PS5 Pro leaked specs (corroborated and confirmed by Tom Henderson)

[pavelbagirov]

On 3/16/2024 at 3:10 AM, ARIXANDRE said:

We haven't gotten a single game that uses the full power of the PS5.

 

Insomniac is doing great work but I wanted to see Naughty Dog make boundary pushing game for PS5. 

 

This generation feels off, much like the PS3. Great games, sure, but held back on a technical level. 

Naughty Dog probably will make game for PS5 in 3-4 years from now

[OmegaRejectz]

On 3/15/2024 at 5:53 PM, Fing3rButt3r3 said:

PS6 is probably going to be a long ways to go. This next generation may be different. I read somewhere Sony doesn't make a whole lot with a complete new hardware console sale. Better to just reused old tech but overclock it.

Consoles hardware has never been for making money.

 

Microsoft’s never turned a profit on their consoles.

 

Sony has, but it’s always been as a way to convert people to software sales.

 

Nintendo probably does, but even then it’s also so they can have people buying their $60+ software.

 

 

[Eraezr]

12 hours ago, Jinkelz said:

Also, AI (machine learning) to upscale? I dont want to see 6 finger characters because they wont get the algorithm working as a sideeffect...

Or low quality because of movement, like it is with those cloud streaming games.

Nothing beats pure detail by detail.

 

Machine learning upscale doesn't work that way with real time rendering, compared to generative art. Digital Foundry actually did a video test on this with Death Stranding and they found that D.S's natively rendered 4K looked lower quality than Nvidia DLSS (a machine learning upscaler) version of 4K.

[Jinkelz]

9 hours ago, Eraezr said:

natively rendered 4K looked lower quality than Nvidia DLSS

As I read that it doesnt look DS has a native 4k, but a form of inherent upscaling by checkerboard combination.

Also des DS not have any form of Anti Aliasing, that game really looked poor in the video attached to the specific article. 

 

Not saying it cant absolutely be better, but DS seemed to be a very good game to pick to just be pro DLSS

Whereas this tells a more diverse story, but a more "native ortiented" result, with an almost tie on 4k quality, but a very large lead in 4k performance.

 

In the end what I care about is the higher FPS and no flickering.

If either can deliver, I take it no questioning, it wouldnt need to be marketed as "generated by the means of".

Just I am very sceptical when it comes to a generalization of "it will always be better", and simply implementing a machine learning reliant picture quality improving process into a device to me is the same as just upping the power: it removes the need from the developer to do proper optimization which leads to lower quality games.

Edited March 19 by Jinkelz

[poker_1987]

Finally. Hope they stop doing base ps5 games.

 

Ps5 has been showing its age the last year or so.

[Rozalia1]

Didn't bite on the PS4 Pro, but this PS5 Pro does seem very interesting. Their PSSR upscaling solution is apparently really good according to people who have tested it.

Surprised it took this long for the leaks to come out considering how Sony was reportedly expecting leaks to come out in December.

 

On 3/18/2024 at 11:09 AM, Danyy___85 said:

This console is made for elitists in a way. The PS5 now is showing to have problems in some games. Dragons Dogma 2, it has unlocked frame rate and is always around 30 fps and many times lower than that as reports say... FF 7 Rebirth the performance mode is god awfull in visuals that i play the 30fps mode becuase it just looks way more amazing. 

 

The new rise of ronin can't do 60fps in performance mode. FF16 performance mode is 720p and sometimes lower... Plague games also don't reach 60fps and struggle a lot to even maintain 30fps. Dead Space remake, Alan Wake 2 and Elden Ring... I can keep going on games that have performance issues and low resolutions, not even go about Ray Tracing.

Also Unreal Engine 5... Not gonna go about details on how PS5 can't hold a fully developted game on this engine, it would go to the PS4 OG standart. 1080p 30fps. 

 

This year there was only one game that got perfect 60fps and 4k on PS5 and that was Persona 3 Reload. (Talking about the "big" releases not indies). 

 

But even still the PS5 is a great console, and i don't see many people going for the PRO model. It just serves to those who really want 60fps all the time and the 4k resolution, the improvement for many does not serve the cost. These sources are booting PS5 PRO model to be 600 Dollars (Digital version), but i think the price will be around 700-800 to be honest. Due to inflation and also the costs of building said console are high. Nowadays chips don't drop in price as much for companies who build them. The PS5 is still selling without profit for SONY 4 years later... Most revenue comes from software sales. 

