Amazing Game, Crappy Trophy List

[DrBloodmoney]

2 minutes ago, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

I appreciate that, and the feeling is mutual. I would just say that you keep talking about challenge; a challenging list, a challenging game. I'm just pointing out that in the beginning of this thread you and I were on the same page about what this really comes down to, and I'm not sure where along the way it kind of got reduced to "difficulty" as much. 

 

That's true - I am addressing primarily the 'difficulty' aspect of the list - only because that's the only part I take a bit of issue with the complaints about.

Other aspects  - where the list is simply considered 'uninspired' or what-have-you -  I think are fair game for a complaint, but that hasn't been the brunt of the more pointed complaints, and certainly hasn't been cited as setting a precedent for other games.

 

2 minutes ago, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

But all in all my personal argument as to why this single game's deviation toward the unfulfilling side of trophy hunting is bad for the hobby is because it is in line with a negative trend. More shallow lists, more easy games, ps5 autopops. These are bad for the hobby, that's just my opinion, I can't see it any other way. This R&C game for all the reasons mostly pointed out on the front page and then reiterated for the rest of the thread, is almost more of a trendsetter than anything because of its popularity. But challenge, difficulty, these are things that I really think are not the point here

 

Sure, I see R&C being easy as falling in that camp - but I just don't see it as a point on a downward trend - because those were never the games to offer it anyways. 

 

I generally don't hold with this idea that trophy hunting as a broad hobby is suffering for it.

 

Yes, the auto pops are silly, but there really aren't that many of them- and very few are unavoidable.

 

Yes, there are many more stacks and 'EZPZ' games, but the only people who even care about the trophies anyone has are other trophy hunters, and they are the same group who know exactly what a profile full of stacked half hour platinums means.

 

Yes, lists on major first-party releases might be easier than before - but those were never the games that provided the big challenges or the most inspired lists anyways - they were always about the games rather than the challenge of the lists.

 

I just find that a landscape that has seen the explosion of Souls-Like into the mainstream, the massive reinvigoration of the Rogue-Like, and difficulty-as-selling-point platformers like SMB & Celeste and arcade games (Housemarque etc.) coming out of the indie scene - all within the last decade - could ever be seen to truly be suffering simply due to the parallel easing of difficulty of it's AAA tent-pole releases.

 

[Deadly_Ha_Ha]

@DrBloodmoney maybe I'm just being pessimistic, and it's entirely possible that I am, but I'm not seeing a brighter landscape on the ps5 moving forward. I think devs continuing to release games for PS4 and ps5 is going to bring more autopops for longer, and the simplicity and yes "ease" of the lists will likely not diminish. Even for me personally, Kingdom Hearts Melody of Memory had such an oversimplified, easy list that it grossed me out. It could be a drop in the bucket, or it could not be. I'm not holding out much hope. But you and I aren't really talking so much about difficulty because if I'm looking for difficulty I know where to look. Even Returnal has a 15% list. Look at the other Housemarque games, that's pretty common.

[Sebulba2000]

On 16.06.2021 at 5:31 PM, bosstristan said:

Am I the only one who's completely disappointed by the trophy list?

 

Don't get me wrong, the game is truly amazing, and that what matters the most.

 

But when it comes to the trophy list, it's really... not there. You don't even need to finish the game in this or that difficulty, collect all spy bots, all orbs, all gold bolts (wtf), beat challenge mode, beat all the arena challenges, upgrade all weapons... It is a real shame, you can basically get the plat' with no effort whatsoever, leaving the game to not even 50%... I don't mean trophies should be excruciatingly hard, but just enough so it feels like you actually achieved something, you completed the game to 100% (especially when it's such a short game like this one, for games like Just Cause 2, 75% required is enough imo).

Plus, collectible are sh*t easy to find AND displayed on the map, what is this, Assassin's Creed?

 

Anyway, I've completed the game 100% (without activating the preorder DLC which seems to be quite game breaking btw)  and I'm now playing challenge mode in the highest difficulty. I find it really sad they wanted to make is so 'accessible', a platinum should not be too accessible, that's the point of a reward/trophy/achievement.

Yep, like what's the point of easing the trophy lists? It's so frustrating they keep nerfing them...

Edited June 26, 2021 by Sebulba2000

[DrBloodmoney]

Just now, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

@DrBloodmoney maybe I'm just being pessimistic, and it's entirely possible that I am,

 

I do try to look on the bright side - that's true?

