The AEW Discussion Thread

[skidmarkgn]

Punk and Eddie freakin' delivered on Friday!!  Here's to hoping they can carry that kind of quality for an extended program.

[Rozalia1]

The treatment of Adam Cole so far is real amazing stuff to me. A lot of people aren't really reacting much it seems to him getting completely obliterated when were it WWE damn, they'd be whining about it until the day they died. Oh well, clearly the idea is that none of it matters as they intend to straight up get Undisputed Era on AEW... I expect once that happens Vince will punish HHH again for being so stupid in building NXT around them for so long. HHH going to AEW if fired may well be the only thing that is keeping him safe from getting thrown out of there, because HHH in AEW would be big. Sure, old and may not even be able to have a match anymore due to the heart issues, but he is still a big name and him there around all those former NXT guys... you could well do an invasion angle out of it. That all the NXT guys being in AEW was planned by HHH as he knew it was the only way to protect them from Vince. Something like that.

 

AEW's ratings are slipping and seems they're back to the numbers they had when head to head with NXT. In short, they are still unable to create fans which isn't shocking considering the heel dominance they've had. Sure, modern times, but the idea has always been that the heel is there to be a guy people want to see beat, but it is the face who the fans are supposed to be actual fans of, hence, "fan favourite". Though who replaced them in their slot, the hockey, is getting around a quarter of the viewership and terrible numbers also in the so called "key demo". So key that seemingly the network doesn't care that it is terrible. Shows well I think the sheer disrespect that still exists for Professional Wrestling. Granted, AEW has in no helped in that by often having blood on the show and you know, BOOKING NICK GAGE! In the words of Randy Orton, "Stupid! Stupid!"

 

Anyway. We're getting a very big match in Kenny Omega vs Hangman Adam Page, nothing else on the card matters compared to it. If Hangman loses then AEW management needs to get an exorcist in quickly as clearly Tony Khan is possessed by Vince McMahon. Full on misery booking, a surprise for the sake of a surprise, and company ruining stuff. 

I'm unsure if I'm going to watch the Lucha Brothers vs FTR match. On one hand FTR might be winning and they're also the only team that can get anything that isn't dogcrap out of the horrendous Lucha Brothers, they're that good. On the other hand the Lucha Brothers are early in their reign and obviously favoured... then again they took the titles off the Young Bucks so it could be they only did so to transition the titles to FTR as the Young Bucks wouldn't put FTR over for the titles. If FTR wins then I'm certain that happened considering that Young Bucks booked themselves over FTR in a bizarrely booked and terrible feud and then put FTR in witness protection. 

[skidmarkgn]

1 hour ago, Rozalia1 said:

Anyway. We're getting a very big match in Kenny Omega vs Hangman Adam Page, nothing else on the card matters compared to it. If Hangman loses then AEW management needs to get an exorcist in quickly as clearly Tony Khan is possessed by Vince McMahon. Full on misery booking, a surprise for the sake of a surprise, and company ruining stuff.

 

As much as I'm hoping and paying they put Hangman over, if they don't, I'm not sure a surprise for surprise sake would be the entire reason.  Don't get me wrong, I am of the same opinion that Hangman absolutely should win but if he doesn't I suspect a Danielson vs. Omega championship program would be a large part of why.  They can easily build a story without the title between the two, and I'd personally love to see Hangman and Miro feud for the strap (Miro winning the tourney would be a huge rub for him and wouldn't hurt Danielson at all), but Omega vs. Danielson for the belt definitely has a draw.

[Rozalia1]

16 hours ago, skidmarkgn said:

As much as I'm hoping and paying they put Hangman over, if they don't, I'm not sure a surprise for surprise sake would be the entire reason.  Don't get me wrong, I am of the same opinion that Hangman absolutely should win but if he doesn't I suspect a Danielson vs. Omega championship program would be a large part of why.  They can easily build a story without the title between the two, and I'd personally love to see Hangman and Miro feud for the strap (Miro winning the tourney would be a huge rub for him and wouldn't hurt Danielson at all), but Omega vs. Danielson for the belt definitely has a draw.

 

Well yes, a Danielson vs. Omega for the championship would be the justification Tony Khan would have... and it would not matter. AEW, Khan, Omega, and the Bucks by extension will put their names in the mud if they don't strap up Hangman now. I don't like it as they shouldn't have it, but AEW still has a lot of goodwill among their fanbase where even when missteps happen the fanbase will state that "We need to trust AEW. They have earned our trust". All that and more goes completely out of the window if they screw Hangman here, and it will be a screwing, as they'll be damaging his star power.

