How The Hell Is This Possible ?!

[Mog]

 

You're said is exactly right. I just only backed up all save files to multiple USB, without syncing any trophy.

And then, delete the user and re-collected all the trophies.

 

I didn't any hacked. It was just completed the crushing mode at the first time. Not difficulty glitch. That's all.

 

 

You'll be removed from that list anyway once the DLCs come out, but if you really tried you could have gotten the plat in just a little over 4 hours and it would have looked legit since the WR for this game is around 4 hours. 2 hours is way too extreme and looking at your timestamps (the order of the trophies), it seriously just makes you look like a cheater.

 

The USB trick is useful for saving data in case your game glitches or if you lost the data somehow, but to trick the timer with it is not seen as "legit" in most (if not all) speedrun communities.

[Banana_Sausage47]

I haven't played the multiplayer portion of UC4 yet but this person unlocked the 10 sidekick spawns before completing the introduction. Is that possible?

[Cleggworth]

I haven't played the multiplayer portion of UC4 yet but this person unlocked the 10 sidekick spawns before completing the introduction. Is that possible?

You spawn a sidekick during the intro. So I guess restart it once you spawn them and only complete it when you have the trophy?

[DaScorpio_]

Wouldnt it be best to try and contact him on this site and ask him to provide screenshots for his trophies? 

 

In my opinion, this is a feature that is overlooked by a lot and if we would ask them to provide screenshots they MAY just show us if he hacked or not 

 

For example: If his 1st trophy is lets say at point X, and his 3rd and 4th ... 10th trophy pop in the same spot but with justifiable time in between, then he is surely a hacker unless he managed to get into the EXACT SAME SPOT for all 10 of his trophies (which in truth is impossible) 

 

If they are not in the same spot tho, that doesn't save him, as lets say his 1st trophy was in spot X and 2nd trophy in spot Y. if spot Y is somewhere where we would need to spend some time to get to and the trophy achiever miraculously got there in lets say, 2 seconds, then once again, he is most likely a cheater.

 

But if they don't provide a screenshot or even try to defend themselves, then I dont see a reason on why we shouldn't view him as a cheater and should just flag him. If he would ever decide to get back to clean leaderboard, then he could try to justify then, but if no then no.

[lesk8vaincra]

Yeah, like screenshots proves anything :-D

[DaScorpio_]

Yeah, like screenshots proves anything :-D

If we would be on a challenge to find a cheater/hacker.

and I would have the permission to use screenshots of trophies and you wouldn't,

I can bet you anything you want that I would be one 1 who finds the cheater/hacker

[gohabsgo31price]

I don't understand why you guys are giving him/her that much attention... In a few months, when ND releases its single player dlc that is bound to have trophies attach to it, all this pathetic trickery will have been for naught. And it's not improbable that there'd be MP trophies added too eventually.

I'm 3rd to have U3's 100% but I'm more proud to say it was achieve without tricks, glitches or even boost. That person shouldn't be allowed to be on the leaderboard, but then again, that can be said for so many others.

Anyway, it's clear that this person did this to compensate for her messy personal life... Or lack of... No real gamer would've played a great game that is U4 that way...

[DaScorpio_]

I don't understand why you guys are giving him/her that much attention... In a few months, when ND releases its single player dlc that is bound to have trophies attach to it, all this pathetic trickery will have been for naught. And it's not improbable that there'd be MP trophies added too eventually.

I'm 3rd to have U3's 100% but I'm more proud to say it was achieve without tricks, glitches or even boost. That person shouldn't be allowed to be on the leaderboard, but then again, that can be said for so many others.

Anyway, it's clear that this person did this to compensate for her messy personal life... Or lack of... No real gamer would've played a great game that is U4 that way...

But the thing is, its not just this person in specific but people in general who abuse their saves to achieve these times. Lets say in this thread we decide to ban people who achieve these " extreme " times. Then we wouldn't need to create more threads like this.

 

Yeah, this person might not be in top when DLC comes out, but what about games where people do the same thing to DLC's as well (or games with no DLC, EG: Injustice)?