There's enough to be pessimistic about in real-life, that when it comes to a hobby I love as much as gaming, I try to see the good side - and to me, it really does feel like there has never been a better time to be gaming - there's more on offer, in more different categories and genres (and difficulties) - on all points of the spectrum - not to be ☺️

 

Just now, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

but I'm not seeing a brighter landscape on the ps5 moving forward. I think devs continuing to release games for PS4 and ps5 is going to bring more autopops for longer, and the simplicity and yes "ease" of the lists will likely not diminish.

 

Maybe, sure, but aside from Hitman 3, which is impossible to avoid auto popping, I think for the most part autopos can be avoided if you don't want them, simply by not importing a save - certainly some of the ones I have, such as FFVIIR and Spiderman are not forced Autopops - you can chose not to do it and still replay entirely form scratch.

 

Just now, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

 Even Returnal has a 15% list. Look at the other Housemarque games, that's pretty common.

 

That's true - but I will say - I think raw rarity values are a little deceptive with a game like Returnal - since mostly everyone  - certainly everyone who is trophy hunting on this site, and gaming-centric enough to have a PS5 right now, which, let's face it, requires some hoops to jumped through - is well aware of the rough level of challenge Housemarque games offer. Most folks who go into it are doing so fully aware of the challenge, and those not up for it are just staying away entirely.

 

Remember - Sekiro has a raw rarity percentage of 27%-odd, which I would argue is not at all a reflection on the challenge of the game - it's much more about FROM software having made a name for themselves already, and the general audience being fully aware of what their games are, and either knowing it will be a tough challenge and wanting to face it, or staying clear of the game entierly.

[Deadly_Ha_Ha]

32 minutes ago, DrBloodmoney said:

 

Maybe, sure, but aside from Hitman 3, which is impossible to avoid auto popping, I think for the most part autopos can be avoided if you don't want them, simply by not importing a save - certainly some of the ones I have, such as FFVIIR and Spiderman are not forced Autopops - you can chose not to do it and still replay entirely form scratch.

 

You are atypical if that's the case, I assume. I think most people with a ps5 who have the game done on ps4 imported and grabbed up the plat the easy way. It may seem overly critical, but even the option is a bad thing for this hobby overall. Sony went from shared lists to just giving plats away. That is not good and yes it will end at some point but I'm not into it. It drives plat rates through the roof and I personally do not like seeing more common plats than less common ones, so I just refuse to go from 18% to 43% for FF7R. The disclaimer is that I know I'm not in the average range of how I see and participate with this hobby, but I'm just talking about me here as for what I think is happening. If others are fine with this all, and many seem to be, then alright, but it's made me way more critical of all things I do with playing games in a way I find disappointing

37 minutes ago, DrBloodmoney said:

 

That's true - but I will say - I think raw rarity values are a little deceptive with a game like Returnal - since mostly everyone  - certainly everyone who is trophy hunting on this site, and gaming-centric enough to have a PS5 right now, which, let's face it, requires some hoops to jumped through - is well aware of the rough level of challenge Housemarque games offer. Most folks who go into it are doing so fully aware of the challenge, and those not up for it are just staying away entirely.

 

Remember - Sekiro has a raw rarity percentage of 27%-odd, which I would argue is not at all a reflection on the challenge of the game - it's much more about FROM software having made a name for themselves already, and the general audience being fully aware of what their games are, and either knowing it will be a tough challenge and wanting to face it, or staying clear of the game entierly.

This is true to be honest

[DrBloodmoney]

45 minutes ago, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

I personally do not like seeing more common plats than less common ones, so I just refuse to go from 18% to 43% for FF7R. The disclaimer is that I know I'm not in the average range of how I see and participate with this hobby, but I'm just talking about me here as for what I think is happening. If others are fine with this all, and many seem to be, then alright, but it's made me way more critical of all things I do with playing games in a way I find disappointing

 

I understand - we do differ on this fundamentally.

I just never want the trophies to affect what games I play, period. I wouldn't want to avoid a game I might like because it was too hard, but the same if it was too easy... or too 'common' in rarity.

 

I mean, I do understand where you are coming from, and can respect it - but I do have a question, if it's okay to ask?:

 

I know you have said before that you like to specifically select the games you put on your profile, and don't want to put games there if the rarity is too high - FFVIIR in this case. I don't prejudge based on rarity, as you know, and put anything on mine that I feel like playing, (including stuff I know you would call shovel ware ?? - Ratalaika and such) and never worry about it.

