National Football League Thread

[PerryToxteth]

On 2/10/2017 at 6:44 PM, skidmarkgn said:

I'd rather they look to sign a LT in free agency and just stick with what they have.  Let the guys have a couple years of working together and they will improve.  Keep shuffling, trading, and cutting and no cohesion will ever develop, and they will keep falling apart.  Also, college is such a different style that the O-lineman that do make it to the NFL almost always have to start from scratch and learn the NFL style.  Despite all my O-line bitching through the year, if they drafted a big, physical receiver, a big, physical corner, and some secondary depth, I'd personally be happy.

 

Most MN fans felt the same way last year. And then the Vikings drafted Laquon Treadwell...

[Conker]

New York Giants are reportedly going to part ways with WR Victor Cruz http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/02/13/giants-will-part-ways-with-victor-cruz/

 

if he can can stay healthy and return to the form he showed when he entered the league, then this I could see being a good pickup for teams

[WorldsBestSpy]

2 minutes ago, Rocko said:

New York Giants are reportedly going to part ways with WR Victor Cruz http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2017/02/13/giants-will-part-ways-with-victor-cruz/

 

if he can can stay healthy and return to the form he showed when he entered the league, then this I could see being a good pickup for teams

My brother wont like that news.

 

Hey, the Ravens could pick him up if we don't go after Pierre Garcon. Unlikely, though. Maybe... the Eagles?

[Conker]

Well well, well, looks like Vince Young is attempting a comeback http://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/18694252/vince-young-hires-agent-leigh-steinberg-eye-comeback

[WorldsBestSpy]

8 hours ago, Rocko said:

Well well, well, looks like Vince Young is attempting a comeback http://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/18694252/vince-young-hires-agent-leigh-steinberg-eye-comeback

Just like his buddy Jamarcus Russell.

[dmsleight]

Oh TO...  A 43 year old who is still completely unable to see past himself.  Statistically, he belongs in the HOF.  But it should speak volumes that teams you play for hate you more than rivals.  Should he be in the HOF? I really don't care, but I think its right to give pause to putting in a team cancer.

[Conker]

6 minutes ago, dmsleight said:

Oh TO...  A 43 year old who is still completely unable to see past himself.  Statistically, he belongs in the HOF.  But it should speak volumes that teams you play for hate you more than rivals.  Should he be in the HOF? I really don't care, but I think its right to give pause to putting in a team cancer.

Will him not getting in effect Randy Moss? Since both were sort of Same on the field.

 

personally I hope it doesn't effect him, though I'd love to see both in Hof 

[starcrunch061]

On 2/16/2017 at 1:25 AM, Rocko said:

Well well, well, looks like Vince Young is attempting a comeback http://www.espn.com/college-football/story/_/id/18694252/vince-young-hires-agent-leigh-steinberg-eye-comeback

 

I'm surprised he didn't try earlier, when he went bankrupt. 

[acasser]

4 hours ago, Rocko said:

Will him not getting in effect Randy Moss? Since both were sort of Same on the field.

 

personally I hope it doesn't effect him, though I'd love to see both in Hof 

 

Terrell Owens is in a realm unto himself when it comes to being considered a douche by his own fan bases and by the media.  Not that there aren't plenty of divas and jerks who played Wide Receiver, not that there aren't plenty of those guys who played Wide Receiver and put up terrific numbers, but Owens took it to a whole 'nother level.

 

And personally?  I discount some of the massive receiving numbers put up by guys like Terrell Owens because of how the game has changed in the last two decades.  Yes, he's near the top of a bunch of leaderboards, but it's far easier to put up those numbers these days.  Not just the pass-happy offenses, but the rules changes that make it so much more difficult to play defense on these guys.

 

Owens would have you believe he's one of the handful of greatest receivers of all time.  I don't think he's worthy to carry the jock strap of some of the great receivers.  He belongs in the Hall of Fame.... someday.... but let him wait and stew for a while.  And the "sports media" would be doing us all a service if they'd simply not stick a camera and microphone in his face.  Not only would I be happier not having to listen to his self-pity act, but I think he'd do himself (and his HoF chances) a significant service if he'd simply shut up and not have this whining splashed all over every outlet.