 

Digital Foundry (who love playing defence for Xbox) and Team Green are putting that stuff out there, so just know where that is coming from. The amount of games that are restricted to 30 frames is minimal, on a single hand minimal. There isn't a CPU issue (of course more is always better) as they love pushing, due to the fact that even before we knew the specs it was known that the CPU could only ever be minorly upgraded on the PS5 Pro. The issue is the poor quality in performance modes which the boosts in the PS5 Pro will address. Resolution will not only be increased, but they'll be able to be upscaled from a lower base resolution which has major benefits.

 

1/5 went for the Pro version of the PS4, and something that often gets forgotten in that is that counts all the PS4s that released before the Pro did, so the 1/5 is actually bigger if you take that out. For all the people who start to find the image quality or performance lacking, or simply want better in a Console platform, will now have it in the Pro. The PS6 is going to be 4 years away (the 2 years thing is Xbox rumours), so still a good amount of time to have an enhanced Console.

 

You're incorrect. It is well known that the PS5 quickly started selling for a profit as PlayStation is constantly working to reduce the cost of production for them, unlike Xbox for whatever reason (incompetence most likely). Now you might say that surely wouldn't be the case once you factor in discounts? Sure, if not for the fact that the PS5 actually got a price rise in the past, so 'discounts' don't exactly cut into their margins as much as they would normally. Though admittedly, the Pro is going to be a tricky bit of business. Putting it 100 bucks more expensive than the PS5 is the conventional way of doing things, but it might then be priced too high... except if you reduce the base price of the PS5, but then that is going to eat into the PS5 hardware profits. On top of that many PS5 Pro buyers will likely trade in/sell their PS5s, which will then reduce the price of PS5s in the used market. Is the lowered profits on hardware worth an increase on software and having more people on PlayStation (who are then likely to continue being on PlayStation for PS6)? In the past the answer has always been yes, it is worth it.

[EDGES]

On 3/19/2024 at 8:54 AM, Jinkelz said:

As I read that it doesnt look DS has a native 4k, but a form of inherent upscaling by checkerboard combination.

Also des DS not have any form of Anti Aliasing, that game really looked poor in the video attached to the specific article. 

 

Not saying it cant absolutely be better, but DS seemed to be a very good game to pick to just be pro DLSS

Whereas this tells a more diverse story, but a more "native ortiented" result, with an almost tie on 4k quality, but a very large lead in 4k performance.

 

In the end what I care about is the higher FPS and no flickering.

If either can deliver, I take it no questioning, it wouldnt need to be marketed as "generated by the means of".

Just I am very sceptical when it comes to a generalization of "it will always be better", and simply implementing a machine learning reliant picture quality improving process into a device to me is the same as just upping the power: it removes the need from the developer to do proper optimization which leads to lower quality games.

 

DLSS and other alternative resolution rendering methods don't look better than native, the reason people say they do is because they are comparing DLSS+lower res vs native res+TAA, and DLSS looks way better than anything+TAA, TAA is the problem here, but in theory DLSS could be used together with native res and generate the best look possible by being the ultimate AA method

 

Death Stranding is 4k checkerboard on PS4Pro, it is native 4K on PS5, and in some places, Death Stranding looks better with DLSS than 4K native with TAA on PC, but it also looks worse in some places, it's a trade, it lacks the bad parts of having TAA but it lacks the stablity of natively rendered motion

[stpatty]

On 3/16/2024 at 2:27 AM, Eraezr said:

It appears that Sony liked PS4 Pro's sales enough that they are doing this.

My situation doesn't necessarily apply to everyone, but I got my PS4 Pro in 2017. I didn't start using it as my main console until a year later. I didn't have any reason to make the jump from PS3 to PS4 until then. Right now I'm in the same situation with PS5, although the price is even more off-putting than it was then and I suppose backwards compatibility makes it less of a binary choice between two generations. 

 

I don't know how many people who would be likely to have a PS5 but don't would be swayed by this, but it might be a possibility.

Edited March 21 by stpatty

[MonaSaxPayne]

When is this supposed to be released?

[BloodyRutz]

On 3/15/2024 at 11:53 PM, yowzagabowza said:

The 5Pro will somehow eclipse the 4Pro as being the most useless console ever. 

 

What? The console can't come soon enough. I've already postponed two games because they were basically unplayable on PS5 - FF XVI, FF VII Rebirth, and now Dragon's Dogma 2 seems to be the latest case. I am aware I'm in the minority, but I would welcome them to make a really powerful console and charge twice the money for it.

