out on a fun/great session and still need the trophies"... Except for the sessions where if someone doesn't show up then the session doesn't happen and nobody gets their trophies. 2 hours ago, ProfBambam55 said: to those that ding and dash..."expect to be deleted from all future sessions"...much simpler than wondering if a person's feedback rating actually represents how fun/productive it would be to game together... Wouldn't it be great if there were a way for others to know about these people before it happens to them? ? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfBambam55 Posted May 29, 2017 Share Posted May 29, 2017 This is great if you are looking through the eyes of an honest booster, which I'm convinced are a huge majority on this site...it may be odd but I'm trying to see it through the eyes of the few that I've come across that might be considered problematic based on what people seem to be complaining about in the posts dealing with wanting a feedback system...it will be very tough to implement something that these people who have/will have negative ratings cannot exploit...at work now...will post some more specific thoughts on this later... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mekktor Posted May 29, 2017 Share Posted May 29, 2017 I thought I'd expand on the idea of a feedback system where your rating only decreases if the majority of players in the session rate you negatively. I think the voting options should be simple: positive [+1], neutral [0] or negative [-1], with feedback positive by default. After each session, your score is tallied, and this session score is added to your total score. This is the main point here... unless a majority of players give you a negative rating, you will leave the session with a positive score. It will be reduced a little by any negative ratings though. There should also be a maximum score for each session, say [+10]. Of course, there is also the simpler version where you get a session score of [+1], [0] or [-1] depending on whether your score was positive or negative overall. As for how to display your overall rating, you could show the total score (which does have potential issues but I think it's still good information to know) or you could show the percentage of positive session scores (which could be limited to a certain number of recent sessions or time period). You could also show both. eg. mekktor [ +132 | 80% ] would tell you that I've had quite a few successful sessions overall (likely 15+), but I have had two sessions recently in which most players thought I didn't pull my weight (assuming it shows your last 10 sessions). The main thing I'm trying to communicate here is that you shouldn't need to worry about having your rating tarnished by rogue negative ratings. With a system like this for example, if you're in an 8 person boost where everyone gives a bad booster a negative rating and he does the same in return, the bad booster will leave with [-7] while everyone else would get [+5] for the session. That negative score you just got didn't reduce your overall rating at all. Most boosters will just end up building a decent score over time without any negative effects from the feedback system, while boosters who consistently don't contribute will clearly stand out, allowing hosts to make better decisions and have a more successful sessions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Combatting Posted May 29, 2017 Share Posted May 29, 2017 (edited) On 2017-5-21 at 3:04 PM, damage_6-9 said: Lol, had a session last Monday, had the game queued up and online one hour before the scheduled start time..... one and a half hours after start time nobody, including the host, had showed up (or even got online according to friends list), so gave up and left ps3 running anyway. No messages, no invites ever appeared and I got listed as a no show by the only person that left feedback, lol Lol, as I have been saying (apart from the negativity stuff), this is going to turn into a shit show with shit like this happening. I feel bad for you Did the same a few weeks back, I joined a boosting session added the host to which the host never bothered to accept. Edited May 29, 2017 by Combatting Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Otonio_Bruno Posted June 1, 2017 Share Posted June 1, 2017 On 29/05/2017 at 8:01 PM, Combatting said: Lol, as I have been saying (apart from the negativity stuff), this is going to turn into a shit show with shit like this happening. I feel bad for you Did the same a few weeks back, I joined a boosting session added the host to which the host never bothered to accept. Same happened to me, but in a different circumstance: The session was actually a big group to create time and dates to boost since it wasn't feasible to get all trophies done in one sitting. Played with the host many times and along with other members, and since I'm a good fella, I left everyone with positive ratings even if I didn't play with them...just to get one no-show vote for good will of voting in a session with 20 or more members. If things keeps going this way, I'll probably need to be the host in every session I need to participate... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DARKB1KE Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 (edited) On 05/31/2017 at 9:58 PM, Otonio_Bruno said: Same happened to me, but in a different circumstance: The session was actually a big group to create time and dates to boost since it wasn't feasible to get all trophies done in one sitting. Played with the host many times and along with other members, and since I'm a good fella, I left everyone with positive ratings even if I didn't play with them...just to get one no-show vote for good will of voting in a session with 20 or more members. If things keeps going this way, I'll probably need to be the host in every session I need to participate... So 1 out of 20 votes isn't going to hurt you. You guys keep making this out to be some feature that will make you appear to others as a terrible booster to have in sessions. Your rating won't be low enough from these odd cases to affect it for the amount of positive votes you get from others, (if you participated fully.) The positive votes far outweigh the negative. Obviously if youre a repeat offender, the votes will accurately reflect that. So continue playing as a decent person and you'll be fine. Edited June 2, 2017 by DARKB1KE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
