Yearly auto-updates are needed

[WakeUpHP]

On 9/23/2023 at 9:02 AM, DrBloodmoney said:

The site has come full circle with this stuff…

 

…for as long as I can remember, folks have dismissed the PSN Rarities as irrelevant, because they include non-trophy-hunters, and have almost unanimously held up the PSNP Rarities as the more “accurate” ones, due to the reduced sample size.

 

Now that the PSNP Rarities have actually reduced their sample size further - to literally only include active trophy hunters though…

… people are suddenly seeing virtually all rarities skyrocketing, and are requesting that they go back to including profiles that aren’t actively engaged with trophies, just to bring them back down?

The point is that it's completely inconsistent and makes the stats worthless.  If the site tracked only active users from the very beginning, then "UR" would probably be considered <10% or 15%  and we'd very rarely see anything <1%, but now we have two completely different metrics to measure old and new games. Even aside from this, it has nothing to do with people being active trophy hunters, rather active site users, and I'd be willing to bet that the former far outweighs the latter. 

 

This goes beyond rarities too, if you sort games by number of owners on PSNP, you won't a single game released in the last 2 (maybe 3) years in the top 200 games - this makes no sense from a statistical point of view: https://psnprofiles.com/games?order=owners.  It's just completely nonsensical that Baldur's Gate 3 only has 10k players or whatever FIFA calls itself now has only 6k.  I used to be able to immediately gauge the relative popularity of a game based off this metric, now I don't know what it means.

 

Also, people dismissed the PSN rarities because they include hackers, were it not for that they'd be viewed far more favourably.

Edited October 4, 2023 by WakeUpHP

[DrBloodmoney]

5 minutes ago, WakeUpHP said:

Also, people dismissed the PSN rarities because they include hackers, were it not for that they'd be viewed far more favourably.

 

That's true - though TBH, I'd argue that the statistical significance of trophy hackers is only really applicable to the smaller sample set provided by a site such as this one, which is catering to trophy-minded folks primarily. 

 

Among the smaller sample set provided by sites like this one, the contingent of trophy hackers is statistically significant, as virtually every trophy hacker will be on sites like this (since there's very little point to hacking trophies unless you care about those trophies)...

...but in the PSN stats, where even regular trophy hunters are an extreme minority, I'd argue the contingent of trophy hackers among that already small group is such a tiny fraction of the sample set, as to render it tantamount to a statistical zero.

[VoidVictorious]

Frankly, I would love to see a yearly update. Based on recent games I have played, I would have significantly more ultra rare trophies. However, since rarity is not my metric for playing games, I’ll survive either way. 

[sepheroithisgod]

2 hours ago, Shikotei-kun said:

You do realize the "recent players" is purely based on their recent trophy unlocks, right? For instance, I will never be on Nioh's recent player list now that I unlocked my last trophy for it. Even if I were still playing while not having earned every last trophy, I would only be shown in it if that last unlock happened fairly recently (a week or two, I think is the window).

Sure and that doesn't really change anything when we are talking about new releases, which is primarily what the top games of the week consist of (or games that just got DLC).

 

All I know is after this thread went up, the top weekly games list went from the most popular game having slightly over 2k players to now almost every game having that number with the top games being in the 4k range. Something definitely happened

[Shikotei-kun]

11 minutes ago, sepheroithisgod said:

All I know is after this thread went up, the top weekly games list went from the most popular game having slightly over 2k players to now almost every game having that number with the top games being in the 4k range. Something definitely happened

Like many statistics on PSNP, this one is calculated every once in a while. Maybe just once per day. I've never kept track of it. It's the same with trophy rarities, nr of recent players, nr of earners (though the leaderboard per game is almost always up to date).

 

Most numbers are "old" in that sense. If they were calculated live, it would put way too much stress on the site.

[WakeUpHP]

2 hours ago, DrBloodmoney said:

 

That's true - though TBH, I'd argue that the statistical significance of trophy hackers is only really applicable to the smaller sample set provided by a site such as this one, which is catering to trophy-minded folks primarily. 

 

Among the smaller sample set provided by sites like this one, the contingent of trophy hackers is statistically significant, as virtually every trophy hacker will be on sites like this (since there's very little point to hacking trophies unless you care about those trophies)...

...but in the PSN stats, where even regular trophy hunters are an extreme minority, I'd argue the contingent of trophy hackers among that already small group is such a tiny fraction of the sample set, as to render it tantamount to a statistical zero.

Logically you would expect this to be the case, but I think people underestimate just how numerous hackers are and how rampant hacking was on PS3 and expecially Vita.  I think trophies can be unlocked on Vita without even owning the game in question, so it's especially bad there. 

 

Without getting too technical, because I haven't done any real number crunching on this, PSN rarities tend to be around 3-6 times rarer than PSNP rarities eg Horizon ZD is 5% on PSN, 28.5% here; FFVIII is 7.5% on PSN, 31% here.  There are of course natural outliers attributable to various legitimate factors.  But then you have games Disgaea 3 vita, which goes from 2.7% on PSNP to 25.7% on PSN. UMvC3 Vita:  0.5% on here, but 2.5% on PSN, while the PS4 version is the opposite:  0.6% here but 0.1% on PSN.  This exact pattern repeats with with Injustice Vita & PS3/PS4.  These are just some examples, there are hundreds of these kind of cases on PS3 and Vita, so the hacking has definitely has taken its toll and it's certainly not negligeable .