 

To be clear in case it ain't though, I do not think we have anything to worry about on this as Omega will put Hangman over. The only worry for me, I'm sure you'll disagree which is fine, with Hangman is that AEW won't treat him as the top face and have him have a monopoly on the title for a long time (3 years minimum). Not to say an MJF or Punk can't win the title off Hangman at some point during that of course, but if they do it should only be with heavy cheating and their reigns should only last a month or so.

[Rozalia1]

Jericho seems to have heat for his commentary if Rampage was anything to go by. At one point Excalibur straight up meanly told him to shut up as he was screaming CAKE FACE and making the commentary devolve into complete screeching nonsense. 

 

What was going on during that Orange/Hardy match? Terrible stuff and then for some reason Hardy did a phantom finisher to fool the referee which would be good... but pointless as it has been firmly established in AEW that rules don't matter and refs simply won't disqualify people (unless it is 2 out of 3 falls/Ironman and it doesn't end the match). Then the defence for it all uses some after show promo from Tony Khan himself of all people where they tease that "Chaos" is going to come in so this is all justified because Okada? Matt Hardy is basically Paul Jones... you are telling me that Khan's idea of bringing in Okada, someone who no one casual knows but, obviously is known at least by name by his hardcores... is to have him come in to feud with the modern day Paul Jones Army? What? 

 

Also, apparently, according to Excalibur, who I'm sure made it up on the spot to try and cover it up, in Lumberjack matches the moment you are outside the ring the Lumberjacks can do anything to you with impunity. Every other promotion on earth stresses that they're there to put the guy back in the ring, are allowed some light roughhousing, and anything heavy has to be done while the referee is distracted. Not AEW though. 

 

[Viper]

2 hours ago, Rozalia1 said:

Also, apparently, according to Excalibur, who I'm sure made it up on the spot to try and cover it up, in Lumberjack matches the moment you are outside the ring the Lumberjacks can do anything to you with impunity. Every other promotion on earth stresses that they're there to put the guy back in the ring, are allowed some light roughhousing, and anything heavy has to be done while the referee is distracted. Not AEW though. 

Which is a good thing. Every other promotion stresses that Lumberjacks are there to simply throw you back in the ring...yet that literally NEVER happens, it's always the Heels beating on the Face and vice versa. At least AEW isn't wasting their time trying to act like the match is something it's not. I've never been a big fan of Lumberjack matches though, they always come off more comical than they should be. And I agree Matt Hardy feigning hitting his finisher was strange...I haven't cared at all about this HFO stuff. At this point I'd like Jeff to come to AEW and let the Hardy Boyz have one last run then be on their way. 

 

Hope Full Gear delivers tonight. I'm headed to Florida tonight to spend Thanksgiving with my Dad's side of the family, so I'll be a couple weeks behind on everything when I get back. Try to avoid spoilers as best as I can. 

[skidmarkgn]

3 hours ago, Viper said:

.I haven't cared at all about this HFO stuff. At this point I'd like Jeff to come to AEW and let the Hardy Boyz have one last run then be on their way. 

 

 

I would rather they just skip to the be on their way part personally.  Hardy was great for the first third or so of his AEW run ( around stadium stampede time) but he's fizzled out pretty quick.  Instead of bringing in Jeff and adding another not-necessary worker to the already bloated roster I'd rather Matt go and open some space.  Christian too.

[Rozalia1]

I'm just going to leave this here in this post so I don't befoul a future post with it.

 

I knew it was a mistake to watch that tag team match even though FTR was in it. It was perhaps the best match of Lucha Brothers career, but it was still garbage. I'm JR when I watch these fraudsters, just not getting paid so I can say fully what I think. That ridiculous double spot was something considering Fenix was it? straight up got counted out at 5 and thus should have been DQed... but of course, rules do not matter in AEW, except of course if a "spot" calls for it. I missed it myself as bloody hell, so much going on and perhaps I had my eyes closed at the time out of hatred of what I was seeing, but apparently Penta never got tagged in which would explain why Fenix tried to do a pin too as he was the actual legal man. Part of the angle? They'll make it I'm sure but I doubt it. The finish is supposed to be what causes FTR to call foul. There is no need to have another such instance in the match.  