We have roughly the same completion percentage (98.6% vs. 96.2% - yes, yours is better, but there's not a million miles between them).

 The biggest difference is our average rarity - 37.7% (yours) vs. 44.2% (mine).

 

So, do you feel like that 6.5% difference is worth missing out on games you might like, but don't want to play as they might affect your profile? 

 

Make no mistake - I'm not judging or being pointed - it's a genuine query - as it just feels like a lot of work and additional thought has to go in to deciding what to add to your profile, and potential missing out, for a relatively marginal difference in one statistic?

 

 

Edited June 23, 2021 by DrBloodmoney

[ThatMuttGuy]

I think a lot of what OP is saying has been lost on some people. I appreciate all the civility in this topic though, because it's not something you always see on this site!

 

Anyway, I think people seem to think that people are mad that this game isn't hard. However, my interpretation is that it isn't the case. Nothing about the game needs to be changed at all, but the trophy list asks you to do almost nothing compared to the older R+C games. I don't think getting all the Gold Bolts or upgrading all the guns is asking for much at all. Again, no one is saying the game has to be hard, but the trophy list should at least be more comprehensive. 

[Deadly_Ha_Ha]

20 minutes ago, DrBloodmoney said:

 

So, do you feel like that 6.5% difference is worth missing out on games you might like, but don't want to play as they might affect your profile? 

 

Make no mistake - I'm not judging or being pointed - it's a genuine query - as it just feels like a lot of work and additional thought has to go in to deciding what to add to your profile, and potential missing out, for a relatively marginal difference in one statistic?

 

 

Nah you're good. I don't care about average rarity as this site calculates it. I care about average platinum rarity. I try to keep my account at an average platinum rarity of 15% or less. Right now I think it's at like 14% or something. I will play a game with a 30% plat, even 40% or whatever because it doesn't offset my average rarity too much, or even if it does I'll just play a game to bring the scale back to level. I do not want any common plats on this account, and those games like R&C RA which just cleared 50% will never be on this account. The truth that a lot of people seem to get upset about for some reason with me is that I have Oro_Castoro as my old account which is now a burner, and I can play any game on that account, but I don't think it's worth it. I don't think it's worth your time to play a game that doesn't fit your trophy hunting style unless you have the time to deviate away from your trophy hunting efforts. Personally, I do not. I cannot spare the time and effort of playing games I would enjoy if they won't be on this account, or a smurf account I plan on making. Reason being is because I've just come to tie this hobby so closely to gaming on the whole. Not everyone went that far and they can be happy with it like I'm happy with what I'm doing, but that's maybe the answer to your question. I made this account to be a 100% account with a certain average rarity and cap on how common any game can be. 

 

And just to address something else that may be said of what all I just said, I don't think I'm limiting myself in any way. I think there's creativity in constraint, and having a more concrete idea of what you want and what you don't want isn't a negative. I cannot have multiple projects open because it is my desire to give my all to one thing at a time. I do not care how long it takes to get to something because I know I'll get to it eventually. If new games come out I want to play I'll work them in sooner than later. I find I can get further faster by putting boundaries up around my time and effort rather than just going in all directions at once

Edited June 23, 2021 by Deadly_Ha_Ha

[DrBloodmoney]

2 minutes ago, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

Nah you're good. I don't care about average rarity as this site calculates it. I care about average platinum rarity. I try to keep my account at an average platinum rarity of 15% or less. Right now I think it's at like 14% or something. I will play a game with a 30% plat, even 40% or whatever because it doesn't offset my average rarity too much, or even if it does I'll just play a game to bring the scale back to level. I do not want any common plats on this account, and those games like R&C RA which just cleared 50% will never be on this account. The truth that a lot of people seem to get upset about for some reason with me is that I have Oro_Castoro as my old account which is now a burner, and I can play any game on that account, but I don't think it's worth it. I don't think it's worth your time to play a game that doesn't fit your trophy hunting style unless you have the time to deviate away from your trophy hunting efforts. Personally, I do not. I cannot spare the time and effort of playing games I would enjoy if they won't be on this account, or a smurf account I plan on making. Reason being is because I've just come to tie this hobby so closely to gaming on the whole. Not everyone went that far and they can be happy with it like I'm happy with what I'm doing, but that's maybe the answer to your question. I made this account to be a 100% account with a certain average rarity and cap on how common any game can be. 