madbuk Posted June 2, 2017 Share Posted June 2, 2017 On 29 May 2017 at 6:45 AM, DARKB1KE said: The prevention is reporting fake sessions and they get deleted. There's no option to report sessions though? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DARKB1KE Posted June 4, 2017 Share Posted June 4, 2017 (edited) On 6/2/2017 at 1:42 AM, madbuk said: There's no option to report sessions though? PM a mod, obviously. They took care of several fake sessions and spam in the past. ex: Edited June 4, 2017 by DARKB1KE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hogie838 Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 I started a gaming session where two people joined. Neither of them turned up even though I had set everything up ready to go. I've left them both bad feedback so obviously they're just gonna leave me bad feedback in return. Therefore, I think this feedback is pointless and won't be accurate. 2 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DARKB1KE Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 (edited) 2 hours ago, Hogie838 said: I started a gaming session where two people joined. Neither of them turned up even though I had set everything up ready to go. I've left them both bad feedback so obviously they're just gonna leave me bad feedback in return. Therefore, I think this feedback is pointless and won't be accurate. Wrong. This is entirely incorrect. They cannot see your votes until the feedback is tallied in the system. At that point it is too late to change and they cannot target you or change their votes. Edited June 18, 2017 by DARKB1KE Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hogie838 Posted June 18, 2017 Share Posted June 18, 2017 33 minutes ago, DARKB1KE said: Wrong. This is entirely incorrect. They cannot see your votes until the feedback is tallied in the system. At that point it is too late to change and they cannot target you or change their votes. Do you mean once the 24 hours in which you have to leave feedback are up? After another gaming session previously where I gave the guy great feedback, he reciprocated and I was able to see that he'd left me good feedback also. That was after the 24 hours were up. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfBambam55 Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 I thought about this whole system for a while...rather than go back and forth over why it will/won't work, would it be possible to just have a choice of "feedback / no feedback" when creating a session?...makes everything simple...everyone is able to join/create whatever they like...then the people that care can decide how they'd like their feedback to be implemented/calculated instead of forcing it on all of us... 3 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
crimsonidol38 Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 I'm curious:Is there actually any way to see our current overall rating? Since the feedback-system is tested I only joined two sessions and with the exception of one no show (which was to be expected considering the track record of that user) everything went fine and nearly everyone remembered to vote. But why should people vote if they can't see their own or the rating of other players? TBH, so far it looks like another halfheartedly implemented feature of the site. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sly Ripper Posted June 19, 2017 Author Share Posted June 19, 2017 1 hour ago, Crimson Idol said: TBH, so far it looks like another halfheartedly implemented feature of the site. It is, that's why it says "trialing" in the title. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Abysm_Nucleus Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 (edited) Can't wait for the final release. People who don't want system should stay away from sessions. This system will make people understand the importance of the gaming session. They would have to be punctual when they join. And If they are late, just have my negative vote. Nothing would make me happy than giving 'no-show' people negative vote. I just can't wait for it. Edited June 19, 2017 by Abysm_Nucleus Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ProfBambam55 Posted June 19, 2017 Share Posted June 19, 2017 (edited) the problem with having feedback as an option is.......? create session...choose feedback or not...warning above it says..."be aware that this setting cannot be changed once you hit the 'create session' button below"...implement this and I'll stay out of this discussion entirely... to state the obvious: people who care can stick to feedback sessions or risk no feedback ones...people who don't care can do the opposite...everyone can just do as they please...meaning everyone wins...choice is good... then again, we can still avoid feedback now by just deleting or leaving the session before it disappears from our personal list or posting for help without actually joining...if the supposed "bad apples" catch onto this as a workaround then the question of "what is the point of the system?" might be worth considering... Edited June 19, 2017 by ProfBambam55 Added thought... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HEAVENSBIGDADDY Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 (edited) So I had given feedback for the session I was playing in (overall it was good) but i was'nt able to see the feedback for myself. Don't know if it was a bug or If there is a timer for how long you can see your own feedback. Edited July 9, 2017 by deskangaroo Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hogie838 Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 6 minutes ago, deskangaroo said: So I had given feedback for the session I was playing in (overall it was good) but i was'nt able to see the feedback for myself. Don't know if it was a bug or If there is a timer for how long you can see your own feedback. You need to wait 24 hours from the time your session has finished. Then check the gaming session and you will see any feedback left for you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HEAVENSBIGDADDY Posted July 9, 2017 Share Posted July 9, 2017 It's been roughly 2 days since the session, and I still haven't gotten my feedback. Thank you though for trying to assist me. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
gally14 Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 Haven't really been a fan of the feedback addition. I haven't read through the comments of this thread but is it true that if you don't leave feedback, you'll receive negative feedback? I haven't left feedback yet and it's for multiple reasons. 1. I don't always have an opportunity to log in every 24 hours and even if I did, I probably wouldn't 2. it seems you have to rate everyone rather then just 1 or some individuals. I've joined a lot of sessions where there's over 20 people in the session and you may only play with 1 or 2 of them. I get that there is a "no show" option but that doesn't seem proper either. 3. The host can change the date and time whenever they please, which means they could change the time to the current time, thereby ending the session instantly and you being unaware of it, which again brings me back to not having the opportunity to sign in within 24 hours to leave feedback. I feel like i've had a session or two where that has happened. I'm sure some of these things have been said, but I thought i'd share because i'm not a big fan like I said. I just don't want someone to choose not to play with me because of my rating. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DARKB1KE Posted July 18, 2017 Share Posted July 18, 2017 2 hours ago, gally14 said: 3. The host can change the date and time whenever they please, which means they could change the time to the current time, thereby ending the session instantly and you being unaware of it, which again brings me back to not having the opportunity to sign in within 24 hours to leave feedback. I feel like i've had a session or two where that has happened. Rate terrible hosts appropriately for not communicating to the people who signed up. They deserve the punishment for not being a good host, not communicating, etc. If they change the time without communicating it, that's on them. 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Arkthur Posted July 20, 2017 Share Posted July 20, 2017 All this being said, where exactly can I check my rep? 1 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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