 

I will not be watching the obvious rematch.

[Rozalia1]

So let me get this straight. Lumberjack matches? Let us change that stuff and allow the lumberjacks to just wildly attack people in the match with no issue. Now a street fight where the idea is to have a wild anything goes match all over the place? Let us start like gentlemen and observe tag rules. Go ahead and defend that too @Viper. 

 

Oh and to respond to your Lumberjack matches are crap so good that AEW is spitting on the match type. Just because a match type has been done badly for a long time doesn't mean that you spit on it. WWE hasn't had good Cage matches in a long time. AEW didn't just spit on the cage match type as a result, so no, they don't get to do it for Lumberjack matches. Just do the match correctly and it'll be good. Do it wrong and it'll be crap, as it was. I'll even give some free advice for them. Have the next half a dozen Lumberjack matches be ones where the face has the advantage so you can rehabilitate the match type as face advantaged Lumberjack matches means no heel nonsense.

[Rozalia1]

Hangman wins the AEW World Championship. Nice, very happy for the Hangman Adam Page. I hope he firmly becomes AEW's top face and reigns at the top for many years to come. Wrestling needs top faces at the top. None of this non-stop heel domination crap or "faces" who function as heels in how they act. 

 

 

 

 

[Infected Elite]

19 minutes ago, Rozalia1 said:

Hangman wins the AEW World Championship. Nice, very happy for the Hangman Adam Page. I hope he firmly becomes AEW's top face and reigns at the top for many years to come. Wrestling needs top faces at the top. None of this non-stop heel domination crap or "faces" who function as heels in how they act. 

 

 

 

 

 

sigh. you don't understand how wrestling works. Its more about the chase and the bad guy getting his ultimate comeuppance. If you don't have a bad guy with a good enough reign and someone to finally dethrone him because everyone is a face, it'll hurt business.

 

Hangman winning was the right call yeah. I now expect Cole/Bucks to turn on Kenny.  But i don't like you so I'm not going to entertain you. 

 

AEW is an amazing company where even when you have favorites, its hard to cheer either side. Its just quality. Unlike Vince and his Champion Luke E Mia.

 

pce.

 

AEW ALL OUT 2021 4.5/5 Stars (- .5 for having Paul Wight vs QT)

AEW Full Gear 2021 5/5 stars. (even ATT did pretty well, only result i didn't like was Superkliq losing to Crackhead Lukes son Jack)

[skidmarkgn]

The Hangman story has been IMO the best in wrestling in a very, very long time.  An almost two year build paid off with an incredible finish.  And just like that... a star is born.

[Rozalia1]

3 hours ago, Infected Elite said:

sigh. you don't understand how wrestling works. Its more about the chase and the bad guy getting his ultimate comeuppance. If you don't have a bad guy with a good enough reign and someone to finally dethrone him because everyone is a face, it'll hurt business.

 

Hangman winning was the right call yeah. I now expect Cole/Bucks to turn on Kenny.  But i don't like you so I'm not going to entertain you. 

 

AEW is an amazing company where even when you have favorites, its hard to cheer either side. Its just quality. Unlike Vince and his Champion Luke E Mia.

 

pce.

 

AEW ALL OUT 2021 4.5/5 Stars (- .5 for having Paul Wight vs QT)

AEW Full Gear 2021 5/5 stars. (even ATT did pretty well, only result i didn't like was Superkliq losing to Crackhead Lukes son Jack)

 

Because everyone is a face? What are you on about? Throwing out a "you don't understand how wrestling works" at me? Brazen. Naturally your little comment there to try and educate me only showed your ignorance of the matter. Modern fan thought, which is largely diseased as fans aren't as smart as they think they are, fits what you are saying certainly. Many modern fans also think every face that isn't quite working in the moment could be instantly improved with a heel turn. If a face wins a title their first thought goes to "now which heel should beat them in a few months", no offense to those that did it but that happened right here with Hangman. That he should win but quickly lose it to a heel like MJF.

 

The truth of the matter is that it is the faces, the top face most importantly, who best promote your company. Faces are who can create interest for female and child fans, demographics that wrestling struggles with today. Then you got the "Ethnic Hero" faces that can allow you to reach certain demographics. WCW obliterated their business with heel domination. WWE twice with HHH's stupid heel domination absolutely wrecked their viewership and they're now at record lows. History clearly shows that having heels be so strong at the top is not good for business. Flair? Pretty much the only counterpoint someone might have, was the NWA champ and toured the regional territories, a different way of business than today, and would barely escape local heroes in broadways or at times (hence his huge amount of title wins, more than the 16 WWE recognises) drop the title to them. 