 

Fair enough - while I couldn't play that way, if it brings you joy, then who am I to judge

 

 I never really though about gaming in terms of "Trophy Hunting Style" - I'm not sure what mine would even be 

 

I suspect my 'trophy hunting style' is a lot like my 'dancing style' - flail around like an idiot, never really know where I'm going, crash constantly into walls, fall over a lot, and just kind of hope that eventually I will have been doing it long enough that I at least sort of look like I knew what I was doing the whole time...?

[Deadly_Ha_Ha]

4 minutes ago, DrBloodmoney said:

 

Fair enough - while I couldn't play that way, if it brings you joy, then who am I to judge

 

 I never really though about gaming in terms of "Trophy Hunting Style" - I'm not sure what mine would even be 

 

I suspect my 'trophy hunting style' is a lot like my 'dancing style' - flail around like an idiot, never really know where I'm going, crash constantly into walls, fall over a lot, and just kind of hope that eventually I will have been doing it long enough that I at least sort of look like I knew what I was doing the whole time...

Yeah I have a really intensive personality with things like this. I can't go back once I start valuing my efforts in a certain way and I can't do this any other way any more

[bosstristan]

This thread has never been about the difficulty of the game, I actually found the game to be just challenging enough (at least in hard and very hard) to keep me in the flow. 

 

This thread is solely about the trophy list, which requires you to basically complete the game 20%.

 

I really don't mind easy games with easy trophies (ones which are not wh*re games like Mayo mind you), provided they require you to experience the game fully. For instance, I would have ranted if The Walking Dead trophy list only asked you to play up to chapter 2.

 

I think @DrBloodmoney said earlier that R&C games have always been easy. In its own design, yes (even though the first one was not THAT easy), but they had tons of things to complete: gold bolts, weapon upgrades, skill points... and when the trilogy was released on PS3, they had an appropriate trophy list, asking you to find all gold bolts, and perform every skill point.

Was it hard? No. Was it appropriate, fun, and rewarding when the platinum trophy popped? Hell yes.

Edited June 23, 2021 by bosstristan

[scemopagliaccioh]

On 22/06/2021 at 11:38 AM, PhantomFear94 said:

 

This is the quote from PowerPyx, knew I saw it somewhere, was in the comments section of his Ghost of Tsushima list reveal.

 

"Since God of War (2018) they no longer have any difficulty related trophies in Sony games. One of Sony’s internal policies they’ve had for years, none of their games included any difficulty trophies since then in the main list (only as DLC trophies that were patched in later, for example in Days Gone). Sony no longer allows their first-party devs to put in difficulty-related trophies. From what I heard they made this change in order to “boost sales” as their analysts think hard trophies turn off some trophy hunters from purchasing a game. All Sony games are now easy peasy."

 

https://www.powerpyx.com/ghost-of-tsushima-trophy-list-revealed/

Well, that really wraps it up.

Getting the platinum trophy is now part of the experience for Sony, rather than an achievement you get for mastering the game.

I’m not sure though, if it really is the most cost efficient method for trophy hunters, if Sony  knows some people  will outright skip the game if it has a difficult platinum, what’s to stop them selling the game after a day or two of getting the platinum?  Difficulty wise, they might have  engineered the right amount to have almost everyone getting the platinum, but a plat being 10 hours invites selling the game second hand as soon as possible.

[offdutysuperhero]

3 hours ago, bosstristan said:

This thread has never been about the difficulty of the game, I actually found the game to be just challenging enough (at least in hard and very hard) to keep me in the flow. 

 

This thread is solely about the trophy list, which requires you to basically complete the game 20%.

And the fact you can skip all glitch and clanks mini games.. not like they were hard to begin with, its just sad.

[AJ_Radio]

9 hours ago, bosstristan said:

This thread has never been about the difficulty of the game, I actually found the game to be just challenging enough (at least in hard and very hard) to keep me in the flow. 

 

This thread is solely about the trophy list, which requires you to basically complete the game 20%.

 

I really don't mind easy games with easy trophies (ones which are not wh*re games like Mayo mind you), provided they require you to experience the game fully. For instance, I would have ranted if The Walking Dead trophy list only asked you to play up to chapter 2.

