Can You Opt Out of the Leaderboard?

[EqualityEarth]

I was happy to find PSNProfiles. It was great to discover a site that does it all. Not only does it track your trophies (like YaPSNApp), but it catalogs every game list ever (like PSNTrophyWiki), features fan guides (like playstationtrophies.com), and frontloads the burning questions (like GameFAQs). Lots of other little details all over that are all well put together. It’s an all-in-one.

 

That being said, there is a LOT of drama. I guess it comes with the territory, and I just haven’t been on the internet long enough to properly internalize. Not saying there ought not to be. The root of it is clearly being the leaderboard, something which seems to be in place “just because.” Sony, to my knowledge, didn’t bother to rank the players themselves. You could already tell how high you were above your friends, and even your common games would be conveniently grouped at the top and compared. The PSNP leaderboard enables a variety of issues to well up in the community, including crazy schisms and such about whose trophies are legitimate or not, and what portions of the Sony ToS are to enforced by PSNP (which is already not 100%). All the while being ironically redundant. I was dumbfounded to find that no agreement was reached about PSVITA CFW or independent online servers after hundreds of people posting. That is downright embarrassing.

Apparently there have been a lot of cheaters. How, and what lengths they went to, I don’t know. I also don’t care. I’m not friends with them. It goes without saying that someone who has their trophies artificially already isn’t worth comparing with, and likely wouldn’t be any help to you in any given game. I would neither message them nor message back. It makes one wonder why they have a profile or engage with the consoles in the first place. This resulting ostracism is natural, and given the spread of word, a bad reputation is sufficient incentive to play by rules without a leaderboard to be removed from. Does it do more than make people jealous? At least it lets some of them be cyber police.

It’s troublesome that you’d be lumped in with the crazy users (hack-every-trophy-they-sync), if you utilize any CFW or program to make consoles connect to independent servers, allow the PS VITA to use foreign region content on your own account, or pirate games that are delisted (and there’s no one you know to gameshare and no physical disc to buy), or unlock trophies that (due to a glitch) resist their actual conditions whether for everyone or certain regions (examples aplenty like hyperballoid, color zen, locks quest, conarium). First world problems, obviously. Gamers have issues and as time marches on, solutions present themselves by the sweat of another’s brow. It’s ok to not want to settle for sub 100% if that’s not what you're aiming for.

No one is waiting for a server shutdown to justify hacking that game’s online trophies. No one is waiting for a game to be delisted to justify pirating it. That point should be straight and hard to misinterpret.

 

For a site that supports gamers, a lot of solutions to problems are converted back into problems due to the (insofar automatic) inclusion in the leaderboard. Instead of being added automatically upon registering, and being cancelled for a violation, it could instead be a reward to be added after registration for being a compliant, complacent, pure user of absolute integrity, without a rebellious bone in your body. It’s already an elitist club, some of us wish we could be on the site as an individual without automatically being in that club. The trophy value ranking is really lost as it is (this is Sony’s fault, not PSNP), as you can amass multiple platinum trophies through PS4 digital shovelware in laughably short times (<1 hour) while any given game from the PS3 library could take much longer to complete, be a better game in general, and be worth much less in trophy points, even if completed 100%. These issues were all so far external to the leaderboard, but they don’t even stop there.

To put this in perspective, at the time of this post, I’m level 21. That’s kinda low if you ask me, but somehow the leaderboard puts me in the 97th percentile due to a fat (and I mean FAT) bottom layer of profiles each with a single bronze trophy. Tell me with a straight face that is not inflation, and while you’re at it, explain why there is no minimum gamerscore prior to being tracked. All in all, I feel it’s kinda bonkers how it is taken so seriously, yet also not so seriously at the same time.

 

You could say this whole rant is all about rolling my eyes at some future when I start certain games and then adverse things I’ve learned will happen. And you would be right. I swear I’ll get a scolding message from a purple title user the very day I start either a VITA game or a delisted game.

 

“If you don’t like it then leave” is the sort of  reply I mostly likely anticipate, though disheartening. I guess I could settle for YaPSNApp. There’s no doubt a website like this is loads of work to create and maintain, participation is solely by the grace of others, and fairness is a laudable value. I never said the leaderboard should be dissolved, but it would be nice for it be an optional, conditional registration, for those who’d prefer to not be bugged, reported, shot down, and cancelled by other users. People speak their minds here, I’ll do no less. I guess it’s too lofty to think of a network where if you think someone is unfair with their trophies, you should just unfriend them. The real enemies of the players were those hacking the whole PSN and breaching the security for account/financial information.