 

You must find your cancer joke really funny as this isn't the first time you've made it. I'm not surprised that you didn't like the big heel group losing a match after running over faces again and again for ages.

 

3 hours ago, skidmarkgn said:

The Hangman story has been IMO the best in wrestling in a very, very long time.  An almost two year build paid off with an incredible finish.  And just like that... a star is born.

 

I think there were some missteps that didn't need to happen, but it was nice yes. A star was indeed born but... weren't you someone who thought that Hangman should drop the title soon after winning it to MJF? Shouldn't a star have a long and powerful reign? I mean Hangman is the first real face AEW champion they've had. Both Jericho and Omega were heels while Moxley did his crazy guy stuff. Have you changed your mind on it? You are of course allowed to and nothing wrong with that.

[skidmarkgn]

7 hours ago, Rozalia1 said:

 A star was indeed born but... weren't you someone who thought that Hangman should drop the title soon after winning it to MJF?

 

"MJF might be a guy who could take the hit of being a transitional champion.  He's a super established heel who has a routine, and the routine doesn't need a belt.  MJF winning the title and going triple slimeball with it for a couple/few months would be an extraordinary lead up for Darby to be the one to take it and have a run.  Can't imagine the pop Darby would get, especially if they could pull it off in Key Arena (Seattle)."

 

The statement above is the only comment I made about MJF eventually winning the title, so no, I never said Hangman should drop it "soon" to him. 

 

[Rozalia1]

21 minutes ago, skidmarkgn said:

 

"MJF might be a guy who could take the hit of being a transitional champion.  He's a super established heel who has a routine, and the routine doesn't need a belt.  MJF winning the title and going triple slimeball with it for a couple/few months would be an extraordinary lead up for Darby to be the one to take it and have a run.  Can't imagine the pop Darby would get, especially if they could pull it off in Key Arena (Seattle)."

 

The statement above is the only comment I made about MJF eventually winning the title, so no, I never said Hangman should drop it "soon" to him. 

 

 

Note that it was a legitimate question there, but I should have stressed that. Using that I found your post eventually and the convo and it wasn't you no. Good that is sorted.

[skidmarkgn]

2 hours ago, Rozalia1 said:

 

Note that it was a legitimate question there, but I should have stressed that. Using that I found your post eventually and the convo and it wasn't you no. Good that is sorted.

 

Can't say I want a full on 3+ year title reign from Hangman, any where from 10-16 months would be fine by me.  I do still believe MJF should be one to eventually take it from him though, and Darby after that.  After he cheated and won with the headlock takedown last night the story between the two has hopefully only just begun, they'd have to find a way to have a, for lack of a better term, "intermission" so Hangman can hold onto the title for a while then restart the feud after MJF wins it.  I'm hoping Hangman/Bryan will be a Dynamite match so a dirty finish won't feel too cheap (Miro run-in kind of thing) and Hangman can feud with Miro first and maybe eventually a freshly rehabilitated and hopefully heel-turned Moxley before ultimately starting the end-game feud with MJF.

[Rozalia1]

I didn't mention it at the time as I didn't want to note irrelevant things compared to Hangman's win, but AEW announced their signing of Jay Lethal. This is interesting because Jay Lethal has multiple women who accuse him of sexual wrongdoing. Most notable being a woman who was on ROH's roster and was ruined for apparently not sleeping with Lethal who in ROH had a top spot.

This signing comes after a woman asked about the situation of AEW's female roster and Khan rudely cut her off quickly and started going on about how he paid AEW's women on NWA Empowerr and so he contributed to it and no one gives him respect/credit for it. I'd love to see someone ask him how NXT can have 3 women's matches on their show + interviews as they did last show and AEW can only just have 1 match.

 

Anyway, point is, not a good week for the perception of what AEW thinks of female wrestlers. This is a so called progressive company that is all about inclusion and all that and yet they're signing people with accusations on them. Oh dear. Of course, anyone who isn't a mark or supremely naïve realises that Tony Khan isn't some saint so of course this is no issue for him. Khan masks it well enough usually but the arrogance does come out, most notably if criticised. Another fun thing about him is that for all the WWE shots it was clear from the last bunch of them that he really would like to have Vince respond to him. "Notice me senpai" as the meme goes. 