 

I think @DrBloodmoney said earlier that R&C games have always been easy. In its own design, yes (even though the first one was not THAT easy), but they had tons of things to complete: gold bolts, weapon upgrades, skill points... and when the trilogy was released on PS3, they had an appropriate trophy list, asking you to find all gold bolts, and perform every skill point.

Was it hard? No. Was it appropriate, fun, and rewarding when the platinum trophy popped? Hell yes.

 

Right. Ratchet & Clank games were never all that challenging. DrBloodmoney keeps telling us we're expecting challenge, go play some Sekiro: Shadows Die Twice or Wolfenstein II: The New Colossus if you want a challenge.

 

He failed to get the point of this thread, and I feel I'll just be wasting time trying to dissect most of everything he's trying to explain to us.

Edited June 23, 2021 by AJ_Radio

[PhantomFear94]

18 hours ago, scemopagliaccioh said:

Well, that really wraps it up.

Getting the platinum trophy is now part of the experience for Sony, rather than an achievement you get for mastering the game.

I’m not sure though, if it really is the most cost efficient method for trophy hunters, if Sony  knows some people  will outright skip the game if it has a difficult platinum, what’s to stop them selling the game after a day or two of getting the platinum?  Difficulty wise, they might have  engineered the right amount to have almost everyone getting the platinum, but a plat being 10 hours invites selling the game second hand as soon as possible.

Length  wise, I couldn't agree more. Speaking for myself, my main issue is the price vs. amount of content. This game is incredible, but as I said on the list reveal, £70 for 15 hours of content is pretty difficult to argue in my opinion. I appreciate quality > quantity, and that there is a lot of next-gen stuff going on, but I don’t think its enough to warrant that sort of return for the price, and its pretty ridiculous in AAA terms. Over-paying for an amazing indie is one thing, where a small team with limited resources have had to grind away, but AAA studios don’t need that sort of premium cash return with industry standard already at £60, and I hate Sony’s approach in this regard. Even as a trophy hunter, 100% completion requirements or hard difficulty trophies wouldn’t fix this as an issue.

 

----------

 

TL;DR - I understand Sony's policy, and most exclusives can give you the challenge (or some challenge) if you seek if out.

 

Some of this is more related to the topic in general, rather than this specific comment. Probably going to get some kick back on this -  but I don’t have an issue with Sony's policy, and I find the resistance from the community somewhat perplexing. It sort of is what it is for me, personally. I think it's all comes down to just HOW much trophies define your experience - for me, even as a very keen trophy hunter and 100% seeker, I don't personally think that just because there isn't a trophy for something that it isn't still a content-option the developer have offered to you, the consumer. Or in other words, just because it doesn't create a challenge for us as trophy hunters, in a trophy context, doesn't mean there isn't a challenge THERE if we want to seek it enough. I find it weird when people criticise Sony for easy platinums but if they want to make it more challenging for themselves, then they could easily due to the range of options available. From a pure gameplay standpoint, most Sony games have very easy easiest difficulty settings, and pretty challenging on hard difficulty options (although even some of the hard difficulty settings are too bad, I’d argue) - God of War and TLOU2 being decent examples - so I feel there is something for most experiences.

 

Sony are geared towards accessibility in every form in many of its titles, from skill-set to disability, so having ultra-hard trophies in the base list is counter-intuitive to that goal in my opinion. If it's from a completion ratio perspective arguement...well, there are so many incredibly skilled gamers these days, so seeking to be one of an 'elite' few is going to be exceedingly rare unless a game is borderline impossible. Also, games like Returnal and Demon’s Souls are by their very nature pretty difficult and are more of that sort of 'elite skill-set, only those who are really good will get the platinum' type of games, so even with Sony exclusives there are some challenging platinum’s. Most Sony exclusives have NG+ hard difficulty patches for developers who want to give some incentive for those seeking a challenge outside of this internal policy.

 

Another point, as I'm seeing a bunch of "you don't need all collectibles is BS" debate - I’m doing an 100% run of this game myself to get as much as I can out of the game, and its barely adding any time on. Whether people feel it should or shouldn’t require 100% completion, from a pragmatic point of view, it isn’t going to vary your mileage very much anyway. I’m at 9-10 hours, and I have everything physically possible up until the return visit to Sargasso, and enough bolts for all remaining weapons as and when I unlock them (I haven’t skipped a single cutscene and even AFK’d for a short while). People are also quick enough to complain - rightly so - when multi-dozen hour games have hundreds of collectibles, and if even 1 bugs out, your platinum is gone until a patch, or a new game where you need to just pray it doesn't happen again. Collectibles don't usually require much skill (emphasise usually, some games they are related to challenge, like DOOM - which I understand 'counting' more) so I don't really know what its adding to the experience.

