soziaLSturmi

Final Fantasy 7 "Remake" STORY (Spoilers)

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Posted (edited)

Hey guys, 

if anybody out there also has the game, played it and wants to give his/her theory on the REAL Story behind the remake and discuss it please do so.

The main point of this Topic is to really try and clear out rather the "Remake" is a true remake or rather a Sequel (YES SEQUEL) to the go FF7.

Spoiler

I talked and heard lots of opinions on this and they are mostly pointing towards a Sequel because of the given plot points (Sepiroth time travel ? Whisperers want to hold him back ?)

also the Foreshadowings of Cloud where he clearly sees Aeriths dead scene (not in full but couple seconds) and also crys in some points looking at Aerith which can be a hint that he already lived through these moments once.

Whats ur opinion on all of that Plot/Story elements of the Remake ? 

(Im still playing and it feels amazing) :)

 

Edited by Beyondthegrave07
added spoiler tags.
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Spoiler

I'm not sure if sequel is the correct term, as events of the game don't occur after (or before) the original, or even how the game should be classified, but It's heavily hinted at throughout the game that things are going to diverge from the original with certain events happening differently from the original and the presence of the Whispers/Arbiters & Sephiroth throughout.

 

In the last hour it becomes even clearer that they're not doing a strict retelling and are planning to make massive changes. who you fight at the end why you fight them and the characters motivations/goals after leaving Midgar are completely different from the original.

 

The game even ends with the line 'The Unknown Journey Will Continue'

 

 

 

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2 hours ago, Lake013 said:
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I'm not sure if sequel is the correct term, as events of the game don't occur after (or before) the original, or even how the game should be classified, but It's heavily hinted at throughout the game that things are going to diverge from the original with certain events happening differently from the original and the presence of the Whispers/Arbiters & Sephiroth throughout.

 

In the last hour it becomes even clearer that they're not doing a strict retelling and are planning to make massive changes. who you fight at the end why you fight them and the characters motivations/goals after leaving Midgar are completely different from the original.

 

The game even ends with the line 'The Unknown Journey Will Continue'

 

 

 

Yep same thoughts here, just heard the term sequel so often I had to ask for other perspectives.

Though the time traveling aspects are kinda irritating for newer players even not understandable I think for example the visions of certain events in the future (Aerith death) or other events which occur to cloud.

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Posted (edited)

It is a new interpretation of the original story which also includes other influences from ideas of later productions.

 

Also there are completely new powers and things that expand the mythology.

Edited by Aladan82
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This topic confuses me, I feel like I just turned the wrong corner and ended up in the wrong room where a bunch of dudes are doing squats and only wearing speedos..

So.. I'mma just.. Back out.. slowly...

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I can't post spoiler tags from mobile version of the site, so, I will keep it vague.. 

 

But so far I didn't played much (I'm at the start of the sector seven slums for the first time), and I was already getting a strange vibe from the scene that plays when Cloud is "looking up" (well, chapter 2 also gave me a strange vibe, but not as strange , because I assumed that it was just SE forcing him in the game...).

 

From what the OP said in the spoiler tag, it looks like I was right and not mixing stuff.. 

 

I'm a bit conflicted about it, but since I put P5R on hold to play FF7R, I will at least play it to the end before judging it, but my hype is dying a bit, and way to fast (I'm actually fighting myself to not drop FF7R right away and go back to P5R..). 

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Posted (edited)

Sometimes I wish Nomura would just stick to character designs instead of directing games. His recent games (FFXV and KH3) are in my opinion quite a mess, and it really seems like whichever project he's leading it somehow goes messy in one aspect or another. I liked this Remake in general, although it's not without flaws I had a good time with it. The combat actually requires strategy, side characters being fleshed out more, several nods to the original, etc. I just feel weird and unsure about that last chapter. Just unnecessarily complicated things and was clearly implemented to give way for

Spoiler

fan service with the last battle with Sephiroth (I mean really now, what is the point of fighting Sephiroth THIS early other than to please fans?). I could live with the few retcons like Wedge being alive and Shinra destroying Reactor 1 since they still felt believable to an extent but changing destinies and visions of the future? This game should have been called Final Nomura Fantasy VII: Re Mix 358/2 days lol

 

Edited by PostGameBlues
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52 minutes ago, PostGameBlues said:

Sometimes I wish Nomura would just stick to character designs instead of directing games. His recent games (FFXV and KH3) are in my opinion quite a mess, and it really seems like whichever project he's leading it somehow goes messy in one aspect or another. I liked this Remake in general, although it's not without flaws I had a good time with it. The combat actually requires strategy, side characters being fleshed out more, several nods to the original, etc. I just feel weird and unsure about that last chapter. Just unnecessarily complicated things and was clearly implemented to give way for