[WorldsBestSpy]

So , what do you guys think will happen to Darrelle Revis with the ''crime'' he was charged with? 

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2693442-darrelle-revis-allegedly-involved-in-altercation-in-pittsburgh

 

[Conker]

17 minutes ago, WorldsBestSpy said:

So , what do you guys think will happen to Darrelle Revis with the ''crime'' he was charged with? 

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2693442-darrelle-revis-allegedly-involved-in-altercation-in-pittsburgh

 

This could very well finish his career,  imo

[acasser]

3 hours ago, WorldsBestSpy said:

So , what do you guys think will happen to Darrelle Revis with the ''crime'' he was charged with? 

 

http://bleacherreport.com/articles/2693442-darrelle-revis-allegedly-involved-in-altercation-in-pittsburgh

 

 

It gives the Jets another excuse to cut him at the start of next month when his roster bonus would be due.  They're still stuck with dead money -- his contract has $6 million guaranteed next season -- but this probably puts to bed any possibility that he re-negotiates his cap number down and hangs around as an elder statesman switching to safety, at least in Jersey.

 

It also makes it increasingly unlikely that another team picks him up once the Jets waive him.  While I don't want to judge until all the facts come out, I suspect that this will further tarnish his character even before the League starts looking into the issue and perhaps issues supplementary discipline.

[Conker]

http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/18727495/jacksonville-jaguars-trade-tight-end-julius-thomas-miami-dolphins

 

The jacksonville Jaguars have traded Tight End Julius Thomas to the Miami Dolphins. this is a big move for the Dolphins since this season just gone they had one of the top 5 worst prdoductions from tight ends in the league and for Thomas he get's to reunite with his former OC when he was in Denver.

 

 

Edited February 21, 2017 by Rocko

[Conker]

Today the NFL announced the 2 teams for the HOF game, which are the Dallas Cowboys and Arizona Cardinals. Lets hope this time it actually is played a not a complete fuck up like last seasons game was when it was cancelled due to paint they had used

[Lithium_Lemon]

On 2/17/2017 at 9:39 AM, acasser said:

 

Terrell Owens is in a realm unto himself when it comes to being considered a douche by his own fan bases and by the media.  Not that there aren't plenty of divas and jerks who played Wide Receiver, not that there aren't plenty of those guys who played Wide Receiver and put up terrific numbers, but Owens took it to a whole 'nother level.

 

And personally?  I discount some of the massive receiving numbers put up by guys like Terrell Owens because of how the game has changed in the last two decades.  Yes, he's near the top of a bunch of leaderboards, but it's far easier to put up those numbers these days.  Not just the pass-happy offenses, but the rules changes that make it so much more difficult to play defense on these guys.

 

Owens would have you believe he's one of the handful of greatest receivers of all time.  I don't think he's worthy to carry the jock strap of some of the great receivers.  He belongs in the Hall of Fame.... someday.... but let him wait and stew for a while.  And the "sports media" would be doing us all a service if they'd simply not stick a camera and microphone in his face.  Not only would I be happier not having to listen to his self-pity act, but I think he'd do himself (and his HoF chances) a significant service if he'd simply shut up and not have this whining splashed all over every outlet.

