TLOU 2 spoilers galore and also Ghost of Tsushima delayed

[Infected Elite]

Just now, The Titan said:

i don't think anyone is buying this game.

like i said. To each their own. 

[BlindMango]

Even if you changed up all the characters to whoever you wanted them to be, it still wouldn't negate this plot from seemingly being an absolute disaster. I'll still wait until the game actually releases and see if the leaked plot was just a big "Oh just kidding! You thought it was a generic plot? Well the second half of the game wasn't leaked and it's a real crazy turnaround!"

 

Neil, what is this script? It's like all the big questions we all had about the world, characters, infected, the cure, the fireflies, etc that we had from the first game are just like "who cares", here's this generic plot instead. It's reads like some bizarre fanfic sidestory - That's it, it doesn't even seem like a main story, the plot feels like some kind of spinoff

 

Ever since the unveil there were always small things shown in the plot that made me go "huh that's odd, but I'm sure this isn't just a generic revenge tale though". So as you can imagine, this isn't very reassuring. It's like the original Watch Dogs, all the possibilities with that story, that world, and the story was... a revenge tale. Absolutely unreal  

 

Edited April 29, 2020 by BlindMango

[Kamurotetsu]

I don't care about any spoilers for this game, the rabid outrage, any "political agenda" really, I'm more interested in the leaker who is rumored to be an ex-developer at ND and wasn't paid for doing crunch. That's not acceptable. The leaker could have gone about resovling these issues in a better way, but the damage is done. If it's true, pay your goddamn employees properly. Just a thought. 

[AJ_Radio]

4 hours ago, panikooooos said:

For anyone who may not know the agenda of "Mr." Druckmann, the writer behind this game read this interview excerpt

Highlights: He admits Nathan Drake was gonna have a son but he changed it into a daughter, he says he has been influenced by *squints* Anita Sarkeesian + diversity and representation (lmfao), and he admits he asked "sexist" focus testers who didn't like how he fucked up everything with his wokeness to leave! Clearly there's no sjw agenda in this game 

 

Anita Sarkeeian is a piece of shit human being. I don't need to go into details.

 

Druckmann's statement is a load of bullshit, and definitely proves how far Naughty Dog has gone down the tubes. There definitely was an agenda, as @Undead Wolf made clear in his thread a couple years back.

 

4 hours ago, Seraphim_Rez said:

Sure are a lot of people talking about forced agendas and whatnot.
No one is forcing you to play the game.

What is wrong about diversity? Does it really bother you to have media portray characters different than yourself?
And it's funny how people are talking about games pushing politics as if they've never done that before.

Metal Gear Solid, any Tom Clancy game, Call of Duty.

Peace Walker even has an audio file where Big Boss raves about Che Guevara for 5 minutes.

Call of Duty is military fan wank. (While it's cool to see troops do badass things, as military myself, I certainly have mixed feelings about it.)

Did you get outraged playing FFVII where you start out as part of a group of eco terrorists fighting a megacorporation by bombing them?
 

I could certainly whine about how The Division is shoving right wing gun rights agenda down my throat. How about that?

 

And who cares if every single female video game character isn't attractive or feminine?
Japanese roleplaying games had of us play non masculine male characters for years.

I've played a large number of games where the men are far from attractive and I sure didn't spend time whining about it.

 

And he is right, why does it matter?

If you get so butthurt because "omg I'm playing a icky gurl" then you have some problems.
Sorry the game is not for you. Move on. Go play The Division that it totally not political or whatever.

 

Because in this age of over sensitivity, people will nitpick anything that doesn't suit them.

 

The generation holding the pitch forks were probably too young to spot something as Big Boss raving about Che Guevara, that's a pretty small snippet of the game. The Last of Us Part II in contrast was supposed to be one of the biggest releases of the year. I hate the fact that too many people have jumped to conclusions from the leak, but I also hate the fact that Naughty Dog has seemingly pushed forth an agenda these past few years that shows they have fallen to that mentality. Making sex changes to satisfy people with a certain agenda.