  Reveal hidden contents

fan service with the last battle with Sephiroth (I mean really now, what is the point of fighting Sephiroth THIS early other than to please fans?). I could live with the few retcons like Wedge being alive and Shinra destroying Reactor 1 since they still felt believable to an extent but changing destinies and visions of the future? This game should have been called Final Nomura Fantasy VII: Re Mix 358/2 days lol

 

 

Dude I feel like I've been saying this for years. Nomura's games all have some sort of issues with them, and it's baffling that Square keeps putting him as a director. I feel like all he wants to do lately is make cool scenes without too much actual rhyme or reason behind them. I half expect that scene to be removed completely just cuz Nomura wants changes and I'd honestly lose my mind if that happened.

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Posted (edited)

1 hour ago, PostGameBlues said:

Sometimes I wish Nomura would just stick to character designs instead of directing games. His recent games (FFXV and KH3) are in my opinion quite a mess, and it really seems like whichever project he's leading it somehow goes messy in one aspect or another. I liked this Remake in general, although it's not without flaws I had a good time with it. The combat actually requires strategy, side characters being fleshed out more, several nods to the original, etc. I just feel weird and unsure about that last chapter. Just unnecessarily complicated things and was clearly implemented to give way for

  Hide contents

fan service with the last battle with Sephiroth (I mean really now, what is the point of fighting Sephiroth THIS early other than to please fans?). I could live with the few retcons like Wedge being alive and Shinra destroying Reactor 1 since they still felt believable to an extent but changing destinies and visions of the future? This game should have been called Final Nomura Fantasy VII: Re Mix 358/2 days lol

 

I understand that last part... A BIT

Spoiler

It is a way to "close" the game. Imagine if the game had just ended in the highway after defeating the big machine... wouldn't that feel a bit... empty? The fan service part is including Spectres that can manipulate time and actions and are trying to avoid the fate from being changed. Which leads to people thinking... will Aerith not die in the Remake? Why the hell does Zack even show up in cutscenes with NO information AT ALL given about him? Like, if you haven't played Crisis Core or the original FF7 you have no idea where this is coming from. And to the rest of us, it just raises questions (????).

Also yeah, the last part... more than a whether I liked it or not, it just left me confused. Like, what just happened? Why? What's the point of this? Oh yeah, Nomura. Thanks Mr. Nomura.

 

I get that you fight Sephiroth to close out the game, but I don't get all the mysticism and dimensional time-travelling (?) around it.

 

Edited by mrrj46
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Sephiroth as a final fight cheapens the future continuation, how is he going to be a threat in the next game when I kick his alternate reality ass. The game should have ended fighting with the cool ghostly versions of Cloud,Tifa and Barret (maybe make one for Aerith that's bigger or something since she's an ancient and has an important role in the future) 

 

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Posted (edited)

 

2 hours ago, mrrj46 said:

I understand that last part... A BIT

  Reveal hidden contents

It is a way to "close" the game. Imagine if the game had just ended in the highway after defeating the big machine... wouldn't that feel a bit... empty? The fan service part is including Spectres that can manipulate time and actions and are trying to avoid the fate from being changed. Which leads to people thinking... will Aerith not die in the Remake? Why the hell does Zack even show up in cutscenes with NO information AT ALL given about him? Like, if you haven't played Crisis Core or the original FF7 you have no idea where this is coming from. And to the rest of us, it just raises questions (????).

Also yeah, the last part... more than a whether I liked it or not, it just left me confused. Like, what just happened? Why? What's the point of this? Oh yeah, Nomura. Thanks Mr. Nomura.

 

I get that you fight Sephiroth to close out the game, but I don't get all the mysticism and dimensional time-travelling (?) around it.

 

Spoiler

I actually feel like if that highway boss was done right it could have been a satisfying ending to the game, with the party looking over the horizon wondering what lies up ahead, while the main overworld theme plays in the background. Just delete Chapter 18 and squeeze that highway boss at the end of Chapter 17.

 

Somehow though, Nomura thought flashier is better and gave us these two bosses in the end that had no right to be there in that point in the game. I was kind of intrigued by the idea of these whispers being arbiters of fate and I don't know about any of you but it felt like this whole story beat needed a lot more time to present itself and truly flourish. I know the whispers have been present throughout this game but it just felt like they could have done a lot more with them before they suddenly pitted you against the entity that controls all of them.

 

Sephiroth also had no right to be there in the end, and I get what you're saying in that it makes for a final boss-ish satisfaction, ending the game there, but at the same time I personally think that Sephiroth's villainy has worked in the original game because of the build up and the increasing hate and resentment we built towards him. Cloud's hallucinations of Sephiroth didn't feel enough to truly establish Sephiroth as the ultimate baddie and thus warrant a boss fight facing him in the end of the game. President Shinra was enough as the villain of this first part of the Remake, let Sephiroth stay an ominous mystery for now. 