I respectfully disagree with you, he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame right now. There is no way in hell that Terell Davis, who played 7 seasons in the NFL deserved to get in the Hall over a guy like Terell Owens. Davis is a borderline Hall of Famer in any capacity, much less over T.O. Everyone who talks about T.O acts like he was some diva who complained about everything. Yeah, he did lose his temper and went completely out of line in some circumstances, yet those same people forget to mention he was the only guy who actually showed up for the Eagles in the Superbowl and did so with a broken leg I might add. Next, you say there are plenty of guys who both divas and jerks who put up "Terell Owens numbers"? I want to know someone who you classify as a diva and jerk who put up 1,000 catches, 16,000 yards, and 150 touchdowns. You can look as much as you want, you will never find a guy even close to those numbers. Then you say you discount the pass numbers because of rule changes. I know where you going here, but when T.O was in his hay day, there was still a relatively large amount of contact allowed in terms of being physical with the receiver and lesser restrictions on how defensive players could hit offensive players. Finally, you say his numbers are discounted because of a pass happy league. Now while this is a good point, I also assume you are docking stats from Rice, Moss, Bruce, Gonzalez, Brown, Smith, Harrison, Fitzgerald, Wayne, Johnson, Lofton, Carter, Holt, etc an even amount as you are for T.O. Where does the stat docking end? The fact of the matter is T.O showed up to play and he did his job extraordinarily well. Did he ever say he "plays when he wants to" like Moss? Did he ever smother his gloves with stickum like Rice? Now while I don't believe T.O is better than either of those two guys, you cannot convince me he is not a top 5 receiver of all time. If you are fine with a top 5 player at their position being left "to stew" outside of the Hall for years that is your choice. The stats speak for themselves, this whole thing only proves that getting into the Hall is nothing but a popularity contest. 

[WorldsBestSpy]

2 hours ago, Lithium_Lemon said:

I respectfully disagree with you, he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame right now. There is no way in hell that Terell Davis, who played 7 seasons in the NFL deserved to get in the Hall over a guy like Terell Owens. Davis is a borderline Hall of Famer in any capacity, much less over T.O. Everyone who talks about T.O acts like he was some diva who complained about everything. Yeah, he did lose his temper and went completely out of line in some circumstances, yet those same people forget to mention he was the only guy who actually showed up for the Eagles in the Superbowl and did so with a broken leg I might add. Next, you say there are plenty of guys who both divas and jerks who put up "Terell Owens numbers"? I want to know someone who you classify as a diva and jerk who put up 1,000 catches, 16,000 yards, and 150 touchdowns. You can look as much as you want, you will never find a guy even close to those numbers. Then you say you discount the pass numbers because of rule changes. I know where you going here, but when T.O was in his hay day, there was still a relatively large amount of contact allowed in terms of being physical with the receiver and lesser restrictions on how defensive players could hit offensive players. Finally, you say his numbers are discounted because of a pass happy league. Now while this is a good point, I also assume you are docking stats from Rice, Moss, Bruce, Gonzalez, Brown, Smith, Harrison, Fitzgerald, Wayne, Johnson, Lofton, Carter, Holt, etc an even amount as you are for T.O. Where does the stat docking end? The fact of the matter is T.O showed up to play and he did his job extraordinarily well. Did he ever say he "plays when he wants to" like Moss? Did he ever smother his gloves with stickum like Rice? Now while I don't believe T.O is better than either of those two guys, you cannot convince me he is not a top 5 receiver of all time. If you are fine with a top 5 player at their position being left "to stew" outside of the Hall for years that is your choice. The stats speak for themselves, this whole thing only proves that getting into the Hall is nothing but a popularity contest. 

This so much. I agree. If T.O doesn't go in next year, the HOF has some serious problems. Terrell Davis was good but was never the HOF RB he could have been.

[Conker]

Well the Falcons Mohamed Sanu now has another reason they lost the Superbowl http://www.cbssports.com/nfl/news/falcons-player-says-lady-gaga-halftime-show-contributed-to-super-bowl-meltdown/

 

eventhough they did score first in 2nd half, and were still dominating, the facts are sanu you blew it. Do go around  giving weak reasons to why you lost the game 

Edited February 25, 2017 by Rocko

[acasser]

On 2/23/2017 at 9:54 PM, Lithium_Lemon said:

I respectfully disagree with you, he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame right now. There is no way in hell that Terell Davis, who played 7 seasons in the NFL deserved to get in the Hall over a guy like Terell Owens. Davis is a borderline Hall of Famer in any capacity, much less over T.O. Everyone who talks about T.O acts like he was some diva who complained about everything. Yeah, he did lose his temper and went completely out of line in some circumstances, yet those same people forget to mention he was the only guy who actually showed up for the Eagles in the Superbowl and did so with a broken leg I might add. Next, you say there are plenty of guys who both divas and jerks who put up "Terell Owens numbers"? I want to know someone who you classify as a diva and jerk who put up 1,000 catches, 16,000 yards, and 150 touchdowns. You can look as much as you want, you will never find a guy even close to those numbers. Then you say you discount the pass numbers because of rule changes. I know where you going here, but when T.O was in his hay day, there was still a relatively large amount of contact allowed in terms of being physical with the receiver and lesser restrictions on how defensive players could hit offensive players. Finally, you say his numbers are discounted because of a pass happy league. Now while this is a good point, I also assume you are docking stats from Rice, Moss, Bruce, Gonzalez, Brown, Smith, Harrison, Fitzgerald, Wayne, Johnson, Lofton, Carter, Holt, etc an even amount as you are for T.O. Where does the stat docking end? The fact of the matter is T.O showed up to play and he did his job extraordinarily well. Did he ever say he "plays when he wants to" like Moss? Did he ever smother his gloves with stickum like Rice? Now while I don't believe T.O is better than either of those two guys, you cannot convince me he is not a top 5 receiver of all time. If you are fine with a top 5 player at their position being left "to stew" outside of the Hall for years that is your choice. The stats speak for themselves, this whole thing only proves that getting into the Hall is nothing but a popularity contest. 

 

Did I ever say that Terrell Davis was a worthy HOFer?  Or that he was "more deserving" than T.O.?  I don't recall having done so, but perhaps I did way back when and I just can't find the reference.

 

If I were going to make a change to the enshrinment of players in the Hall of Fame, the first thing I'd do is spend several years inducting guys solely from positions that are substantially under-represented in the Hall.  Similar to voting on things like Most Valuable Player, there's a significant bias towards "glory" and "skill" positions and not nearly enough attention paid to the grunts sweating away in the trenches helping to make it all possible.  Or, heaven forfend, kickers and punters and other special teams types that are a meaningful part of the game while it's being played but somewhat ignored once it's done.  It's not particualrly glamorous, but until they legislate those positions out of the game there ought to be some recognition.

 

Then you criticize my take on Terrell Owens' numbers and distort it into my having made a statement that "plenty of guys who put up Terrell Owens numbers" when that's not what I said.  What I said is that it's significantly easier to put up gonzo passing/receiving numbers these days and it is for a whole host of reasons.  I'm not going to demerit Owens when compared to the whole list of players that you put out there, because many of them were his contemporaries and had the same advantages and disadvantages he did.  I just have my doubts that Terrell Owens could have put up those numbers in eras where it wasn't so friendly to the passing game and Wide Receivers.... say if he played in an era where a Defensive Back could lay out a receiver without getting suspended for the next week.

 

You've made a lot of assumptions about what I said and what I think, and mostly without any evidence to back yourself up.  You know what they say about assumptions:  you make a donkey out of yourself when you do.  Please:  ask me what I think instead of putting words into my mouth as to set up the strawman you want to knock down.

[dmsleight]

On 2/24/2017 at 5:54 AM, Lithium_Lemon said:

I respectfully disagree with you, he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame right now. There is no way in hell that Terell Davis, who played 7 seasons in the NFL deserved to get in the Hall over a guy like Terell Owens. Davis is a borderline Hall of Famer in any capacity, much less over T.O. Everyone who talks about T.O acts like he was some diva who complained about everything. Yeah, he did lose his temper and went completely out of line in some circumstances, yet those same people forget to mention he was the only guy who actually showed up for the Eagles in the Superbowl and did so with a broken leg I might add. Next, you say there are plenty of guys who both divas and jerks who put up "Terell Owens numbers"? I want to know someone who you classify as a diva and jerk who put up 1,000 catches, 16,000 yards, and 150 touchdowns. You can look as much as you want, you will never find a guy even close to those numbers. Then you say you discount the pass numbers because of rule changes. I know where you going here, but when T.O was in his hay day, there was still a relatively large amount of contact allowed in terms of being physical with the receiver and lesser restrictions on how defensive players could hit offensive players. Finally, you say his numbers are discounted because of a pass happy league. Now while this is a good point, I also assume you are docking stats from Rice, Moss, Bruce, Gonzalez, Brown, Smith, Harrison, Fitzgerald, Wayne, Johnson, Lofton, Carter, Holt, etc an even amount as you are for T.O. Where does the stat docking end? The fact of the matter is T.O showed up to play and he did his job extraordinarily well. Did he ever say he "plays when he wants to" like Moss? Did he ever smother his gloves with stickum like Rice? Now while I don't believe T.O is better than either of those two guys, you cannot convince me he is not a top 5 receiver of all time. If you are fine with a top 5 player at their position being left "to stew" outside of the Hall for years that is your choice. The stats speak for themselves, this whole thing only proves that getting into the Hall is nothing but a popularity contest. 