[thefourfoldroot]

Very few people care about leaderboards so relax. The biggest issue with them is that player profiles are not automatically updated anymore, making them completely inaccurate.

If anyone bullies anyone about anything there are moderators for that.

I like the leaderboards without having any desire to rise to the top or think they are overly important.

Honestly though, it just seems like you want to do things that are flagged as suspicious without getting looked at or judged for it. 

[Juzota]

There's a leaderboard? And people care about it?

[Rally-Vincent---]

I would like the leaderboard to be opt-in, not mandatory or opt out. Only shove in there who really wants to. I doubt something's going to change, though. The leaderboard obviously draws in many people. There is a not so small percentage that want to feel - let's call it competitive. From the website's perspective, I guess it would be bad business to allow people not to be in the leaderboard without hiding their profile. It's unfortunate.

[EqualityEarth]

1 minute ago, thefourfoldroot said:

Very few people care about leaderboards so relax. The biggest issue with them is that player profiles are not automatically updated anymore, making them completely inaccurate.

If anyone bullies anyone about anything there are moderators for that.

I like the leaderboards without having any desire to rise to the top or think they are overly important.

Honestly though, it just seems like you want to do things that are flagged as suspicious without getting looked at or judged for it. 

You are exactly very right. I’ve set out an ambition that is rather beyond the scope of what they consider fair. Maybe I show excessive paranoia? Or I’m overestimating how big of a deal things are. My local PSN friend doesn’t even think twice about half his games’ trophies so there he is. Gosh if only I was more like him.

[BadRep24]

I never cared about the leaderboards, since it's a metric that I wouldn't care in the long run. But like thefourfoldroot says, don't take leaderboards way too seriously, unless if you're Hakoom or the rest, who actually liked to be on the leaderboard and wanted their capstone of achievements to be shown. Back on topic, I only matter leaderboards if it's for competitive purposes, which I don't play games for that reason like leaderboards or eSports, and it is reflected on my inclination to the Single-Player genre.

Edited July 18, 2020 by BadRep24

[pinkrobot_pb]

What you should consider though is that some of what you are talking about is not only frowned upon by leaderboard fanatics but by Sony as well. CFW is definitely a no-no as far as they are concerned. Even if you only use it for a cause you consider harmless (popping an otherwise unobtainable trophy) they will definitely feel otherwise.

Edited July 18, 2020 by pinkrobot_pb

[AJ_Radio]

The fact that people are getting a little butthurt and judgemental about the leaderboards here in general really speaks out for how I've been feeling about this website for the past couple of years.

 

I made a thread back in March last year regarding the leaderboards and your ranking. I essentially called your 'ranking means nothing' which was the title of the thread.... and people freaked out about it. As a matter of fact a couple people who have posted on this thread thus far jumped on me because of the way I looked at trophies from my own perspective.

 

So because I feel the leaderboards don't mean much as a whole, meant that people were allowed to just jump on my ass for speaking about it? I think people got the assumption that I was talking about their trophy profile meaning nothing, when I actually meant the leaderboards itself and where you were listed on it.

 

Truthfully very few of us who trophy hunt actively care little if at all about the leaderboards. I still believe a number of us take trophy hunting far too seriously, and if you're somebody who feels that way I think it's probably best you take a break from it for a while.

 

I don't know if you can opt out of the leaderboard voluntarily. If you are flagged for a game then you are removed from the leaderboards and you have to hide that game from your trophy profile if you want to be reinstated.

[BadRep24]

6 minutes ago, Spaz said:

 

I made a thread back in March last year regarding the leaderboards and your ranking. I essentially called your 'ranking means nothing' which was the title of the thread.... and people freaked out about it. As a matter of fact a couple people who have posted on this thread thus far jumped on me because of the way I looked at trophies from my own perspective.

Pretty much sums up the rationale of my previous response in this thread. Leaderboards and ranking meant nothing, unless if you're a trophy hunter for competitive purposes, but that's another topic for another day. I don't understand why some people are often butthurt, when someone throws a different opinion about leaderboards and ranking, as a whole. I digress, I suppose.

Edited July 18, 2020 by BadRep24

[Omni_Vocal]

why care when most can create a profile spend like $100 on ratas stack the milk out of it and go im level 40 in 30days 

\\

look how silly my profile is now more gold trophies then silver or bronze its pointless .
cant call yourself a gamer if you follow videos of others work but some will go im a gamer ... 

its all EGO 

[TheRealHardyBoy1]

1 hour ago, EqualityEarth said:

Can You Opt Out of the Leaderboard?