 

Hideo Kojima has had politics and diversity in his games since well, ever since the first Metal Gear Solid game. I've heard some people take spats at his latest game Death Stranding, but not at the level people are taking spats at Naughty Dog.

 

Final Fantasy VII came out in 1997, this was a time when people had over powered masculine male characters (Duke Nukem) and attractive, yet dazzling anime characters in JRPGs. Times were different. If we never got the original release and just had the Final Fantasy VII Remake, you bet your ass people would be bitching about the politics. As a matter of fact a lot of people have already griped about the remake. It's just ridiculous.

 

15 - 20 years ago this kind of stuff didn't bother people all that much. Times have changed, basically anyone is basically held accountable for his actions, no matter how insignificant. If I was Neil Druckmann I'd probably hide myself in a corner. Sean Murray did that when his game (No Man's Sky) got bombarded by angry keyboard warriors wondering why so much promised content was left out.

 

Give it time, and people will probably drop this crusade against Naughty Dog and probably forgot a lot of what happened. At least with No Man's Sky, the developers had the game go through a few overhauls, so now it's actually fairly playable.

 

Sad that a generation that grew up on South Park and Family Guy is so overly sensitive and "woke".

[Quink666]

24 minutes ago, Spaz said:

 

Anita Sarkeeian is a piece of shit human being. I don't need to go into details.

 

Sad that a generation that grew up on South Park and Family Guy is so overly sensitive and "woke".

 

Don't think i have ever agreed with anything you said on these forums but this post is right on the money. Well said!

[PostGameBlues]

22 hours ago, Stardroid said:

 

We are playing in a post apocalyptic world that is generally a terrible place to be in. Having darker tones in the game itself makes complete sense. Apparently, according to some, TLoU can't afford the luxury of free story telling and is restricted to feel good endings. Have these people never seen a tragedy? Read a devastating book? Listened to a moody song? There is plenty of enjoyment and fulfillment out of things with darker undertones. What's important is how the story is experienced and if it evokes the correct responses through what the creator has in mind. I don't think stories should always be pleasant. They should be real. 
 

But that wasn't my problem with the leaked plot though... I seriously doubt anyone here wanted a 'and they live happily ever after!' ending lol. Countless films and games that had fucked up stories managed to still feel emotionally satisfying even if they were straight up depressing or cruel. 

 

I just think that there's this notion going around that just because the world of TLOU is dark and cruel, anything that happens gets automatically exempted from criticisms of whether that story event actually makes sense or even feels satisfying (i.e. satisfying in the sense that what happens make sense for the character's current progression in the story). It's almost as if the setting or the world of TLOU has become a scapegoat for the writers to do whatever they wanted because at the end of the day, anything fucked up that happens you can easily just say 'eh, its a dark and cruel world amirite?'. 

[Stardroid]

1 minute ago, PostGameBlues said:

But that wasn't my problem with the leaked plot though... I seriously doubt anyone here wanted a 'and they live happily ever after!' ending lol. Countless films and games that had fucked up stories managed to still feel emotionally satisfying even if they were straight up depressing or cruel. 

 

I just think that there's this notion going around that just because the world of TLOU is dark and cruel, anything that happens gets automatically exempted from criticisms of whether that story event actually makes sense or even feels satisfying (i.e. satisfying in the sense that what happens make sense for the character's current progression in the story). It's almost as if the setting or the world of TLOU has become a scapegoat for the writers to do whatever they wanted because at the end of the day, anything fucked up that happens you can easily just say 'eh, its a dark and cruel world amirite?'. 

That is some nice simplistic thinking there mate. First, if you think there is nobody out there that wanted a happy ever after, I don't know what to tell you chief. I also don't know where you derive the "it's dark therefore exempt from criticism". I don't think you've been reading my message at all. I'll put more of my thoughts in a status update as stated before, I am not interesting in conversing in here because I would like to avoid further spoilers and most of it is meaningless anyway. 