 

18 hours ago, skidmarkgn said:

Can't say I want a full on 3+ year title reign from Hangman, any where from 10-16 months would be fine by me.  I do still believe MJF should be one to eventually take it from him though, and Darby after that.  After he cheated and won with the headlock takedown last night the story between the two has hopefully only just begun, they'd have to find a way to have a, for lack of a better term, "intermission" so Hangman can hold onto the title for a while then restart the feud after MJF wins it.  I'm hoping Hangman/Bryan will be a Dynamite match so a dirty finish won't feel too cheap (Miro run-in kind of thing) and Hangman can feud with Miro first and maybe eventually a freshly rehabilitated and hopefully heel-turned Moxley before ultimately starting the end-game feud with MJF.

 

I don't think it was just a promo spot for MJF, I think if he isn't given the title next/soon after whoever is next then he might well look into getting into WWE. So AEW will have that to worry about.

 

[skidmarkgn]

I initially argued here but it's not worth it.

 

You know what fuck it.  You left out the part where she (she being the reporter he cut off) also later disclosed that Khan reached out to her in private, apologized and they resolved the issue.  His response was obviously an idiot move but he also realized his mistake and corrected it, which is a pretty important detail.

 

As for the women's matches on Dynamite, yes, there's always only one, and yes that sucks, however the match they do put on is pretty often a high quality, lengthy match.  I can't speak to NXT because I don't watch it but I do know that the big Women's Queen of the ring tourney had match after match that were less than 2 minute throwaway wastes of time so lets not act like the WWE is is some virtuous standard bearer... and that's without going through how the WWE women have been historically treated.

 

And Jay Lethal... I give you exhibit A.  As soon as his AEW contract was announced, cancel culture targeted him (for a 3 year old accusation) and you sure jumped right on board didn't you, but nah, they don't have anything to worry about.

Edited November 15, 2021 by skidmarkgn

[Rozalia1]

3 hours ago, skidmarkgn said:

I initially argued here but it's not worth it.

 

You know what fuck it.  You left out the part where she (she being the reporter he cut off) also later disclosed that Khan reached out to her in private, apologized and they resolved the issue.  His response was obviously an idiot move but he also realized his mistake and corrected it, which is a pretty important detail.

 

As for the women's matches on Dynamite, yes, there's always only one, and yes that sucks, however the match they do put on is pretty often a high quality, lengthy match.  I can't speak to NXT because I don't watch it but I do know that the big Women's Queen of the ring tourney had match after match that were less than 2 minute throwaway wastes of time so lets not act like the WWE is is some virtuous standard bearer... and that's without going through how the WWE women have been historically treated.

 

And Jay Lethal... I give you exhibit A.  As soon as his AEW contract was announced, cancel culture targeted him (for a 3 year old accusation) and you sure jumped right on board didn't you, but nah, they don't have anything to worry about.

 

I suppose I did leave that out, didn't come to mind. Not that it matters much because obviously Khan's apologies are always false ones. Unlike the two footballs where fans see him as a fool who doesn't know what he is doing, and let him know it often enough, in wrestling he has all these adoring fans who see him as their Jesus to Vince's Satan. So he will always try to maintain that unlike the two footballs where if he apologies or not is irrelevant, people won't like him regardless.

 

Okay, here is the last NXT and AEW for you.

 

NXT

Kayden Carter/Io Shirai/Kacy Catanzaro vs. Toxic Attraction: 12:05

Kay Lee Ray vs. Sarray: 4:50

Boa vs. Joe Gacy: 3:27

Jacket Time vs. Creed Brothers: 7:45

Cameron Grimes vs. Ru Feng: 1:40

Solo Sikoa vs. LA Knight vs. Grayson Waller: 5:05

Elektra Lopez vs. Erica Yan: 1:24

Pete Dunne vs. Carmelo Hayes: 12:35

Total Match Time: 48:51

Women's Match Time: 18:19

Percentage of Show: 37.5

 

AEW

Bryan Danielson vs. Rocky Romero: 10:53

Tay Conti/Anna Jay/Thunder Rosa vs. Rebel/Britt Baker/Jamie Hayter: 7:58

Anthony Bowens vs. Jungle Boy: 10:07

Wheeler Yuta vs. Wardlow: 2:18

Lio Rush/Dante Martin vs. Lee Moriarty/Matt Sydal: 10:18

Dax Harwood vs. Pac: 13:47

Total Match Time: 55:21

Women's Match Time: 7:58

Percentage of Show: 13.7

 