[MMDE]

Wouldnt it be best to try and contact him on this site and ask him to provide screenshots for his trophies?

 

See the first post on second page of this thread...

[DaScorpio_]

See the first post on second page of this thread...

Yeah, I didn't read the thread, (whoops) but couldnt s/he give screenshots of actually getting the trophies, ( the same way that when trophy pops, it gives us a screenshot), with the help of them, it would be much easier to say if s/he did hack or not (or if it was only save manipulation)

[MMDE]

Yeah, I didn't read the thread, (whoops) but couldnt s/he give screenshots of actually getting the trophies, ( the same way that when trophy pops, it gives us a screenshot), with the help of them, it would be much easier to say if s/he did hack or not (or if it was only save manipulation)

 

If you look at the screenshots they gave

 

 

Can you see the stats? How close are they to get the trophies?

[DaScorpio_]

If you look at the screenshots they gave

 

 

Can you see the stats? How close are they to get the trophies?

I mean something like that 

[Gage]

I mean something like that

Doesn't mean anything, because those can glitch or just be turned off if a person doesn't want then to be taken. It's not hacked, you can't hack trophies on the ps4. It's just abusing profile deletion and multiple saves which is something that shouldn't be allowed, since if it were done on a PS3 game you would be flagged for it.

[diskdocx]

Doesn't mean anything, because those can glitch or just be turned off if a person doesn't want then to be taken. It's not hacked, you can't hack trophies on the ps4. It's just abusing profile deletion and multiple saves which is something that shouldn't be allowed, since if it were done on a PS3 game you would be flagged for it.

He actually contacted me via PSN. Although not the only one, I believe he felt I had most strongly acused him of hacking.

 

I retract that. I do not believe he hacked the trophies. I believe he used the manipulation as I laid out on the previous page. Same goes for TTR.

 

I maintain that this is an extremely cheap tactic, and is not a true speed run. It is, essentially, cheating, if you were to classify a speed run as playing the game in order. I understand that this is not strictly breaking any rule, but once you have to delete your profile to 'un-earn' a trophy, I don't think your time should be valid.

 

Furthermore, I agree with gage, that such a profile would be flagged on the PS3.

 

So, I retract my hacking accusation. I can't be bothered to waste more time on the argument about what is/isn't cheating.

 

I would, however, suggest that Sly consider implementing  a reporting option to have this type of profile flagged so that it can be removed from the time to leaderboards, but not relegated to the dirty leaderboards.

Edited May 19, 2016 by diskdocx

[HardXDXtraga]

I maintain that this is an extremely cheap tactic, and is not a true speed run. It is, essentially, cheating, if you were to classify a speed run as playing the game in order. I understand that this is not strictly breaking any rule, but once you have to delete your profile to 'un-earn' a trophy, I don't think your time should be valid.

 

Furthermore, I agree with gage, that such a profile would be flagged on the PS3.

 

So, I retract my hacking accusation. I can't be bothered to waste more time on the argument about what is/isn't cheating.

 

I would, however, suggest that Sly consider implementing  a reporting option to have this type of profile flagged so that it can be removed from the time to leaderboards, but not relegated to the dirty leaderboards.

I agree with your idea, but it wouldn't be ideal, all it takes is for someone to go to the fastest times and see a time they deem impossible to report.

We know that in this case he did save manipulation, but in games like The Unfinished Swan where all it takes is some careful planning like bcks007 said, people would just report because they wouldn't think it was possible, and that would only create more "I got flagged" topics where people who did careful planning to get on a leaderboard have to explain what they did.

[Gage]

I agree with your idea, but it wouldn't be ideal, all it takes is for someone to go to the fastest times and see a time they deem impossible to report.

We know that in this case he did save manipulation, but in games like The Unfinished Swan where all it takes is some careful planning like bcks007 said, people would just report because they wouldn't think it was possible, and that would only create more "I got flagged" topics where people who did careful planning to get on a leaderboard have to explain what they did.