 

Also I wouldn't make the assumption that all, or even most, hackers would necessarily have accounts on this site; they're a separate community with only limited overlap with the trophy scene.  Many of them are interested in modding from a technical standpoint, or a creative one, and the integrity of trophy leaderboards doesn't cross their minds.  Installing CFW on a Vita would be self-evident and they'd question why anyone would bother playing the Vita without it, from there hacked trophies are just a few button presses away.

[Jeanolt]

On 10/4/2023 at 9:15 AM, sepheroithisgod said:

All I know is after this thread went up, the top weekly games list went from the most popular game having slightly over 2k players to now almost every game having that number with the top games being in the 4k range. Something definitely happened

God listened!

[Crossfiyah8771]

Agreed completely with this.

 

I found out the site stopped updating trophies automatically last month and it actually killed my enthusiasm for trophy hunting.

 

Whats the point if the best site for this hobby isn't even well-maintained?

[ConAir]

I agree with this idea. 2 times a year is also fine, if this website can carry the temporary data increase. People might stop the active hunting Trophies, only buy a new part in their favorite game series or sports game, marry someone and get a few kids which limits their time to game or buy a different console or a PC, but that doesn't have to mean their profiles don't earn Trophies anymore. Please include those profiles known to this website, outside of the banned users.

 

The rarity will change but it will be a better reflection than the current one and the PSN one, where most users just play the game without looking at them.

[dertswa687o]

I agree that there needs to be some sort of update for all accounts. Whenever I look at the player count of new popular games, it always seems lower than I expect. There are 6 million "tracked" gamers on the site per the homepage and yet the low player counts make it feel like there are significantly less. All the while, trophy hunting and gaming in general is only becoming more and more popular. I know this would probably lower percentages throughout the site, but the percentages are already flawed since they're currently based on a subset of the total number of profiles on the site.

[Baker]

Rarities are so pointless. My opinion on this is that I couldn’t care less. And if people want to get tracked on this site they will update their own lists. 

 

Have I mentioned before that I wish that trophy rarities will be a thing of the past someday? And leaderboards too. I can only dream..

[Crossfiyah8771]

Any updates at all on this? 

[Jeanolt]

1 hour ago, Crossfiyah8771 said:

Any updates at all on this? 

I feel like the update system is working better, but obviously is far from reaching everyone. All of the most played games have high numbers compared to before I posted this, maybe Sly changed something.

[walafc0]

As much as I would like this to happen, that would never gonna happen. It's a reccuring discussion for years now and nothing has changed. We're all dependent on a single person, who, for I guess good reasons, doesn't seem to care that much about the community anymore, and for unknown reason(s), doesn't want to give they key of the castle to someone else.

[stpatty]

Am I missing something? My profile auto-updates.

[D-E-U-S-X]

52 minutes ago, stpatty said:

Am I missing something? My profile auto-updates.

Premium Members profiles auto-updating every 6 hours.

[stpatty]

58 minutes ago, D-E-U-S-X said:

Premium Members profiles auto-updating every 6 hours.

Don't non-premium accounts get updated weekly?

[OmegaRejectz]

9 minutes ago, stpatty said:

Don't non-premium accounts get updated weekly?

I think they *used* to. Because the update a profile says:

 

When do profiles update?

Premium Every 6 hours
Registered Every day
Unregistered Weekly

 

However, I think that's outdated and it no longer does to reduce strain.

[Eraezr]

For real. My recent rank ups feel superficial with how it jumps too much with each platinum.

[x7251]

Another trophy site updates the trophies for every user on the site about every 2 to 3 weeks. For example on PSNP Marvel's Spider Man 2 currently has 52,846 owners. The other site has 99,224 owners for Marvel's Spider Man 2. Somehow the other trophy site is able to get past the server strain updating over a million different PSN profiles every 2-3 weeks which PSNP seems to be unable to do. 

[Stevieboy]

10 minutes ago, x7251 said:

Somehow the other trophy site is able to get past the server strain updating over a million different PSN profiles every 2-3 weeks which PSNP seems to be unable to do. 

 

You do realise this site actually tracks over 6 million profiles. That's a significant amount more than the just over 1.1 million tacked on the other site.

Edited November 18, 2023 by Stevieboy

[Crossfiyah8771]

On 11/18/2023 at 10:46 AM, Stevieboy said:

 

You do realise this site actually tracks over 6 million profiles. That's a significant amount more than the just over 1.1 million tacked on the other site.

In terms of scaling a website I'm not convinced 1.1m and 6m are a meaningful difference when you're already operating at that scale.

 

Also nobody is saying this site needs to update every profile every week or however often the other site does.

 

We're just saying it shouldn't be, you know, NEVER.

Edited December 2, 2023 by Crossfiyah8771