Of course, to be clear, unlike AEW who has the whole 1 match rule NXT has no such rules so the women might get 1-3 matches on the show, though NXT 2.0 seems good in getting people not on the show in interview spots unlike AEW where even a former champion like Shida can fall into the void, or Dark as AEW calls it, for 6 months. Seeing those times there should tell you that NXT doesn't screw the women on time in their matches because well, everyone has short matches basically. AEW meanwhile outside the squash for Wardlow (did he need this? Why not any of the women instead?) gave all the men 10 mins, but the lone woman's match did not even receive that.

 

Of course all this here might lead you to think that well, NXT is an odd thing and shouldn't really count. RAW and Smackdown beat AEW more often than not on this matter also. Becky and Bianca two weeks ago went nearly 20 minutes, the longest on the night, and there was a second match that went nearly 10. I say two weeks for RAW because last week they had just 1 match, it went 16:28, but RAW is 3 hours, so if it beat AEW I'd have to go total up all that and I don't care to do that for RAW. Last week's Smackdown women's time was 12:48.

 

And yes, I've heard all about the Queen's Crown tournament. It is all AEW marks talk about to attack WWE to get around having to face up to the fact that AEW is worse on the matter. Why was that tournament so short on match time really? Does the WWE just screw women? Or is it that in WWE there exists a clear list of women who the company think matter and then the rest who they simply do not care about? It is the latter if you do not know the answer. Just look at the list of women that was in the thing.

 

Zelina Vega

Toni Storm

Liv Morgan

Carmella

Dana Brooke

Shayna Baszler

Doudrop

Natalya

 

WWE cares for none of these women. They care so little for them that likely as a joke, but perhaps sold as an apology to Vega for the 9/11 memorial thing where they didn't book her, they booked the biggest... perhaps I should say smallest jobber on the list to win the thing. Now if we talk the women who they see as mattering? They get time. They get big matches. They get main events. The truth of the matter is that WWE, you can say rightly for being wretched, has a lot of haters who are hyper critical of it and so ignore positives and focus on just negatives. The truth however is that on this matter WWE is actually ahead of AEW and easily at that. 

 

With that out of the way, we're back to Cancel Culture apparently. To start with Lethal has never been cancelled. Back when it happened ROH did an "investigation" and then stood behind him firmly and... that was that. As I said, that mob only has the perception of power, not actual power. AEW might possibly be more malleable but... if Khan is so weak as to bend to them then that means he was incompetent enough to sign someone without first knowing if there were any issues that hiring them might bring. As for myself, I jumped right on board you say? Where did I do that? I made no personal comment of my feelings of the matter involving Lethal. I simply mocked the absurdity of AEW being the progressive all inclusive company while clearly not acting as such. Though I suppose you could say that they are a progressive all inclusive company in a meta sense.

[Infected Elite]

On 14/11/2021 at 1:42 AM, Rozalia1 said:

 

Because everyone is a face? What are you on about? Throwing out a "you don't understand how wrestling works" at me? Brazen. Naturally your little comment there to try and educate me only showed your ignorance of the matter. Modern fan thought, which is largely diseased as fans aren't as smart as they think they are, fits what you are saying certainly. Many modern fans also think every face that isn't quite working in the moment could be instantly improved with a heel turn. If a face wins a title their first thought goes to "now which heel should beat them in a few months", no offense to those that did it but that happened right here with Hangman. That he should win but quickly lose it to a heel like MJF.

 

The truth of the matter is that it is the faces, the top face most importantly, who best promote your company. Faces are who can create interest for female and child fans, demographics that wrestling struggles with today. Then you got the "Ethnic Hero" faces that can allow you to reach certain demographics. WCW obliterated their business with heel domination. WWE twice with HHH's stupid heel domination absolutely wrecked their viewership and they're now at record lows. History clearly shows that having heels be so strong at the top is not good for business. Flair? Pretty much the only counterpoint someone might have, was the NWA champ and toured the regional territories, a different way of business than today, and would barely escape local heroes in broadways or at times (hence his huge amount of title wins, more than the 16 WWE recognises) drop the title to them. 