 

Just hack a game to get removed from the leaderboard. /s

[euantp_]

There's always been a bunch of crazies on this site who have hugely inflated egos and can't correctly communicate without rude and aggressive language; a few of whom are staff members (no names named). I just purely use the site to track and use the guides, which are great and are usually created by excellent members of the community. It's a shame the forums on this site have become a policed state but eh.

[RoastedPeanut]

"I swear I’ll get a scolding message from a purple title user the very day I start either a VITA game or a delisted game" 

 

Can someone fill be in on something. Its not the first time I've seen someone mention the Vita in a similar way. What's the go with people playing Vita games and being scolded?

[BadRep24]

5 minutes ago, SnowStorm said:

Can someone fill be in on something. Its not the first time I've seen someone mention the Vita in a similar way. What's the go with people playing Vita games and being scolded?

I dunno, because Vita is known to be, for the most part, a CFW territory, I suppose. It's pretty much sullied, for the most part, I suppose. However, the reasons are more complicated than that, I suppose.

Edited July 18, 2020 by BadRep24

[RoastedPeanut]

3 minutes ago, BadRep24 said:

I dunno, because Vita is known to be, for the most part, a CFW territory, I suppose. It's pretty much sullied, for the most part, I suppose. However, the reasons are more complicated than that, I suppose.

Well that sucks

[PatinumNumemon]

1 minute ago, BadRep24 said:

I dunno, because Vita is known to be, for the most part, a CFW territory, I suppose. It's pretty much sullied, for the most part, I suppose.

 

Well that sucks. I just want a Vita so I can grab the platinums for the Jak & Daxter games, the God of War games, and a few others. There's not a lot of games on the Vita that seem interesting. 

[EqualityEarth]

5 minutes ago, Omni_Vocal said:

why care when most can create a profile spend like $100 on ratas stack the milk out of it and go im level 40 in 30days 

\\

look how silly my profile is now more gold trophies then silver or bronze its pointless .
cant call yourself a gamer if you follow videos of others work but some will go im a gamer ... 

its all EGO 

True dat. It is already a backwards situation. You could say 1000 Ratalaika platinums wouldn’t weigh against the elusive, glitched, and D/C’d ones.

 

3 minutes ago, TheRealHardyBoy1 said:

 

Just hack a game to get removed from the leaderboard. /s

I know right? Just rip the band-aid off. Someone will eventually wonder how i got a hold of Scott Pilgrim after starting in 2014, or Ciel Nosurge along with its DLC download. The list of “trouble games” I’m basically putting off until further notice goes on for days. I was shocked to find just how many PS3 games are unavailable (not really assuming they’re all amazing or anything) and just how impossible it was to use the VITA like any other console (I thought I was a genius attempting to just  transfer EU games from the PS3...thinking it would work...to be stopped in my tracks ? Everyone and their mom has already tried that and failed)

[DaivRules]

The leaderboards are entirely ignorable, and you can choose do do so any time you want. As you already said, there are plenty of other things here worth your attention. 

[BadRep24]

1 hour ago, PatinumNumemon said:

 

Well that sucks. I just want a Vita so I can grab the platinums for the Jak & Daxter games, the God of War games, and a few others. There's not a lot of games on the Vita that seem interesting. 

You can still play Vita games the normal way, I suppose. Just don't tread into the dangerous waters of CFW, especially if you care about leaderboards. I can assume you don't care 'bout them, I suppose.

[Eagle]

I mean, if you really don't care about the leaderboards and what people are gonna tell you, you can just do whatever you're trying to do, y'know? Seems kinda weird to make a whole thread discussing why you don't care about the leaderboards while not doing certain things so you can continue on the leaderboards.

[Xylobe]

3 hours ago, EqualityEarth said:

It’s troublesome that you’d be lumped in with the crazy users (hack-every-trophy-they-sync), if you utilize any CFW or program to make consoles connect to independent servers, allow the PS VITA to use foreign region content on your own account, or pirate games that are delisted (and there’s no one you know to gameshare and no physical disc to buy), or unlock trophies that (due to a glitch) resist their actual conditions whether for everyone or certain regions (examples aplenty like hyperballoid, color zen, locks quest, conarium).

 

I'm not sure I understand why you draw this distinction-- except for delisted games, which anyone could have purchased while they were available, you're still ultimately using CFW to unlock a trophy that a player on an unmodified system can't. Even then, from what I can tell things like foreign region digital content seem to be A-OK.

 

In general I get where you're coming from, and I agree that elitism is a common issue in this community, but I question how much of it stems from the leaderboard. I feel like I most often see people who care about other (equally arbitrary) metrics like overall completion % or number of ultra rare trophies complaining about things like ratalaika games, or trophy stacks, or in your own words "trophy value."