 

Edited by PostGameBlues
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I loved the game. Then came the last chapter and I'm like wtf is happening. :/

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39 minutes ago, Deluziion90 said:

I loved the game. Then came the last chapter and I'm like wtf is happening. :/

 

I didn't like the part with these "fate ghosts", it's non-sense, plus the last chapter... they change the timeline so everything happening after midgar in FF7 and FF7AC don't exist? no way.

Also, the fact we already beat the "emerald weapon" and "rubis weapon" in chapter 18 is meh....why...

 

And the last chapter reminds me too much kingdom hearts, it's like if they copied KH level design.

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1 hour ago, MercureUnleashed said:

 

I didn't like the part with these "fate ghosts", it's non-sense, plus the last chapter... they change the timeline so everything happening after midgar in FF7 and FF7AC don't exist? no way.

Also, the fact we already beat the "emerald weapon" and "rubis weapon" in chapter 18 is meh....why...

 

And the last chapter reminds me too much kingdom hearts, it's like if they copied KH level design.

When you think about it it's either a Reboot of the OG FF7 or a sequel to Advent Children. Like I said though, I don't particularly hate the ending/last chapter. I just feel extremely weird and confused about this new addition to the story that at the moment, feels very unnecessary...

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Posted (edited)

Spoiler

After the final Chapter I think we have at least two timelines now. One with Zack dead and one with Zack alive. The fight with the future Whispers (the 3 Whispers are Versions of Cloud, Tifa and Barrett if I go after the text in assess and the weapons they use) and opposing fate could mean we get a completely different timeline in the following games.

 

Was hell of a ride with the new story details 😃

Edited by Aladan82
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16 hours ago, PostGameBlues said:

Sometimes I wish Nomura would just stick to character designs instead of directing games. His recent games (FFXV and KH3) are in my opinion quite a mess, and it really seems like whichever project he's leading it somehow goes messy in one aspect or another. I liked this Remake in general, although it's not without flaws I had a good time with it. The combat actually requires strategy, side characters being fleshed out more, several nods to the original, etc. I just feel weird and unsure about that last chapter. Just unnecessarily complicated things and was clearly implemented to give way for

  Reveal hidden contents

fan service with the last battle with Sephiroth (I mean really now, what is the point of fighting Sephiroth THIS early other than to please fans?). I could live with the few retcons like Wedge being alive and Shinra destroying Reactor 1 since they still felt believable to an extent but changing destinies and visions of the future? This game should have been called Final Nomura Fantasy VII: Re Mix 358/2 days lol

 

 

FFXV wasn't quite his game, was it? Business Division 2 made that one while Nomura was busy with Business Division 1 and 3.

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On 4/9/2020 at 9:40 PM, Han_the_Dragon said:

I can't post spoiler tags from mobile version of the site, so, I will keep it vague.. 

 

But so far I didn't played much (I'm at the start of the sector seven slums for the first time), and I was already getting a strange vibe from the scene that plays when Cloud is "looking up" (well, chapter 2 also gave me a strange vibe, but not as strange , because I assumed that it was just SE forcing him in the game...).

 

From what the OP said in the spoiler tag, it looks like I was right and not mixing stuff.. 

 

I'm a bit conflicted about it, but since I put P5R on hold to play FF7R, I will at least play it to the end before judging it, but my hype is dying a bit, and way to fast (I'm actually fighting myself to not drop FF7R right away and go back to P5R..). 

I'm about to drop it to finish up Monster Hunter World. The game disappoints me on the same level the TMNT game did. 

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2 hours ago, Bawzton said:

I'm about to drop it to finish up Monster Hunter World. The game disappoints me on the same level the TMNT game did. 

I continue playing, and I'm now somewhat enjoying it.. I also changed my view a bit, and consider it a different experience (like the other FF7 spin-offs). 

 

I do like what they did to expand on the other characters to further develop them a bit. 

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The truth is that sometimes I feel lost with the story. I'm just back to sector 7 after the plaque fall. What happened when Aerith met Marlene? Yeah, I know it's not very important in the plot, bit when they touched the screen went bzzzzz like when Cloud had his "memories" and then Aerith just said shhh... What? I felt the same way as the first OP message with the "memory"? of Cloud.

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I loved the game the entire way through, and actually like that they've given themselves leeway for changes and potential surprised.

 

That said, I was discussing the game with a friend tonight and he actually made a really good point.

 

Major end game and original game Spoilers!