[PostGameBlues]

Just now, Stardroid said:

That is some nice simplistic thinking there mate. First, if you think there is nobody out there that wanted a happy ever after, I don't know what to tell you chief. I also don't know where you derive the "it's dark therefore exempt from criticism". I don't think you've been reading my message at all. I'll put more of my thoughts in a status update as stated before, I am not interesting in conversing in here because I would like to avoid further spoilers and most of it is meaningless anyway. 

But that's what your reply to me was all about mate lmao. You decided to talk about people not wanting a dark story when that wasn't even the main thing people had problems about. You were arguing against a point that didn't even exist lol. 

[Stardroid]

2 minutes ago, PostGameBlues said:

But that's what your reply to me was all about mate lmao. You decided to talk about people not wanting a dark story when that wasn't even the main thing people had problems about. You were arguing against a point that didn't even exist lol. 

I have clearly stated and discussed other problems people have with the game (some of it just got deleted), but not everything obviously since those would be spoilers. My God, that guy was right, there really is no point in arguing. Try and think for a moment here. Do you honestly think I am openly going to discuss everything about a video game that hasn't been released? I never even claimed darker undertones is the main problem people have with the game. It just happens to be the only thing I am willing to give away because all else is truly spoiler territory. 

Edited April 29, 2020 by Stardroid

[NaseemJohn]

Not a fan of the whole sjw movement but this shit is getting old and annoying from both sides now. I would understand the complaints if the directors agenda directly affected the quality of their games or if it was really in your face but seriously a girl with muscles is what people are getting mad at? As for the story leaks, I’ll just wait till the full game is actually out and playable before I judge. Not gonna read a spoiler post or watch a couple broken up clips from a 20 hour long game then act like I’ve experienced the full thing. 

Edited April 29, 2020 by NaseemJohn

[Dauersack]

55 minutes ago, NaseemJohn said:

Not a fan of the whole sjw movement but this shit is getting old and annoying from both sides now. I would understand the complaints if the directors agenda directly affected the quality of their games or if it was really in your face but seriously a girl with muscles is what people are getting mad at? As for the story leaks, I’ll just wait till the full game is actually out and playable before I judge. Not gonna read a spoiler post or watch a couple broken up clips from a 20 hour long game then act like I’ve experienced the full thing. 

You know, thats just the thing, people not reading. There are video leaks showing most of the games crucial story moments, you have a good idea about how the story in total will look if you see the important moments, how they get there will not matter if the events themselves make people sick. One side knows what they are talking about, while most of the other side does not because they usually avoid the spoilers, yet they insist on calling the critics anger baseless, or try, like you just did, to ignorantly reduce it to just some sjw stuff being in there. The sjw stuff, while annoying, is not even the biggest complaint, but let me just tell you that the muscles on some of the people are almost not worth mentioning in that regard. The sjw stuff is in your face for basically all of the material that was leaked in a variety of ways, indicating that the full game will not be much different. Characters get changed just to fit into the picture of that (and no, I do not just mean physical appearance), that sjw stuff was forced in to that ridiculous extend and many of the other problems seem to have been caused by it, so it will most likely end up making the game a lot worse, and yet it still is not even close to being the strongest complaint about what could be seen, just one of the few that can actually be mentioned without spoiling people. What can be found online it is just a giant mess in general, disrespecting established characters and demonstrating some terrible writing and decision making in action.

 

So to get back to your point, yes if the only complaints were about some of the characters looking like "Strong Woman" from Southpark, then I'd agree that people overreact. Thats not the case though, this point just gets attacked the most by both sides because the critics of the game can mention it without spoiling, and the defenders of the game who want to avoid spoilers for the most part so they read only about that stuff and see people much angrier than expected for what they read, so as a result thats the only thing they also go after. It is your right to believe that people disliking basically every key moment they have seen from the story do not have a clear enough picture of the finished game to form a valid opinion, obviously many people disagree with you there and you can't even rule it out for yourself without having seen the spoilers, but people need to realize that knowing a big part of the games big moments is much better than knowing nothing when it comes to having a strong opinion on it. The funny thing is, you all will soon be realizing why we were actually mad, and I hope some people then look at their posts and facepalm hard for some of the stuff they wrote.