I think that's fine, that's why there needs to be a way to dispute flags other than just posting a feedback topic. If someone did earn all the trophies legitimately in the proper order with careful planning (which there are lots of examples of) that's fine and could be explained, but blatantly cheated times that can't be explained other than through save manipulation and profile deletion shouldn't be allowed.

[diskdocx]

I agree with your idea, but it wouldn't be ideal, all it takes is for someone to go to the fastest times and see a time they deem impossible to report.

We know that in this case he did save manipulation, but in games like The Unfinished Swan where all it takes is some careful planning like bcks007 said, people would just report because they wouldn't think it was possible, and that would only create more "I got flagged" topics where people who did careful planning to get on a leaderboard have to explain what they did.

 

Again, there could be the option to report someone for cheating/hacking vs flagging them for profile manipulation. Currently, when you report someone, you have to mark trophies and a reason - servers down, out of order, too close together etc.

 

There could be the choice to report someone for hacking, which would have them removed to the dirty leaderboards, or for manipulating their trophies - in this case, perhaps simply their times are removed from the fastest leaderboards, but they are not moved to the dirty list.

 

I think that's fine, that's why there needs to be a way to dispute flags other than just posting a feedback topic. If someone did earn all the trophies legitimately in the proper order with careful planning (which there are lots of examples of) that's fine and could be explained, but blatantly cheated times that can't be explained other than through save manipulation and profile deletion shouldn't be allowed.

 

And I think it would be fairly easy to separate - popping an entire list in minutes, or having trophies from closed servers - those are easy to identify as hacks, and really there is no explanation.

 

Manipulating saves isn't hacking, and if someone really wants to go through the time to do it, more power to them. But their times absolutely cannot stand as valid. I do think that a line should be drawn between timing trophies, using saves to cut down replays etc, and wiping your profile to remove earlier trophies to create a false gap. In the former, you are using the normal game mechanics. In the latter, you are intentionally falsifying your results.

[lesk8vaincra]

I don't understand some people. Planning à fast plat with any possible roadmap is ok for everyone, but using your own save multiple time is not? Why?

[Mog]

I don't understand some people. Planning à fast plat with any possible roadmap is ok for everyone, but using your own save multiple time is not? Why?

 

If you look at their timestamps for the trophies, you'll see it looks as if it was hacked, so it just shows that this is wrong. But if you speedrun a game through careful planning and glitch knowledge, the trophies will still be on the right order even though you finished it super fast.

 

& that's just not how you speedrun games, lol. I don't think i've ever seen anyone use an USB stick in events like AGDQ. (could be wrong though!)

[Gage]

I don't understand some people. Planning à fast plat with any possible roadmap is ok for everyone, but using your own save multiple time is not? Why?

Yeah it's not really the multiple saves things as it is profile deletion to allow you so do a bunch of stuff at once. The time they have for uncharted is literally impossible to legitimately do without profile deletion because they made it so they earned all collectible trophies at once. Stuff like backing up saves to get multiple endings of a game in one playthrough is fine (Dark Souls, Bloodborne) but deleting your profile to get rid of earlier trophy pops to have all of trophies for say collectibles pop at once is cheating, and if it were done on a ps3 game looks no different than just hacking the trophies.

Edited May 19, 2016 by ggamer15

[Nitro]

He's a hacker. It is impossible to get the trophy for finding one treasure and finding all of the treasures seconds apart. Hopefully somebody reports him.

 

Didnt they fix that ages ago?

 

But yeah PS4 trophies on are quite messy. I mean there are obvious illegitimate times. Id say any trophy earnt after the PS4 download glitch was patched can be reported. Would that fix the problem? 

 

Not necessarily. The PS4 has to date not been hacked, so maybe Sony is less prepared to identify hackers. There may be a way to hack PS4 trophies on OFW without raising any flags.

 

Not that you guys are the only ones saying it but I'm too lazy to look for more

Anyway, this guy is obviously not a hacker

I mean I don't know how many of you know of it but it has been happening on the Vita for a looong time now. People will unlock the platinum without syncing, then will copy their save to the cloud, delete their profile and re-download their save and since the PS4 is "Un-flaggable" people took that opportunity to use this method.