Spoiler

In this game, right up until the end the struggle was believable because everything you fought was threatening, just for different reasons. Whether it was an elite assassin (Turks) the latest in technology (AirBuster), the Supernatural (Phantom) or a force of nature (Abzu).

 

But at the very end you fight and succeed against both the Arbiter of Fate and Sephiroth in back to back fights, enemies that lore wise are completely in a league of their own.

 

In the original the build was much slower, you were introduced to Sephiroth through rumors, then by his actions, etc. It all ramped up gradually all the way to the final confrontation.

A good example is the scene in the picture below, as a kid it gave me chills, speaking to both brutal, merciless and strong the opponent you were chasing was.

Final Fantasy Villains Highlight Series – Blackmage Blog

Ditto for the weapons, in the original the story beats involving them did a fantastic job expressing just how dangerous they were and the timing of their introduction was a great way of escalating the plot at a sensible point in the overall story.

 

But now it would make no sense story wise for most enemies from the original game from this point onward to be even remotely a threat in comparison. I'm just not sure where they can go from here scaling or pacing wise without taking a massive step backwards or without things just getting silly.

 

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Spoiler

 

Since I played the FF7R demo for the first time the scene with the "falling black feather scene in chapter one" gave me some "Rebuild of Evangelion" vibes.

 

For people who don´t know what I mean with this I try to explain:

"Rebuild of Evangelion" is a series of 4 movies (with the 4. airing in 2020 as far as information goes). Those movies are NOT an exact retelling of all the events from the original "Neon Genesis Evangelion" anime series which had 28 episodes and the last chapter being the film "End of Evangelion". "Rebuild of Evangelion" is an "retelling" of the "Neon Genesis Evangelion" story arc in which all events from the 28 episodes and "End of Evangelion" definitely happened BUT only one side character and we as viewers know this while ALL other characters including the main protagonist are unaware of this completely. The first "Rebuild" movie retells the original series episodes 1 to 6 with some visuals hinting for the viewers that all events of the anime series and the film "End of Evangelion" happened before. The second movie altered the story with the introducing of a new character into the old plot and the third movie providing an alternative approach to the last episodes of the original series.

 

Okay, now I try to explain why I got those "Rebuild of Evangelion" vibes when watching the "falling black feather scene in chapter one":

We as audience know that Sephiroth is known as "One winged angel" and how he was presented with one wing and black feathers in many games and artworks. Also we as audience can see that getting those flashbacks causes Cloud some pain. I thought about those scenes in the demo and came to the conclusion that those scenes and flashbacks only make sense to be included in this Remake when all events of the "Compilation of Final Fantasy VII "really happened BEFORE the start of the Remake. Also we as audience know that Sephiroth was shown with wings for the first time in the last fight of the original game.

So: WHY should Cloud even SEE the falling black feather when he is not in any way aware of the meaning of the black feather? It would not make any sense to include this scene and other scenes into the game if their would be no meaning behind those scenes!

 

My guess is that it is up to us as audience if we like the "retold" story or not.  

 

 

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Posted (edited)

For me, especially with the original FF7 with repeated playthroughs over the decades (I've done about 6 play throughs from beginning to end in total)

 

I like Midgar but in the original FF7, until you leave Midgar the game is very linear indeed, you mostly only have the basic green materia and due to very low AP growth you're highly unlikely to even get Fire 2, Ice 2 etc.

 

I always felt like the game STARTED after you left midgar since you are free to roam the world map, finally choose your party members, gain access to summons, paired materia etc. Midgar is about 10% of the entire game. So of course I played this remake with excitement and also sadness that after it is all done, so much of the game and story is left to unfold, with 5 playable characters still missing from the agem and the final chapter of this game where things just go weird.

I'm honestly not sure how I feel about it.

 

So of course, they had to put Sephiroth in this remake, as in the original Sephiroth wasn't even mentioned until you left Midgar.

 

Until the final few chapters the game was very kind to tell you if by leaving an area you would forever lose a materia or miss some sub quests, but by the end of the game, I kept having to transfer materia and the game would pull dick moves by suddenly swapping in and out characters where they had no materia equipped and not allowing me to change them beforehand, a bit of warning beforehand would have been nice..

 

My feeling is that, a couple of weeks ago I played a playable demo and then the past few days I've played an exclusive teaser to the full game.

Edited by enaysoft
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I'm still trying to process the ending. Right now, I can say that I haven't been this disappointed since Mass Effect 3. Imagine being visited by your best childhood friend, spending a beautiful day with them, remembering all the good times – and at the end of the day, just as you're about to say goodbye, they pull out a gun and shoot you in the head. That's what the Remake feels like. The original FF VII is my favorite game of all time, so I'm going to make an effort to come to terms with what they've done here, but it's going to be pretty difficult. 😞

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