 

Edited June 24, 2021 by PhantomFear94

[upindat]

This is the BEST looking game on the PS5. I was so happy to finally get my console and wasn't impressed until I started this game. Amazing quality and lots of fun. As for the trophy list I will take it!!!! Insomniac is KILLING it lately.   

[AJ_Radio]

1 hour ago, PhantomFear94 said:

Length  wise, I couldn't agree more. Speaking for myself, my main issue is the price vs. amount of content. This game is incredible, but as I said on the list reveal, £70 for 15 hours of content is pretty difficult to argue in my opinion. I appreciate quality > quantity, and that there is a lot of next-gen stuff going on, but I don’t think its enough to warrant that sort of return for the price, and its pretty ridiculous in AAA terms. Over-paying for an amazing indie is one thing, where a small team with limited resources have had to grind away, but AAA studios don’t need that sort of premium cash return with industry standard already at £60, and I hate Sony’s approach in this regard. Even as a trophy hunter, 100% completion requirements or hard difficulty trophies wouldn’t fix this as an issue.

 

I don't think games need to reach the length of The Witcher 3: Wild Hunt or Assassin's Creed Valhalla where you can easily spend hundreds of hours on them. But.... they definitely need to take into consideration how much people are willing to spend for the content the games offer.

 

For most of you this is probably a long time ago, but I remember vividly the outrage when The Order 1886 was priced at $59.99. Now given that I'm in the United States, people in Canada and elsewhere had to pay more money. A three - four hour experience at full price was not worth it. I actually spent around $15 for the game around six months after the game came out.

 

In contrast, Ratchet & Clank 2016 at $39.99 was fair, because I bought it the week it released.

 

If anybody has doubts I suggest people just rent Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart if they just want the trophies and not aim for the in-game 100 percent. PS Now is another option, I don't use the service but I wouldn't doubt that Rift Apart will be featured on there if it's not on already.

 

My main issue is the fact that I now have to pay $69.99 for new PS5 games. Pretty much every retail store in my general area as well as the websites I normally visit all list the PS5 as being sold out. For the PS5 consoles out there I can actually buy, I have to pay around $1000 for one.

 

So as much as I am a fan of Ratchet & Clank, this game will just have to wait.

[XXIIlII]

I'm disappointed that there is no trophy for upgrading all weapons to max level or for beating challenge mode. I upgraded all the weapons to max on my playthrough thinking there was a trophy for it lol, I did the same for all the previous games.

Edited June 24, 2021 by XXIIlII

[ArtMontef]

20 hours ago, offdutysuperhero said:

And the fact you can skip all glitch and clanks mini games.. not like they were hard to begin with, its just sad.

That is actually godsend. I legit had to turn off the console and just keep my eyes closed to ease motion sickness headache after my first go at glitch minigame. It's so disorienting and vomit inducing that I applaud them for allowing to skip this. I wouldn't be able to finish the game otherwise

[AJ_Radio]

On 6/23/2021 at 0:19 AM, DrBloodmoney said:

Anyone who has "supported the series for decades" knows the series has never been about challenge - asking for it to be now is asinine - and hypocritical if the person doing the complaining has skipped the very games released on the same system, in the same time-frame, that do offer the challenge they crave.

 

I don't recall any Ratchet & Clank game that was actually challenging. Going back to the PS2 generation, the Ratchet & Clank trilogy was still fairly easy compared to many other games of their time.

 

If by 'challenge' we're talking about actually collecting all the gold bolts and doing Challenge Mode for the platinum, that barely qualifies as such at all. Even Spider-Man: Miles Morales has you doing New Game Plus on top of doing all the collectibles, and from what I've heard it still only takes around 15 - 20 hours.

 

The trophy lists in general are definitely getting more dumbed down and simplified.

 

On 6/23/2021 at 0:24 AM, Arcesius said:

Also, I find it quite sad that a proper analysis (by Sony's analysts, apparently) shows evidence that trophy hunters stay away from hard games. 

