Why isn’t auto popping trophies classed as cheating?

[MonaSaxPayne]

its too late to implement now

 

but I've always felt as tho regional trophy lists and save files shouldn't be a thing 

 

xbox actually does it right for the most part.. u buy a game.. there's only 1 achievement list... a better version comes out.. ur system automatically upgrades u (for free) and your save transfers over and u can just continue playing where u left off on the optimal version

 

no autopops. no multiple stacks of the same game. just 1 list 

[BrettyBoy]

Game developers intentionally allow it, so.

[The Alchemist]

4 minutes ago, MonaSaxPayne said:

its too late to implement now

 

but I've always felt as tho regional trophy lists and save files shouldn't be a thing 

 

xbox actually does it right for the most part.. u buy a game.. there's only 1 achievement list... a better version comes out.. ur system automatically upgrades u (for free) and your save transfers over and u can just continue playing where u left off on the optimal version

 

no autopops. no multiple stacks of the same game. just 1 list 

 

Smart Delivery is technically better, and I'm sure most non-trophy hunting gamers would prefer a similar setup on PlayStation, but us trophy hunters benefit from the way Sony does it as we get stacks, which I honestly prefer over the more optimal Xbox approach, because it gives me the option to play a game I enjoyed again for more trophies. 

 

However, I agree with your point about regional lists. I don't mind platform stacks for the same game so much, but regional stacks simply shouldn't be a thing. 

[MonaSaxPayne]

2 minutes ago, The Alchemist said:

because it gives me the option to play a game I enjoyed again for more trophies. 

 

but technically u aren't replaying it if the list auto pops tho lol

[The Alchemist]

1 minute ago, MonaSaxPayne said:

but technically u aren't replaying it if the list auto pops tho lol

 

I wasn't talking about auto-pops, I was talking about stacks in general. I don't typically do auto-pops as I will always play the PS5 version of games first, unless it's a case of the PS5 version releasing a year or two later. Depending on the game and how much I enjoyed it I might auto-pop in that instance. I did that with A Plague Tale and the Legacy of Thieves collection, but it isn't something I typically do. 

[TheRagingSemi]

It would be cheating if this is a contest. It's not a contest

[AngelaNeko_]

56 minutes ago, Mori said:

 

Waste another 65+ hours? Look before I buy a game, I make sure to know what I get myself into. 

 

I wouldnt buy a slightly better running version of a game if I have already played a prior version. There might be very very rare instances I wouldnt mind like TLoU Remake for PS5 but without the auto-pop. 

 

But people buying full priced games (or even at a lower price) just to auto-pop and then never touch the game again.. I can understand boosting the numbers up but its such a waste of money.

 

On top of that, it "ruins" rarities for PS5 stacks for all kind of games. Sure people usually dont care about that but I do and it sucks. Same goes for people who would like to go for fastest achiever/first plat achiever etc. (Without auto popping).

It might be waste of money but whats the point here? Youre not the one wasting money. And the devs will get more money thanks to people that are willing to buy the game twice. So really whats your point? Also being mad that game doesnt have rare or ultra rare platinum/trophies because of auto-pop like whats the point, in the end all the trophies are useless no matter the rarity. I get the thing about the fastest/first achiever but I dont understand being upset because of the rarity.

[virianna]

2 hours ago, AngelaNeko_ said:

It might be waste of money but whats the point here? Youre not the one wasting money.

isn’t majority of games that have auto pop usually free update to ps5 or low price provided you have a ps4 version bought already? most of the people don’t even waste money 

[Mori]

3 hours ago, AngelaNeko_ said:

It might be waste of money but whats the point here? Youre not the one wasting money. And the devs will get more money thanks to people that are willing to buy the game twice. So really whats your point? Also being mad that game doesnt have rare or ultra rare platinum/trophies because of auto-pop like whats the point, in the end all the trophies are useless no matter the rarity. I get the thing about the fastest/first achiever but I dont understand being upset because of the rarity.

 

Why auto-pop then? ?

 

My point? That auto-pops are stupid and serve no purpose other than increasing your numbers with zero effort.

Edited September 4, 2022 by Mori

[Ashande]

Something I haven't seen addressed in the thread is also the potential issue of false-flagging if autopops weren't a thing. Specifically in situations where someone bought a PS4 game, got a little way into the game, then upgraded to the PS5 version (for whatever reason) and continued from there.

 

With autopop, their timestamps and achievement orders will be fine. They'll have "Beat Chapter 1" before "Beat Chapter 10," they'll have "Kill 100," "Kill 500," "Kill 1,000" in the proper order and so on. WIthout autopop they get to either start the game over from scratch (which with some games - Nioh or Yakuza: Like a Dragon come to mind - may be an immense undertaking), have only trophies from the second half of the game, or have the trophies from the second half popped potentially days, weeks or months before the first half. People issuing flags are unlikely to delve deep into the trophy list to hunt down confirmation that the user had previously done those "first half" trophies on a different version. CRT is likely already being overworked dredging through the flags and disputes as it is. Increasing the workload (and providing more opportunities/openings for potentially malicious flaggers) doesn't seem like a great idea to me.

