Naughty Dog is terminating contract work for at least 25 developers ; no severance , required to keep working until the end of the intial end date , and told to keep quiet .

[JPtheNeurotic]

“Sources tell Kotaku that no severance is being offered for those currently laid off, and that impacted developers as well as remaining employees are being pressured to keep the news quiet. Their contracts won't be officially terminated until the end of October and they'll be expected to work through the rest of the month. Sony did not immediately respond to a request for comment.”

[DrBloodmoney]

The article appears not to understand how contracting works.

 

That's the nature of being a contractor - there is higher remittence, but the trade off is you are not an employee, and are not entitled to employee benefits like sick pay, holiday pay, severance etc.

 

The article refers to "impacted developers as well as remaining employees" - but this is a misnomer, as contractors are not employees, and are not bound (or protected) by the same rules.

 

[Gotakibono]

5 minutes ago, DrBloodmoney said:

The article appears not to understand how contracting works.

 

That's the nature of being a contractor - there is higher remittence, but the trade off is you are not an employee, and are not entitled to employee benefits like sick pay, holiday pay, severance etc.

 

The article refers to "impacted developers as well as remaining employees" - but this is a misnomer, as contractors are not employees, and are not bound (or protected) by the same rules.

 

 

Yep, pretty much this. Damn it, Dr. Bloodmoney, now I have nothing to say. 🚣‍♀️

[Don_Chipotle]

3 hours ago, DrBloodmoney said:

The article appears not to understand how contracting works.

 

That's the nature of being a contractor - there is higher remittence, but the trade off is you are not an employee, and are not entitled to employee benefits like sick pay, holiday pay, severance etc.

 

The article refers to "impacted developers as well as remaining employees" - but this is a misnomer, as contractors are not employees, and are not bound (or protected) by the same rules.

 

 

Totally nailed it

[GT__Jedi]

Yep, @DrBloodmoney explained it perfectly.  Being a contractor is fantastic, money is great but you need to take care of your expenses.  

[Ashande]

4 hours ago, JPtheNeurotic said:

“Sources tell Kotaku that no severance is being offered for those currently laid off, and that impacted developers as well as remaining employees are being pressured to keep the news quiet. Their contracts won't be officially terminated until the end of October and they'll be expected to work through the rest of the month. Sony did not immediately respond to a request for comment.”

 

My eye keeps coming back to is “expected to work through the rest of the month,” and the way they keep referring to them as “layoffs,” while not-so-subtly throwing shade with things like commentary on the amount of money Sony’s making and comparing it to Microsoft’s mass layoffs.

 

Of course they’re expected to work through the rest of the month, and do not get severance. That’s the nature of contract work. You sign a document that says you’ll do <x> work for <y> hours/days/weeks/months and be paid <z.> That’s it. They are not owed and should not expect severance packages; downside of basically being a freelancer. They promised to do the work for the set period of time for a set compensation, and if they got that compensation, then they need to do the work, regardless if their contract gets renewed or not.

 

Further, opting not to renew a contract is not the same as a layoff or firing. No one refers to athletes who don’t get reupped as being fired; if a publisher declines to buy my next novel, I’ve not been laid off. For one major difference, assuming the contracted employee did what they were supposed to do and did it well, they will usually receive a good reference - or be directed to somewhere else that needs that kind of work - as a common courtesy… for the contractor’s sake, I hope the negative framing is Kotaku being Kotaku, and not something the soon-to-be-former staff actually said or did, because this could well bite them in the butt if there’s a record of them talking smack somewhere.

 

Long story short: if they wanted a steady work environment that included severance packages, they should probably have been aiming to get standard jobs rather than contract work. I get that sometimes that’s how you get your foot in the door, but the terms are clearly laid out, and accepting them in the moment then complaining about it later when it doesn’t work to your advantage is tacky at best.

[Rozalia1]

5 hours ago, DrBloodmoney said:

The article appears not to understand how contracting works.

 

That's the nature of being a contractor - there is higher remittence, but the trade off is you are not an employee, and are not entitled to employee benefits like sick pay, holiday pay, severance etc.

 

The article refers to "impacted developers as well as remaining employees" - but this is a misnomer, as contractors are not employees, and are not bound (or protected) by the same rules.

 

 

Excellent first post that deals with the misinformation swiftly and easily.

 

1 hour ago, Ashande said:

 

My eye keeps coming back to is “expected to work through the rest of the month,” and the way they keep referring to them as “layoffs,” while not-so-subtly throwing shade with things like commentary on the amount of money Sony’s making and comparing it to Microsoft’s mass layoffs.

 

Of course they’re expected to work through the rest of the month, and do not get severance. That’s the nature of contract work. You sign a document that says you’ll do <x> work for <y> hours/days/weeks/months and be paid <z.> That’s it. They are not owed and should not expect severance packages; downside of basically being a freelancer. They promised to do the work for the set period of time for a set compensation, and if they got that compensation, then they need to do the work, regardless if their contract gets renewed or not.