 

You must find your cancer joke really funny as this isn't the first time you've made it. I'm not surprised that you didn't like the big heel group losing a match after running over faces again and again for ages.

 

 

I think there were some missteps that didn't need to happen, but it was nice yes. A star was indeed born but... weren't you someone who thought that Hangman should drop the title soon after winning it to MJF? Shouldn't a star have a long and powerful reign? I mean Hangman is the first real face AEW champion they've had. Both Jericho and Omega were heels while Moxley did his crazy guy stuff. Have you changed your mind on it? You are of course allowed to and nothing wrong with that.

 

Cancer is funny. Nor do i care about you, or your opinion. I was stating the fact that heels make wrestling more entertaining, with 1 or 2 faces chasing them for the title. Not a face having a long run "overcoming the odds". Boring. 

 

I'm also not a modern fan. I like AEW, i really don't care about WWE. But ive been watching wrestling since i was 3. 

[ReazonIzTreazon]

50 minutes ago, Rozalia1 said:

The truth of the matter is that WWE, you can say rightly for being wretched, has a lot of haters who are hyper critical of it and so ignore positives and focus on just negatives.

 

The irony of this comment is certainly not lost on me, haha.

[Rozalia1]

19 minutes ago, Infected Elite said:

Cancer is funny. Nor do i care about you, or your opinion. I was stating the fact that heels make wrestling more entertaining, with 1 or 2 faces chasing them for the title. Not a face having a long run "overcoming the odds". Boring. 

 

I'm also not a modern fan. I like AEW, i really don't care about WWE. But ive been watching wrestling since i was 3. 

 

I said "Modern fan thought". You could be 80, I'm referring to the mindset, not the physical age.

 

Yeah, your comment is pure modern fan thought right there. Where faces are only fine when chasing because after they win it becomes "boring" so get the title on another heel who says naughty things I can giggle at. Rotten stuff. The heels are not there to be entertaining. They are there to be vile and to be someone you want to see get beat. They should not be doing moves like what you see them do on AEW to wow people. It is the faces who should be entertaining and spectacular in the ring.

 

12 minutes ago, ReazonIzTreazon said:

The irony of this comment is certainly not lost on me, haha.

 

You might have a point if I wasn't critical of WWE. Also I'm not hypercritical. Me complaining about say, the rules not being abided by and thus making a mockery of Professional Wrestling, is not some quibble.

[skidmarkgn]

2 hours ago, Rozalia1 said:

 -because obviously Khan's apologies are always false ones.

 

-Now if we talk the women who they see as mattering? They get time. They get big matches. They get main events.

 

With that out of the way, we're back to Cancel Culture apparently. To start with Lethal has never been cancelled. Back when it happened ROH did an "investigation" and then stood behind him firmly and... that was that. As I said, that mob only has the perception of power, not actual power. AEW might possibly be more malleable but... if Khan is so weak as to bend to them then that means he was incompetent enough to sign someone without first knowing if there were any issues that hiring them might bring. As for myself, I jumped right on board you say? Where did I do that? I made no personal comment of my feelings of the matter involving Lethal. I simply mocked the absurdity of AEW being the progressive all inclusive company while clearly not acting as such. Though I suppose you could say that they are a progressive all inclusive company in a meta sense.

 

Your first response is an absolute cop-out.  Khan reached out to her privately, admitted his mistake and apologized.  SHE then decided to go to social media and reveal it.  If his apology was so "false" then he probably would have gone the BS Hollywood route and had a PR department come up with some long winded blanket statement about not meaning to offend anyone and blah blah blah trying to get pats on the back.

 

Your second response is true for both companies. Also, I already conceded it sucks they don't get more matches my point was the matches they do get are almost always high quality.

 

So your reasoning for bringing up Lethal's history was just a reach to shamelessly bash Khan some more then?

[Rozalia1]

24 minutes ago, skidmarkgn said:

Your first response is an absolute cop-out.  Khan reached out to her privately, admitted his mistake and apologized.  SHE then decided to go to social media and reveal it.  If his apology was so "false" then he probably would have gone the BS Hollywood route and had a PR department come up with some long winded blanket statement about not meaning to offend anyone and blah blah blah trying to get pats on the back.

 

Your second response is true for both companies. Also, I already conceded it sucks they don't get more matches my point was the matches they do get are almost always high quality.

 

So your reasoning for bringing up Lethal's history was just a reach to shamelessly bash Khan some more then?