 

But that's just my 2 cents.

[audiopile]

I already finished the game and did all the requirements. If Sony says I get the trophies again just by reloading on a different console then I guess that it how its meant to be.  
 

My opinion is that people focus way too much on leaderboards when doing something that is largely considered to be a hobby.  I got some hard truth for y’all: no one cares about your trophies except you and a few others that think getting a trophy somehow makes you a special person.  It doesnt. 
 

Lock this necrotrash.  

[Ashande]

1 minute ago, audiopile said:

I already finished the game and did all the requirements. If Sony says I get the trophies again just by reloading on a different console then I guess that it how its meant to be.  
 

My opinion is that people focus way too much on leaderboards when doing something that is largely considered to be a hobby.  I got some hard truth for y’all: no one cares about your trophies except you and a few others that think getting a trophy somehow makes you a special person.  It doesnt. 
 

Lock this necrotrash.  

 

There's no need to be hostile. Different types of accomplishment matter to different types of people. Deeming a subject "necrotrash" and demanding it be locked feels slightly authoritarian, especially when there seems to be no reason for the demand other than "I don't like it."

[audiopile]

4 minutes ago, Ashande said:

 

There's no need to be hostile. Different types of accomplishment matter to different types of people. Deeming a subject "necrotrash" and demanding it be locked feels slightly authoritarian, especially when there seems to be no reason for the demand other than "I don't like it."

Hostile?  I can do that if you want, so you know what it actually means.    

 

Why revive a topic like this?  Its pointless, rhetorical, and frankly trolly in nature. 

 

Provide your useless opinion like I did and focus on the topic, not me and my poor attitude.

[Ashande]

2 minutes ago, audiopile said:

Hostile?  I can do that if you want, so you know what it actually means.    

 

Why revive a topic like this?  Its pointless, rhetorical, and frankly trolly in nature. 

 

Provide your useless opinion like I did and focus on the topic, not me and my poor attitude.

 

 

By all means, bathe me in your hostility so I can learn my lesson. Regardless of where you consider the threshold to be for something to be legitimately referred to as "actual hostility," your word choices and demands imply a certain level of aggression that feels unnecessary. Actionable? Probably not. But there's a definite tone there. (Which is ironic, given your tagline of "Let's try to help each other.")

 

The topic being pointless or rhetorical is rather subjective; some folks here do seem to believe there is a point to be made, and that there is an answer to be found (or at least a discussion to be had surrounding it), which means the post has a point and is not rhetorical. So far as trolly, almost anything is going to attract trolls of one flavor or another, but there are plenty of posts here that raise excellent points, have genuine concerns, or are providing information or perspectives that may not have occurred to others. On the other hand, there are posts that are nothing but troll bait or random hostility. Yours included.

 

If you consider an opinion - mine, yours, or anyone else's - useless, so be it; that's your prerogative. But if you feel your own opinion is useless, why post it at all? Especially when you follow up with "stay on topic," when your own post was just irritation, belittling, and a demand for closure, itself off-topic.

 

[AngelaNeko_]

4 hours ago, Mori said:

 

Why auto-pop then? 

 

My point? That auto-pops are stupid and serve no purpose other than increasing your numbers with zero effort.

Well you can say the same thing about all the shovelware that's on ps store. Just a way to increase your numbers with zero effort. I honestly don't care at all, if you hate it then that's fine. I just thought your first comment was kinda "stupid" and wanted to share my opinion on it. 

Edited September 5, 2022 by AngelaNeko_

[Jelly Soup]

9 hours ago, TheRagingSemi said:

It would be cheating if this is a contest. It's not a contest

 

For want of a more specific term, you're mostly correct. Playing leaderboards has always been a contest of sorts, with the only prize being community clout. But it's not a contest for the same reasons. Dismissing possible gaming of the system isn't a great way to run a railroad in either case, but we're too far along at this point to put this particular genie back in it's metaphorical bottle.

[zXShermanXz]

People ultimately hunt for trophies for different reasons. Some want the acclaim of large numbers. Some want the acclaim of super hard feats. At the end of the day the only thing that really matters is why YOU do it. I get nothing extra if I make it to the top of the leaderboards. No one here will care about my profile if I only have ultra rares. So why care? Because I do it for myself. 

 

When I made up my mind to become a trophy hunter, i made a list of rules for myself. No secondary profile to "test" games out, no auto pops, no hidden trophies, no repeats, no games I honestly wasnt interested in, and no "ducks" (my term for super quick and easy plats like I am mayo.) Does anyone care or respect me more? No, because this is the internet dude. 