So he is a diva and jerk.  The real problem is that he was poison. You can find much bigger divas and jerks, but I can't think of anyone I would say was more poisonous to his own teams.

[Conker]

Today after 11years the New York Jets released there Center Nick Mangold http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/18765536/new-york-jets-releasing-veteran-center-nick-mangold

 

 

[Cobby_]

6 hours ago, Rocko said:

Today after 11years the New York Jets released there Center Nick Mangold http://www.espn.com/nfl/story/_/id/18765536/new-york-jets-releasing-veteran-center-nick-mangold

 

 

Make it happen seattle!

[dmsleight]

6 hours ago, Greenlicious said:

Make it happen seattle!

That would be nice.  I don't think they can manage though.  They have no cap space.  He would be a good guy to bring in to mentor their very young line.

[WorldsBestSpy]

Matt Elam arrested on drug charges - the Ravens will finally get rid of the biggest bust of our team this decade.

[skidmarkgn]

11 hours ago, Greenlicious said:

Make it happen seattle!

Britt at center was the one bright spot this year.  Replacing him with an aging veteran would be a huge mistake.

[starcrunch061]

On 2/23/2017 at 8:54 PM, Lithium_Lemon said:

I respectfully disagree with you, he deserves to be in the Hall of Fame right now. There is no way in hell that Terell Davis, who played 7 seasons in the NFL deserved to get in the Hall over a guy like Terell Owens. Davis is a borderline Hall of Famer in any capacity, much less over T.O. Everyone who talks about T.O acts like he was some diva who complained about everything. Yeah, he did lose his temper and went completely out of line in some circumstances, yet those same people forget to mention he was the only guy who actually showed up for the Eagles in the Superbowl and did so with a broken leg I might add. Next, you say there are plenty of guys who both divas and jerks who put up "Terell Owens numbers"? I want to know someone who you classify as a diva and jerk who put up 1,000 catches, 16,000 yards, and 150 touchdowns. You can look as much as you want, you will never find a guy even close to those numbers. Then you say you discount the pass numbers because of rule changes. I know where you going here, but when T.O was in his hay day, there was still a relatively large amount of contact allowed in terms of being physical with the receiver and lesser restrictions on how defensive players could hit offensive players. Finally, you say his numbers are discounted because of a pass happy league. Now while this is a good point, I also assume you are docking stats from Rice, Moss, Bruce, Gonzalez, Brown, Smith, Harrison, Fitzgerald, Wayne, Johnson, Lofton, Carter, Holt, etc an even amount as you are for T.O. Where does the stat docking end? The fact of the matter is T.O showed up to play and he did his job extraordinarily well. Did he ever say he "plays when he wants to" like Moss? Did he ever smother his gloves with stickum like Rice? Now while I don't believe T.O is better than either of those two guys, you cannot convince me he is not a top 5 receiver of all time. If you are fine with a top 5 player at their position being left "to stew" outside of the Hall for years that is your choice. The stats speak for themselves, this whole thing only proves that getting into the Hall is nothing but a popularity contest. 

 

I completely agree. Terrell Owens was a beast. A douchy beast, to be sure, but a beast nonetheless. I don't think he's on par with Randy Moss, but I would certainly put him next to people like Marvin Harrison or Reggie Wayne (actually, I might give him a bit of a bump over those guys, since they had Manning throwing to them).

 

The fact of the matter is, when Owens played, he was among the very best at his position. I don't think he was the best. But being among the best still gets you in the Hall.