 

 

On 3/18/2024 at 12:09 PM, Danyy___85 said:

This console is made for elitists in a way. The PS5 now is showing to have problems in some games. Dragons Dogma 2, it has unlocked frame rate and is always around 30 fps and many times lower than that as reports say... FF 7 Rebirth the performance mode is god awfull in visuals that i play the 30fps mode becuase it just looks way more amazing. 

 

The new rise of ronin can't do 60fps in performance mode. FF16 performance mode is 720p and sometimes lower... Plague games also don't reach 60fps and struggle a lot to even maintain 30fps. Dead Space remake, Alan Wake 2 and Elden Ring... I can keep going on games that have performance issues and low resolutions, not even go about Ray Tracing.

Also Unreal Engine 5... Not gonna go about details on how PS5 can't hold a fully developted game on this engine, it would go to the PS4 OG standart. 1080p 30fps. 

 

This year there was only one game that got perfect 60fps and 4k on PS5 and that was Persona 3 Reload. (Talking about the "big" releases not indies). 

 

But even still the PS5 is a great console, and i don't see many people going for the PRO model. It just serves to those who really want 60fps all the time and the 4k resolution, the improvement for many does not serve the cost. These sources are booting PS5 PRO model to be 600 Dollars (Digital version), but i think the price will be around 700-800 to be honest. Due to inflation and also the costs of building said console are high. Nowadays chips don't drop in price as much for companies who build them. The PS5 is still selling without profit for SONY 4 years later... Most revenue comes from software sales. 

 

This.

 

Edited March 21 by BloodyRutz

[yowzagabowza]

Just now, BloodyRutz said:

-snip-

I just can't take people seriously who say games are "unplayable" because of infrequent frame drops. Not one of the three games you mentioned are "unplayable", come on.

[BloodyRutz]

14 minutes ago, yowzagabowza said:

I just can't take people seriously who say games are "unplayable" because of infrequent frame drops. Not one of the three games you mentioned are "unplayable", come on.

 

You need to consider that not everyone has an OLED TV where these problems are really obvious. In FF VII Rebirth's Performance mode, things look blurry (though today's update helped with that a bit). When I switch to the Quality mode, I get bad headaches and can't play for more than an hour. This mostly affects OLED TVs because of how they work—the game gets jerky when I move the camera because OLED pixels refresh much faster than LCD ones. Adding motion blur would help with this.

 

So, whether you take me seriously or not, for me, the game is impossible to play. Just because you have an older screen or aren't as sensitive to this stuff doesn't mean everyone's that lucky.

 

Edited March 21 by BloodyRutz

[Dreakon13]

22 minutes ago, BloodyRutz said:

 

You need to consider that not everyone has an OLED TV where these problems are really obvious. In FF VII Rebirth's Performance mode, things look blurry (though today's update helped with that a bit). When I switch to the Quality mode, I get bad headaches and can't play for more than an hour. This mostly affects OLED TVs because of how they work—the game gets jerky when I move the camera because OLED pixels refresh much faster than LCD ones. Adding motion blur would help with this.

 

So, whether you take me seriously or not, for me, the game is impossible to play. Just because you have an older screen or aren't as sensitive to this stuff doesn't mean everyone's that lucky.

 

 

Maybe invest in a TV that isn't slowly killing you lol

 

I think framerate issues will always be a factor simply because games will never be perfect.  There will always be different development studios with different technical abilities and different ambitions pushing themselves or pushing technology.  It's completely out of your or Sony's control, hardware isn't boundless.  Control the things you can

Edited March 21 by Dreakon13

[BloodyRutz]

22 minutes ago, Dreakon13 said:

Maybe invest in a TV that isn't slowly killing you lol

 

That's a 3k TV, you won't get much better than that. Say, I would play the game on PS Portal or an old LCD TV, for example, these issues wouldn't be noticeable. That's the irony. My point was, that I would rather invest in a console that can run the game in Quality mode with 60 fps.

 

22 minutes ago, Dreakon13 said:

I think framerate issues will always be a factor simply because games will never be perfect.  There will always be different development studios with different technical abilities and different ambitions pushing themselves or pushing technology.

 

I fully understand this, and I have no issues with that whatsoever. It's a software development in the end. However, it is clear that the performance is starting to be insufficient, so saying that the PS5 Pro will come down in history as the most useless console ever is a wild take.