 

3 hours ago, EqualityEarth said:

I swear I’ll get a scolding message from a purple title user the very day I start either a VITA game or a delisted game.

 

This won't happen. I use my Vita regularly, and to make things worse I often play in airplane mode until I finish the game's trophies so the list syncs all at once, and the only person on this site to ever try and accuse me of cheating did so in response to a comment I made about Demon's Souls being easier than the Dark Souls games. Even if you do use CFW to get some trophies illegitimately, I don't think the flagging process involves much scolding.

[ProfBambam55]

34 minutes ago, BRKs_Eagle said:

Seems kinda weird to make a whole thread discussing why you don't care about the leaderboards while not doing certain things so you can continue on the leaderboards.

I agree with this and how the premise of this thread is odd...if you really want to play games that violate the lb rules, just play them...then you won't have to worry about opting out...the site mods will remove you and you can still use all the other great features psnp has to offer...you'll have the added bonus of not having to worry about being the target of elitism since no one but you will be able to browse your trophy profile...

[Otonio_Bruno]

Hum...this thread as whole really doesn't sit well with me. There are so many wrong concepts about the leaderboard and the competitive nature of it that I can't help myself and need explain to some of these:

 

2 hours ago, EqualityEarth said:

That being said, there is a LOT of drama. I guess it comes with the territory, and I just haven’t been on the internet long enough to properly internalize. Not saying there ought not to be. The root of it is clearly being the leaderboard, something which seems to be in place “just because.” Sony, to my knowledge, didn’t bother to rank the players themselves.

 

Trophy hunting is a hobby. And as any hobby, it always give rise to competitiveness in any community that it helps to grow. This is no exception. Leaderboards aren't in place "just because", they are in place because the hobby itself demands it. Gaming itself has always been a competitive hobby, ever since the old days of the arcades, you'd race to get the top scores in the arcade machine of your favorite game. And this is still present in many games with their own leaderboards. So, leaderboards in trophy-hunting focused website is a natural extension of that.

 

2 hours ago, EqualityEarth said:

It’s troublesome that you’d be lumped in with the crazy users (hack-every-trophy-they-sync), if you utilize any CFW or program to make consoles connect to independent servers, allow the PS VITA to use foreign region content on your own account, or pirate games that are delisted (and there’s no one you know to gameshare and no physical disc to buy), or unlock trophies that (due to a glitch) resist their actual conditions whether for everyone or certain regions (examples aplenty like hyperballoid, color zen, locks quest, conarium). First world problems, obviously. Gamers have issues and as time marches on, solutions present themselves by the sweat of another’s brow. It’s ok to not want to settle for sub 100% if that’s not what you're aiming for.

 

No, it's not troublesome. There must be rules and standards if you wish to have any kind of leaderboards that promote fairness between all players. And these rules are laid out very clearly. Obtaining trophies in independent servers that replicate the same environment of the original servers might be given a green thumb from team handling the flag reports, in other cases you might have independent servers that can unlock all your trophies within a press of a button/command and that is clearly not fair in a competitive environment. Unlocking 'UNOBTAINABLES' that may be due to glitches/server closures through use of CFW is outright against the rules, "common sense" should apply here: If the trophy is unobtainable, it is UNOBTAINABLE, as in you can't obtain it through legit means.

 

So, if you wish to display a profile with trophies gotten through those ways, it's your right to do. You can't just expect that people won't raise eyebrows to it because they always will, own what you do, even if it's something silly like obtaining digital trinkets in virtual profile. If you're that concerned about other people's opinion about your profile then the issue is elsewhere.

 

Quote

For a site that supports gamers, a lot of solutions to problems are converted back into problems due to the (insofar automatic) inclusion in the leaderboard. Instead of being added automatically upon registering, and being cancelled for a violation, it could instead be a reward to be added after registration for being a compliant, complacent, pure user of absolute integrity, without a rebellious bone in your body. It’s already an elitist club, some of us wish we could be on the site as an individual without automatically being in that club. The trophy value ranking is really lost as it is (this is Sony’s fault, not PSNP), as you can amass multiple platinum trophies through PS4 digital shovelware in laughably short times (<1 hour) while any given game from the PS3 library could take much longer to complete, be a better game in general, and be worth much less in trophy points, even if completed 100%. These issues were all so far external to the leaderboard, but they don’t even stop there.

 

The leaderboards does not only compass the comparision between who has the most PSN point, who has less points and all those in between. It also encompasses the first achievers, the fastest achievers, rarity numbers and so on. The 'metagame' is plenty varied and hacking a single bronze trophy might be insignificant in term of number of points, but it may influence a lot all those other stats that are also part of the leaderboards.