 

Further, opting not to renew a contract is not the same as a layoff or firing. No one refers to athletes who don’t get reupped as being fired; if a publisher declines to buy my next novel, I’ve not been laid off. For one major difference, assuming the contracted employee did what they were supposed to do and did it well, they will usually receive a good reference - or be directed to somewhere else that needs that kind of work - as a common courtesy… for the contractor’s sake, I hope the negative framing is Kotaku being Kotaku, and not something the soon-to-be-former staff actually said or did, because this could well bite them in the butt if there’s a record of them talking smack somewhere.

 

Long story short: if they wanted a steady work environment that included severance packages, they should probably have been aiming to get standard jobs rather than contract work. I get that sometimes that’s how you get your foot in the door, but the terms are clearly laid out, and accepting them in the moment then complaining about it later when it doesn’t work to your advantage is tacky at best.

 

No accident. These sort of stories to make out that 'they're the same' are put out out there purposely to muddy things up. Some because they're stooges, others because they're under a weird view where they think 'balance' means doing stuff like this so you're 'hitting both sides'. Beyond the layoffs, contractors has been a thing that really came up for Microsoft as they use a massive amount of them to save on costs and apparently the sheer number has lead to decreased quality and large delays. Oh, but Sony laid off a tiny amount of contractors. So they both do it and are the same.

 

The OP being a big believer in that view and not liking getting pushback on it recently makes this suspicious. I hope it is just a mere coincidence.

[JPtheNeurotic]

Contract workers are absolutely shafted in this industry . People are gonna be losing their jobs and Sony isn’t struggling as a publisher . I say this still qualifies as “shit sucks “ and worth bringing attention to. This year has been awful for the industry and the workers in it . 

[Jelly Soup]

4 hours ago, JPtheNeurotic said:

Contract workers are absolutely shafted in this industry . People are gonna be losing their jobs and Sony isn’t struggling as a publisher .

 

Eh, that's a bit of a sensationalist take. In all industries, contractors exist as short-term advantage over long-term cost cutting for most businesses. The initial higher pay makes up with not having to cover benefits. Which comes with it's own downside for the person finding them, but that's another topic. If you're a professional contractor, you know what you're getting into before accepting. The jobs lost will be filled again with new contractors, likely many of the same ones. The only reason this can be spun as a notable story is Naughty Dog over contracted for whatever project and the visual is of an above average number of bodies leaving the building. That and tech industry contractors have a reputation for being prima donnas.

Edited October 3, 2023 by Jelly Soup

[modest_undue1]

How does this affect LeBron's basketball career?

[SwiftGuyver]

Kotaku? Awful "journalism"? I'm sure we're all shocked! 

[Vulpine9Tails]

I used to be employed on a contract basis and you always knew well beforehand if you're going to be renewed or let go. It's not hard to see it coming well in advance. These people are not as hard up as Kotaku is trying to make them out to be. Severance is not a thing when your contract literally tells you to get lost after a certain date. 

[JPtheNeurotic]

https://kotaku.com/nintendo-america-switch-employee-treatment-unionize-nlr-1848828975
 

 

https://www.polygon.com/platform/amp/features/2016/12/19/13878484/game-industry-worker-misclassification

 

I have no idea why there’s so much pushback against the idea the industry abuses its contwxt  workers . We know they already do it with its full time employees…

[DrBloodmoney]

25 minutes ago, JPtheNeurotic said:

I have no idea why there’s so much pushback against the idea the industry abuses its contwxt  workers . We know they already do it with its full time employees…

 

Because - speaking as a contractor - we are constantly having to go to greater and greater lengths to prove we are not "employees", primarily because misinformed idiots like the people writing these articles keep falsely claiming that contractors are similar to employees, muddying the waters, or claiming that contractors want to be employees, but are simply being stopped by the "big bad client companies".

 

Most contractors do not want to be employees. 

We do not want to be tied into some months-long notice periods, so we can't jump to a new contract if a more lucrative one comes up.

We do not want to be told what hours we should work, or where we need to do that work, or how we should do that work, or what we should wear when doing it.

We do not want to have our pay siphoned off to cover things like "holiday pay", or "pension plans", or to cover other employee perks that we don't need.

We do not want to have our hourly rates dictated by the "common mean", where everyone needs to be paid the same amount, regardless of how good at the job they are - we want to be able to negotiate our rates independently, and to renegotiate if a more lucrative offer comes in, with the freedom and the power of being able to sever the contract with immediacy if the client does not capitulate.

 

We don't want to receive pay for not working - we want to be paid the maximum rate the market will bear for the work we do, and have the freedom to pick and choose what that work is.

 

 

[Super_Mep]

36 minutes ago, JPtheNeurotic said:

https://kotaku.com/nintendo-america-switch-employee-treatment-unionize-nlr-1848828975
 

 

https://www.polygon.com/platform/amp/features/2016/12/19/13878484/game-industry-worker-misclassification

 

I have no idea why there’s so much pushback against the idea the industry abuses its contwxt  workers . We know they already do it with its full time employees…

"I HAD NO BENEFITS, NO INSURANCE, AND NO VACATION TIME."