 

This whole discussion suffers from the fact that people do not talk about the spoilers openly, common courtesy actually works against the topic in this case, imagine that. The things we allow ourselves to somewhat openly talk about here are the weakest complaints, so it is obvious that this will not impress diehard fans all that much, but these same fans do not seem to understand that their opinion on the entirety of the situation is basically worthless because it is based on nothing, while the opinion of the critics is based on video evidence. Common courtesy goes both ways too, people who know the spoilers stop themselves from giving their best arguments as to why they think the game is to be avoided, the least the opposing side could do is realize that they do not know all that much, post their opinion that they still think the game will be amazing, and then move on without trying to act like the only elephant in the room is the sjw stuff. Guess the best thing to do at this point is keeping further discussion to a minimum on both sides. The spoilers are out there, plenty of people in the know tried to get it through some of the thicker skulls around here that the main problem runs WAY deeper than sjw stuff being obnoxious in this game, usually with no success, only way to reach these people is by spoiling them, something they do not want. This is not really going anywhere until the game is out and one of the two sides is going to have a lot of fun, we will see which one.

 

Btw I am not too keen on making another massive escalating discussion about this like in the last thread, unless I can discuss with a defender of the game who actually knows anything, but I have seen this "its only some sjw stuff, why are people so mad about this all of a sudden" misconception a few too many times, and I wanted to clear that up because it is not fair to people who read that and just believe it. Play the game day 1 if you want, go in blindly, but don't try to water down our words of warning to just the sjw stuff, because the problems the leaks have shown are, sadly, a hell of a lot more severe.

Edited April 29, 2020 by Nighcisama

[Stardroid]

I have seen pretty much all the leaks, including the 4chan and Reddit summary. I see no problem whatsoever. 

[Dauersack]

1 minute ago, Stardroid said:

I have seen pretty much all the leaks, including the 4chan and Reddit summary. I see no problem whatsoever. 

Good for you then, you are to be envied because you will most likely enjoy a sequel to a game you liked. I wish I could enjoy it, but there are way too many dealbreakers from what I have seen to even consider buying it unless they change some big things, and if anything I expect more shit to come with the full release. What interests me though is this, can you at least somewhat fathom why people would be mad at some of the stuff that can be seen in the leaks? Obviously not talking about the sjw stuff but the heavier spoilers. Because I have a bit of a hard time understanding how a fan of the first game can be perfectly fine with it, though of course peoples taste are vast.

[Stardroid]

Just now, Nighcisama said:

Good for you then, you are to be envied because you will most likely enjoy a sequel to a game you liked. I wish I could enjoy it, but there are way too many dealbreakers from what I have seen to even consider buying it unless they change some big things, and if anything I expect more shit to come with the full release. What interests me though is this, can you at least somewhat fathom why people would be mad at some of the stuff that can be seen in the leaks? Obviously not talking about the sjw stuff but the heavier spoilers. Because I have a bit of a hard time understanding how a fan of the first game can be perfectly fine with it, though of course peoples taste are vast.

It's because I experience a story the way it's told, not the way I want it to be told to me. And yes, I can fathom why people won't like what they'll get to see. But that is all I'm saying on this and I am now backing out for real because as far as I am aware, the ending isn't leaked fully / confirmed and I'd like to at least keep it that way. Have a nice day. 

[Dauersack]

1 minute ago, Stardroid said:

It's because I experience a story the way it's told, not the way I want it to be told to me. And yes, I can fathom why people won't like what they'll get to see. But that is all I'm saying on this and I am now backing out for real because as far as I am aware, the ending isn't leaked fully / confirmed and I'd like to at least keep it that way. Have a nice day. 

Fair enough, for me the journey is irrelevant if I know I won't like any of the major stops along the way, much less the end goal, but I can see that people can have other priorities, or think more highly of the stops instead of disliking them like I do. Agree to disagree is sometimes the best we can hope for and as I said, we will know for sure in June. I am honestly curious if you end up liking the game. Have a nice day too.