 

It's far easier to play games with a high completion percentage average amongst trophy hunters and finish them than it is to challenge yourself. Hard games doesn't mean they are bad, but the amount of easy stacks as well as just autopopping trophies by just transferring saves from PS4 to PS5 is just downright pathetic.

 

On 6/23/2021 at 5:11 AM, Deadly_Ha_Ha said:

I appreciate that, and the feeling is mutual. I would just say that you keep talking about challenge; a challenging list, a challenging game. I'm just pointing out that in the beginning of this thread you and I were on the same page about what this really comes down to, and I'm not sure where along the way it kind of got reduced to "difficulty" as much. 

 

But all in all my personal argument as to why this single game's deviation toward the unfulfilling side of trophy hunting is bad for the hobby is because it is in line with a negative trend. More shallow lists, more easy games, ps5 autopops. These are bad for the hobby, that's just my opinion, I can't see it any other way. This R&C game for all the reasons mostly pointed out on the front page and then reiterated for the rest of the thread, is almost more of a trendsetter than anything because of its popularity. But challenge, difficulty, these are things that I really think are not the point here

 

This just goes back to the argument that trophies are essentially participation awards. I'm not asking every other game to be hard as nails, grindy games that take 50 to 100 hours to finish. There has to be a balance. There are plenty of hard games out there, but the trophy hunting community has for the most part gone for overly easy games that take less than 20 - 30 minutes. It's quite easy to get the platinum in Ratchet & Clank: Rift Apart in under 10 hours, which is part of a trend that has already started.

[Snake_1302]

I haven't played the new Ratchet and Clank yet (don't even own a PS5 still), but I have finished 1-3 and Deadlocked. The series as I've experienced so far has never been about difficulty, in fact, a large majority of games that have been remade or ported over from the PS2 and earlier aren't challenging at all with their trophy list. Games like the Sly Trilogy, Destroy All Humans 1, 2 and the remake, the Midievil remake, Spyro Trilogy, etc. But at least all of those games required you to experience most or all of what those games have to offer. Having a trophy list that doesn't even constitute covering a majority of content within a game seems incredibly lazy, which I feel goes against the entire concept of trophies in the first place. You should have to at least put in a little effort to get a platinum and not just stumble into one.

 

I'm not looking down on easy platinums, by the way. I like to unwind with an easy trophy list or two in between finishing a time consuming or difficult list, but I think there's a difference between an easy platinum that requires 100% (or close to 100%) completion, and an easy platinum that you can blow through while skipping large portions of the game.

[Infected Elite]

i stand by it, 90$, dont care. wasnt expensive for me. i got my enjoyment out of it. Sure the trophies could have had more variety, but for once i was able to just play a game at my own pace and fucking enjoy it. Was it the longest? hell no. But even if they added collecting all bolts, that isnt very many.

As i said before somewhere,  other than a lack of arena battles and optional areas, its pretty easy. I think if anything, this is more of a "look what we can do now, wait till you see whats next" type of deal.

 

If you dont wanna pay full price then go rent the fucking game. 

 

as for a trend of games having easy plats and there needing to be balance... there already is, you have easy plats under 20hr. and harder plats that take dedication. Play one of those instead. i got my money worth considering i have 1 to 2 new releases purchased from June to mid October. So if i can beat a game quick, cool. If not, then depends what else comes out.

 

Ratchet was fun, hopefully

Rivet and Kit

stay tho.

[fbdbh]

I started the game on hard, cranked up to hardest at one point, took my time to collect (almost) everything, and still, it took only a light weekend. Not very bothered by it, but I really hope they add DLC trophies, expand the arena (found it very lacking in variety), demand at least a no cheat challenge mode playthrough.

 

On 25/06/2021 at 5:01 AM, Infected Elite said:

i stand by it, 90$, dont care. wasnt expensive for me.

 

If you dont wanna pay full price then go rent the fucking game. 

 

 

Oh, the privilege on display… you know, renting isn’t an option here, and $90 is 1/3 of the minimum, 1/4 of the average salary in most Central European countries.

Edited June 26, 2021 by fbdbh

[Infected Elite]

41 minutes ago, fbdbh said:

 

Oh, the privilege on display… you know, renting isn’t an option here, and $90 is 1/3 of the minimum, 1/4 of the average salary in most Central European countries.

 

then sucks for you? i wasn't referring to euro prices. i was referring to CDN.

[SolidJD]

Trophy list is fine ?