 

You might be right with someone else on that, but not Khan. Not in his nature acting as someone fitting his station. He likes the attention. Observe the difference between him and Vince for example. Vince basically doesn't communicate. Everything is safe. Attacking him, the company, or something else he does? He cares not. Khan will argue with random guys for no real reason outside not being able to let things go. 

 

I was dispelling your statement about the WWE and their women. WWE's women roster is a very unequal place... however AEW is even more so. Baker and Jade are the only women who get consistent matches on Dynamite/Rampage. The Bunny of all people fairs okay as she is also a manager so even if not wrestling she is at least present on the show. The rest might get a short period of focus while opposing Baker but once done with, back to the void with them. Shida, who was champion, had to seemingly pay AEW to get on the show and once she lost the belt that was it for half a year. Riho, Kenny Omega's favourite, couldn't be present because Corona yes, but once that cleared she has still been kept in the void. Other Joshis who are apparently such great wrestlers and so important to AEW? In the void. Where is Queen Emi? She has a new gimmick and uses it for Dark? However, as you have said, you know it sucks. The thing that I wander is when will AEW's fanbase stop being so hypocritical? They'll talk crap about Queen's Crown and attack WWE... but where is give AEW women a chance? Khan won't change if not forced because you know what he thinks of this? Exactly what AEW's top heel, Jim Cornette thinks. Women are an "attraction", but don't deserve much in the way of matches/time on the card. The war with HHH's NXT, who always gave the women matches and time, will only have solidified that to him as NXT got beat. Though being fair, which I strive to be, AEW did develop a secondary Woman's feud on their show recently so that is progress... except I know that has only happened due to tournament thing. The new title by the way? Don't expect secondary feuds for those. It'll be like the TNT title, random title shots to people.

 

You think I'm the bad guy for calling Khan out on his lies? Khan and company is who talk of AEW being inclusive, progressive, and all that. They're not the evil empire, they're good guys. He is the kind gentle boss who cares about his employees unlike the nasty cruel McMahon. This also, if you have forgotten, is the company that banned Hulk Hogan and his wife from AEW shows (like they'd attend) after WWE welcomed Hogan back, a virtue signal if you are unaware what people call that. And yet their main event is completely dominated by White males. Their women are treated horribly. Joshis, Sonny Kiss, Nyla Rose, so forth that they trotted out to prove their inclusiveness? Either banished to the void so most people don't see them or in the case of Nyla, jobbed out (please do not cite the pointless record due to Dark). Of course I know what your attack on what I've said is based on which is me not believing what I'm saying. I say they're wrong for doing X when I might actually think AEW is right to do it, for example I mention Riho not getting booked as an attack when I've always been clear that I would rather not see Riho booked. As such I'm "shameless", I'm just attacking for the sake of it, that sort of thing. No. I'm simply holding them to the standard they've set, but, it really doesn't matter. Did I lie a single time?

 

As for my personal thoughts. I thought I'd provide them so you get something out of this post as I doubt you'll get anything out of the above. The above ain't anything you don't already know after all, you would just rather not focus on it. As far as I know Lethal had some accusations. Being a "creep". Abusing his power to try and get women to sleep with him. These are accusations and not proven, granted, such things are hard to unless the person accused did it in a widespread manner or you have evidence such as texts/video. It is perhaps more likely than not that there are women out there who slept with him due to his position of power and so were coerced into having sex with him, which some see as a form of rape. ROH investigated the matter but many think it was a sham so the investigation likely matters little to if he is innocent or not. I have seen the women who have accused him having their character questioned, being troublemakers and the like, but I don't know these women and victims having people defend a guy from their victims isn't an alien concept. Then we have to remember that the people who Khan confides with, the Bucks and the like, are good friends of Lethal and no doubt will have sworn that he was a good guy and this stuff is all lies. All in all... I do not think you can just ruin people over what is ultimately hearsay. This is heresy to some, believe all women and all that, but that is my view on the matter and as such I would sign Lethal if I was in Tony's current spot especially due to AEW lacking a credible top Black male wrestler, though of course I would talk with him on it and state that due to how things are these days it would be best if he avoids anything that might spread that sort of talk again about him. The thing is though, I'm not a progressive and would never attempt to pander to such people as Tony has done. As such me signing Lethal wouldn't make me look like a liar/hypocrite. I imagine we actually align on this?

[buckallmighty]