 

How does this give them a fast time?

Well, since their trophies dates have not been uploaded to the server, it doesn't recognise any trophies have been earned for said game on said person's account. For this reason, they are able to get extremely fast times.

Ex. If there is 3 trophies to get a # of kills in a game, for this example we will say 10 kills, 100 kills and 1,000 kills, once they re-download their already platted save and get their first kill, the game will realise that the trophy requirement has been met and will all corresponding trophies.

 

Hope this clears up some misconceptions

[Gibbo_0113]

Not that you guys are the only ones saying it but I'm too lazy to look for more

Anyway, this guy is obviously not a hacker

I mean I don't know how many of you know of it but it has been happening on the Vita for a looong time now. People will unlock the platinum without syncing, then will copy their save to the cloud, delete their profile and re-download their save and since the PS4 is "Un-flaggable" people took that opportunity to use this method.

 

How does this give them a fast time?

Well, since their trophies dates have not been uploaded to the server, it doesn't recognise any trophies have been earned for said game on said person's account. For this reason, they are able to get extremely fast times.

Ex. If there is 3 trophies to get a # of kills in a game, for this example we will say 10 kills, 100 kills and 1,000 kills, once they re-download their already platted save and get their first kill, the game will realise that the trophy requirement has been met and will all corresponding trophies.

 

Hope this clears up some misconceptions

Exactly so something the user decided to do himself so he cheated. If people cant use their own saves on PS3 and are slammed for being a cheater on here then it should be the same for PS4. No picking and choosing. 

[gohabsgo31price]

But the thing is, its not just this person in specific but people in general who abuse their saves to achieve these times. Lets say in this thread we decide to ban people who achieve these " extreme " times. Then we wouldn't need to create more threads like this.

 

Yeah, this person might not be in top when DLC comes out, but what about games where people do the same thing to DLC's as well (or games with no DLC, EG: Injustice)?

True, but unfortunately the site's owner's policy on the matter is to not turn it into a witch hunt. Which I can't say is wrong. Ban the most obvious? It's already being done.

Now the real question is: Should deleting profiles and using the saves to unlock trophies all at once be considered cheating?

I think a poll is in order.

My personal opinion on the matter: YES. You temper with your saves and your profile, you use someone else's saves, or simply hack your profile, you didn't play the game the way it was meant to be played. Thought I admit, the former requires a lot more effort.

[Cleggworth]

Exactly so something the user decided to do himself so he cheated. If people cant use their own saves on PS3 and are slammed for being a cheater on here then it should be the same for PS4. No picking and choosing.

There is a difference though. The PS3 can be hacked so in lots of cases you cannot tell the difference between a hacker and a genuine save manipulation for a fast plat. As believable as some peoples explanation can be, anybody could pull that card and get reinstated on the leader board. You've got to flag everybody.

The PS4 cannot be hacked (as of now), if someone has a fast seemingly impossible time the only explanation is save manipulation. They completed all the requirements for the trophies just used some trickery to get a fast time.

The system as it is now allows this to happen. In my eyes there is no difference between this and exploiting a glitch to earn a trophy. A lot of the fun for these people is pushing the limit on how low can they get their time by doing this. Why should we deny them their version of fun?

People are upset as there is a fast time at the top of the leaderboard that they will seemingly never have the opportunity to beat. What about first achievers leaderboard? Should we move powerpyx et al off that as they have early copies which is unachievable for the rest of us too?

I just don't see this as solvable tbh

[PerryToxteth]

- Just my quick opinion - it is a faulty time. His time records as 2 hours and change to platinum, but in truth, he spent many more hours in the game to beat it. Those hours aren't truthfully recorded because he deleted the profile. Finding a loophole to manipulate the data doesn't earn you a speedrun.

- You can't claim to have run a record-setting marathon by having the first 20 miles run by a ghost profile, only to have your official profile jump in and run the last 6.2 miles, and then claim that you won the race bc the ghost's time didn't record on your profile.