[EverythingOnFire]

11 hours ago, TheRagingSemi said:

It would be cheating if this is a contest. It's not a contest

If it weren't a contest, there wouldn't be scores and a leaderboard. We've even got Guinness World Records giving certificates/awards to trophy hunters.

 

I want to clarify that I don't think auto-popping is cheating, because the ability to auto-pop is right there for everyone, with no deception involved. But yeah, this is absolutely one big contest. It's just that the majority of the contestants don't care.

[AJ_Radio]

7 hours ago, Ashande said:

By all means, bathe me in your hostility so I can learn my lesson. Regardless of where you consider the threshold to be for something to be legitimately referred to as "actual hostility," your word choices and demands imply a certain level of aggression that feels unnecessary. Actionable? Probably not. But there's a definite tone there. (Which is ironic, given your tagline of "Let's try to help each other.")

 

The topic being pointless or rhetorical is rather subjective; some folks here do seem to believe there is a point to be made, and that there is an answer to be found (or at least a discussion to be had surrounding it), which means the post has a point and is not rhetorical. So far as trolly, almost anything is going to attract trolls of one flavor or another, but there are plenty of posts here that raise excellent points, have genuine concerns, or are providing information or perspectives that may not have occurred to others. On the other hand, there are posts that are nothing but troll bait or random hostility. Yours included.

 

If you consider an opinion - mine, yours, or anyone else's - useless, so be it; that's your prerogative. But if you feel your own opinion is useless, why post it at all? Especially when you follow up with "stay on topic," when your own post was just irritation, belittling, and a demand for closure, itself off-topic.

 

The best thing is to ignore these people. They're not going to bother hearing alternate opinions, and this is something I see far too often nowadays what with smartphone internet access and instantaneous webpage loading.

 

It's a good reason why I've become more anti-social these past couple years, and I usually try to avoid people in general.

 

41 minutes ago, EverythingOnFire said:

If it weren't a contest, there wouldn't be scores and a leaderboard. We've even got Guinness World Records giving certificates/awards to trophy hunters.

 

I want to clarify that I don't think auto-popping is cheating, because the ability to auto-pop is right there for everyone, with no deception involved. But yeah, this is absolutely one big contest. It's just that the majority of the contestants don't care.

 

It's a fruitless contest in my opinion. Even Hakoom has finally slowed down and I can't blame him. These easy games we've been getting are all the same pretty much. No variety at all.

[running_Amok_86]

Personally I wish autopopping wasn't a thing.  I wouldn't say it's cheating, but I would be more inclined to buy a good remake/upgrade if I was able to go for the trophies again.  Maybe this is possible if I delete my previous save files?  Even if it is, I wouldn't want to do this and lose all progress in the previous version.  So it kinda sucks in my opinion.  I also agree with the people saying it messes up the stats.  The fastest plat stat on anyone's profile who autopops is basically pointless at this point.

[AngelaNeko_]

I feel like the best way to solve this leaderboard "problem" (that's mentioned a lot here) would be if the PSNP mods created new section on the leaderboards that would seperate the auto-pop times from the legit ones. Maybe like do it that if its less than 1 or 2 seconds it would automaticaly go to the auto-pop section or something like that. 

[brunorossin]

18 hours ago, Master_Mayhem_ said:

Believe it. If you are the fastest achiever of a platinum trophy then 200 people auto pop in 3 seconds you would be pretty annoyed. Also trophies that should be ultra rare, very rare then become uncommon and common. What do you find hard to believe?

What I meant, is that I realy don't care if someone used auto pop finished a game faster than I.

[Mori]

8 hours ago, AngelaNeko_ said:

Well you can say the same thing about all the shovelware that's on ps store. Just a way to increase your numbers with zero effort. I honestly don't care at all, if you hate it then that's fine. I just thought your first comment was kinda "stupid" and wanted to share my opinion on it. 

 

Great, then we can finally drop this conversation.

[Gommes_]

21 hours ago, MonaSaxPayne said:

 

minding one's business isn't trendy

 

 

 

And it also doesn't apply to this case. Trophies are an online thing within an online community. People show off their profile cards in their signature, have ranks in the leaderboard and compare themselves to others. So it is totally okay to raise certain questions. Especially if it is something relatively new. Shovelware and autopping just change the "value" of trophies.

[MonaSaxPayne]

5 hours ago, AJ_Radio said:

 

The best thing is to ignore these people. They're not going to bother hearing alternate opinions, and this is something I see far too often nowadays what with smartphone internet access and instantaneous webpage loading.

 

It's a good reason why I've become more anti-social these past couple years, and I usually try to avoid people in general.

 

you're anti social cuz u have a bad attitude. which may or may not have anything to do with ur autism. has nothing to do with iPhones or how fast the internet is

 

u also don't like hearing alternate opinions. far too often when someone disagrees with u, I see u post something along the lines of "your opinion is shit, I'm not bothering to respond to u anymore"