 

3 hours ago, thefourfoldroot said:

Very few people care about leaderboards so relax. The biggest issue with them is that player profiles are not automatically updated anymore, making them completely inaccurate.

If anyone bullies anyone about anything there are moderators for that.

I like the leaderboards without having any desire to rise to the top or think they are overly important.

Honestly though, it just seems like you want to do things that are flagged as suspicious without getting looked at or judged for it. 

 

Boldened: Not true. Many may not care what position they stand in the leaderboards, but they do care about being in them. Else you wouldn't have new disputes everyday.

Italic: Very true, that is a big issue.

Underlined: Exactly the moderators are around for. Don't be afraid to press that report button if you feel being harassed.

 

3 hours ago, Juzota said:

There's a leaderboard? And people care about it?

 

Yes, people care about it. You may not, but there are enough people who care about it that is relevant enough to stay.

 

3 hours ago, Rally-Vincent--- said:

I would like the leaderboard to be opt-in, not mandatory or opt out. Only shove in there who really wants to. I doubt something's going to change, though. The leaderboard obviously draws in many people. There is a not so small percentage that want to feel - let's call it competitive. From the website's perspective, I guess it would be bad business to allow people not to be in the leaderboard without hiding their profile. It's unfortunate.

 

That would skew a lot of game rarities here in PSNProfiles. Opt-out is fine, that wouldn't affect much. Opt-in though would severely damage the accuracy of many stats.

 

2 hours ago, EqualityEarth said:

True dat. It is already a backwards situation. You could say 1000 Ratalaika platinums wouldn’t weigh against the elusive, glitched, and D/C’d ones.

 

I know right? Just rip the band-aid off. Someone will eventually wonder how i got a hold of Scott Pilgrim after starting in 2014, or Ciel Nosurge along with its DLC download. The list of “trouble games” I’m basically putting off until further notice goes on for days.

 

Already commented on above. Points don't mean everything in leaderboards.

[Dr_Mayus]

It has been stated many times in the past but let me say it one more time. 

 

The only way your trophy list means anything is if you have both the Tony Hawk RIDE and Tony Hawk SHRED platinums.

 

If you don't have both then it doesn't matter how many other platinums you have ?

[EqualityEarth]

6 hours ago, Gamehelp said:

What's stopping you from hiding your trophy list on PlayStation then updating your profile on psnprofiles?

You'll be removed from the leaderboards eventually (within 24 hrs), and you can make your trophies/profile public again whenever you want to "opt-in", again.

If this solution doesn't fit your needs, then I don't understand why you'd want to be off the leaderboards on psnprofiles, but retain a public profile on PlayStation?

Alternatively you could just ignore the arbitrary number that means absolutely nothing?  lol.

I hear ya, and at first I wasn’t sure how to answer these questions, I just assumed they would be my firstmost or secondmost self explanatory points. I will attempt anyway. Hiding would defeat my personal aims; unfortunately you cannot partition what you want to hide, as PSNP simply mirrors what you hide on PSN/SEN, instead of hiding what they disqualify. If you hide every game, PSNP loses its primary utility. If PSNP simply auto-hid games from other players/subtracted red flag trophies that didn’t qualify for counting in the leaderboard, and left the rest of the profile as is....this thread would not exist in the first place. If it wasn’t obvious, my issues were with 2 things: perceiving whether Sony ToS compliance is part of a package deal with PSNP, and how much the condition for leaving the leaderboard unfortunately relieves you of all the other site features (I’ll never forget who messaged me for help because they saw me as a recent player of their trouble game). Hackers would stay low rank with auto-hiding no matter how far they take it, and the integrity of the leaderboard would be maintained, despite everyone still being on it (like an adblocker only letting you access sites that don’t have ads in the first place). I never intended to redefine what is cheating. All the reasons a game is flagged for are all understandable; what I had to reconcile was that while PSNP explicitly states being unaffiliated with SEN, it nevertheless behaves like it is. Like I mentioned earlier, YaPSNApp puts you on a leaderboard as well—but just with your friends. If they disagree with what you have, they can unfriend you without there being police on a gaming network.

 

Anyhoo, I thank you all for your responses ?. I read them all and they helped me size up the situation I’ll be in for the future. My rank is definitely the one thing I could go without, but as I’ve heard, it will come off in time, and I don’t even necessarily have to reply to the CRT/mod members. They themselves are already quite divided from what I’ve read. They will do their thing and I will do mine.