 

Edited March 21 by BloodyRutz

[Rozalia1]

1 hour ago, MonaSaxPayne said:

When is this supposed to be released?

 

 

2024 holiday period as far as I know, so late 2024.

 

31 minutes ago, Dreakon13 said:

Maybe invest in a TV that isn't slowly killing you lol

 

I think framerate issues will always be a factor simply because games will never be perfect.  There will always be different development studios with different technical abilities and different ambitions pushing themselves or pushing technology.  It's completely out of your or Sony's control, hardware isn't boundless.  Control the things you can

 

@BloodyRutz is correct on 30 frames being an issue on OLEDs. I personally never had an issue with 30 frames until I got an OLED, which due to how it operates performs terribly at 30 frames. Thankfully the vast majority of PS4 games at 30 frames get boosted to 60 on the PS5, but it does mean that Quality modes at 30 frames are a no go, and the handful of games on PS5 locked to 30 frames are making a massive misstep in performing terribly for anyone with an OLED, which is a larger and larger group of people.

[MonaSaxPayne]

17 minutes ago, Rozalia1 said:

 

 

2024 holiday period as far as I know, so late 2024.

 

 

@BloodyRutz is correct on 30 frames being an issue on OLEDs. I personally never had an issue with 30 frames until I got an OLED, which due to how it operates performs terribly at 30 frames. Thankfully the vast majority of PS4 games at 30 frames get boosted to 60 on the PS5, but it does mean that Quality modes at 30 frames are a no go, and the handful of games on PS5 locked to 30 frames are making a massive misstep in performing terribly for anyone with an OLED, which is a larger and larger group of people.

Doesn’t your oled tv have VRR?

[BloodyRutz]

13 minutes ago, MonaSaxPayne said:

Doesn’t your oled tv have VRR?

 

VRR requires 48 FPS to work properly; it's useless for games running at 30 FPS or lower. Once the framerate dips below 40 FPS, it's game over. All VRR does is match the refresh rate of your screen to that of your game's frame rate. Considering the minimum refresh rate for OLED is 120Hz, you can do the math.

 

Edited March 21 by BloodyRutz

[MonaSaxPayne]

3 minutes ago, BloodyRutz said:

 

VRR requires 48 FPS to work properly. VRR is useless for 30fps/sub-30fps games. Once the framerate dips until 40fps, it's over.

 

ahhh. I did not know this

 

just checked the specs on my LG C2 and works between 40-120 fps 

[BloodyRutz]

5 minutes ago, MonaSaxPayne said:

ahhh. I did not know this

 

just checked the specs on my LG C2 and works between 40-120 fps 

 

Yep.

 

19 minutes ago, RufianRivas said:

I'll cop multiple. 

 

Why, though?

 

Edited March 21 by BloodyRutz

[Hitman_Spinksy1]

I am wondering if with Xbox being technically out of the console war now, if that will delay the PS6 or give the PS6 a longer life when it comes as the need to make consoles to compete will be gone. 

 

It already feels like the need is less than when the PS4 came out. The difference between PS4 and PS3 was much greater than PS4 and PS5, especially with PS4 games still being made, cross gen etc. 

[Eraezr]

4 hours ago, Hitman_Spinksy1 said:

I am wondering if with Xbox being technically out of the console war now, if that will delay the PS6 or give the PS6 a longer life when it comes as the need to make consoles to compete will be gone. 

 

It already feels like the need is less than when the PS4 came out. The difference between PS4 and PS3 was much greater than PS4 and PS5, especially with PS4 games still being made, cross gen etc. 

 

We might have a longer generation this time because of the pandemic. The pressure for the transition jump will be there because PS5's CPU and base RAM will be a long tooth in the future, compared to the strides made with its I.O speed and Pro GPU.

[Dry]

This and the recent slim model not releasing together is a loss in my books.

[RedDevil757]

I've seen reports that the processor is the same. Isn't that the main bottleneck that's stopping higher FPS?

 

If it's the same. Wouldn't a 30fps game still be 30fps on pro?

[freddie1989]

Love these threads where everyone suddenly has expert knowledge. Hardly anything actually exclusive worth playing as of yet and now we are getting a new console so that "experts" can talk FPS 🤣

[RedDevil757]

20 minutes ago, freddie1989 said:

Love these threads where everyone suddenly has expert knowledge. Hardly anything actually exclusive worth playing as of yet and now we are getting a new console so that "experts" can talk FPS 🤣

Yeah it's been a really bad generation. I don't think pro models are the answer