 

It's like when they signed up to be 1099 they didn't understand how any of it works. Then cry anonymously to these "journalists". Straight clowns. 🤡

 

As a small business owner in the trades I have commercial contracts with some big businesses but I also understand they could terminate those contracts at any time with or without notice. It would suck but I'd just pick myself up and go find another one or double down on residential work.

 

My company losing a contract isn't news in my industry so why is this "news"? They might as well be reporting on the following:

Small child plays basketball on a hoop attached to a house at the top of a hill. Loses ball down hill. Child cries. "I HAD NO OTHER BALL, NO SAFETY NET, AND NOW I'M BORED."

[PIOTREK27-1982]

I hope Neil Bigot Sandwich Druckmann is among those people

[KennethMcCormick]

Am I the only one that was instantly reminded of this ?:

 

 

 

EDIT: Just noticed it now said the video was unavailable (was fine a few hours before). Well, fuck ’em. Was the TLoU clip with Joel and Ellie on horseback discussing contractors, nvm.

Edited October 4, 2023 by KennethMcCormick
Video rights changed on YouTube...

[JPtheNeurotic]

37 minutes ago, DrBloodmoney said:

Because - speaking as a contractor - we are constantly having to go to greater and greater lengths to prove we are not "employees", primarily because misinformed idiots like the people writing these articles keep falsely claiming that contractors are similar to employees, muddying the waters, or claiming that contractors want to be employees, but are simply being stopped by the "big bad client companies".

I can see that point about what I originally posted in the OP, but that’s not the impression I get from the other two I posted . 

[DrBloodmoney]

12 minutes ago, JPtheNeurotic said:

I can see that point about what I originally posted in the OP, but that’s not the impression I get from the other two I posted . 

 

My point is, those articles are based on faulty premises.

 

They are, most likely, written out of rage against corporations who are denying unions or covering up bad practices and whatnot - which are honest-to-goodness reasons to call attention, and that do need a light shone on them...

...but in the journalists zeal to fit that "corporations=bad" narrative, and be seen to be on the side of the "workers", they have a tendency to shoot themselves in the foot (and shoot a lot of other people in the process), by trying to fit other, completely unrelated things into that narrative.

 

There are plenty of problematic things that need to be addressed in that industry - and many of them relating to employee rights...

...but contractors vs employees is not one of them.

 

 

Many industries - in particular, ones like game development - could not possibly function if every person was permanently on the payroll.

 

Games take years to make - can you imagine what the cost of a game would be to the consumer, if people like QA testers, localisers, cut-scene animators, voice actors, mo-cap actors etc. were all permanently on payroll, receiving a full salary and benefits, pension contributions, etc all year round, despite only actually having work to do for 6 months every couple of years?

 

 

These kind of articles are actually bad on multiple fronts - not only do they do harm to contractors, by muddying the waters and making it harder for them to operate, but they also harm the employees and the fight against genuine employee issues, as non-issues being treated as similar to real issues dilutes the narrative, and makes it harder for people to distinguish the real problems from the fake ones.

 

 

 

 

Edited October 4, 2023 by DrBloodmoney

[JPtheNeurotic]

10 minutes ago, DrBloodmoney said:

Many industries - in particular, ones like game development - could not possibly function if every person was permanently on the payroll

To be clear , I recognize this and agree . I’m not saying contract work itself is bad . 
 

the impression I’m getting is they are using contract workers to circumvent a lot in favor of not wanting them in as full time employees but still treating them as such . The people in these articles seem physically and emotional hurt. I do t k kw what else to do with this information other than this is what’s been reported .

 

I do appreciate hearing from someone as yourself so if anything I’m saying is sounding dismissing to your profession it’s not intentional. I’m not in the business nor a contract worker . Just highly empathetic. 

[DrBloodmoney]

1 minute ago, JPtheNeurotic said:

To be clear , I recognize this and agree . I’m not saying contract work itself is bad . 
 

the impression I’m getting is they are using contract workers to circumvent a lot in favor of not wanting them in as full time employees but still treating them as such . The people in these articles seem physically and emotional hurt. I do t k kw what else to do with this information other than this is what’s been reported .

 

I do appreciate hearing from someone as yourself so if anything I’m saying is sounding dismissing to your profession it’s not intentional. I’m not in the business nor a contract worker . Just highly empathetic. 

 

Oh - to be clear - I'm not attacking you, and I totally realise what these articles can make contracting look like to the outsider, so it's totally understandable...

...but I think people need to take these kind of articles with a grain of salt, (or a good dollop of it!) because while there may be some instances where contracting is forced upon people as "disguised employment", the reality is that a lot of contractors want to be contractors, and get pretty annoyed when articles like these ones make that harder, by equating them with employees.