[Red-River13]

Glad this trash was leaked. If you had such low standards that you actually managed to get invested into this mediocre video "game" then I don't know what to say.

[NaseemJohn]

46 minutes ago, Nighcisama said:

You know, thats just the thing, people not reading. There are video leaks showing most of the games crucial story moments, you have a good idea about how the story in total will look if you see the important moments, how they get there will not matter if the events themselves make people sick. One side knows what they are talking about, while most of the other side does not because they usually avoid the spoilers, yet they insist on calling the critics anger baseless, or try, like you just did, to ignorantly reduce it to just some sjw stuff being in there. The sjw stuff, while annoying, is not even the biggest complaint, but let me just tell you that the muscles on some of the people are almost not worth mentioning in that regard. The sjw stuff is in your face for basically all of the material that was leaked in a variety of ways, indicating that the full game will not be much different. Characters get changed just to fit into the picture of that (and no, I do not just mean physical appearance), that sjw stuff was forced in to that ridiculous extend and many of the other problems seem to have been caused by it, so it will most likely end up making the game a lot worse, and yet it still is not even close to being the strongest complaint about what could be seen, just one of the few that can actually be mentioned without spoiling people. What can be found online it is just a giant mess in general, disrespecting established characters and demonstrating some terrible writing and decision making in action.

 

Here’s the thing tho I have read the leaks and still don’t get the outrage but then again I’m a fan of darker stories such as berserk, devilman crybaby, claymore, game of thrones etc so maybe that’s why It doesn’t bother me. I don’t see how them taking an unexpected turn makes the game automatically shit. I would rather them take chances than to just deliver a safe or familiar route just to please fans. It’s not in your face if you have to go looking on the internet to read a post from someone to realize it’s even a thing in the game that’s what I mean by that. Also I never said the game was gonna be amazing nor did I say it was gonna be shit, I’m waiting to play the full product and experience the game before I give my thoughts on it. 

Edited April 29, 2020 by NaseemJohn

[exsentry]

14 hours ago, Gladiator995 said:

 

  Reveal hidden contents

https://www.sausageroll.com.au/entertainment/games/naughty-dog-made-female-characters-less-feminine-to-be-trans-friendly/

 

Clear agenda pushing by Naughty Dog. How embarrassing.

 

I feel this happens a lot when a franchise/type of hobby (Star Wars, comics, etc.) reaches critical mass. When something niche suddenly becomes overly popular, it then becomes easy to market  and put on a path to maximize it profits; this comes at a cost unfortunately as sometimes decision makers cater to the lowest common denominator vs. the original fans, who supported the product in the first place. There's some initial spin by the page view news and the IGNs, but in the end nothing is left but piles of ash. Where is Star Wars now? How many comic book stores are closing these days? What is the current state of Battlefied? All good things come an end and enjoying ND's games were fun while they lasted...but the red flags started to appear when Druckmann decided to remove Doughnut Drake from UC4 to not offend overweight people.

 

Thank God for indie game developers. 

Edited April 29, 2020 by rotoninja

[punkshepherd]

Im not invested in TLoU. Never played the first game.

 

Seems like bleating from both sides of the argument. 

 

The staff should be paid correctly though. Poor form Naughty Dog if you didnt.  

[seyhano]

I am happy with leaks because the game seems like disappointing and I am ready to be upset. 

Edited April 29, 2020 by seyhano

[sillyrobo75]

As someone that is not really that invested in The last of us universe, I did not search for video spoilers but I read some of the major spoilers for part 2, which I will not mention here ofc. I actually find the main theme and where it leads pretty fascinating, but I can see why players would hate it, and in the end I myself don't really feel that compelled to play it, but since it's spoilers I will not mention why, it's definitely not because extreme feminism or other such reasons I've seen people give.

 

 

 

As for Ghost of Tsushima, I still don't really know what to expect gameplay wise, visually stunning but I will wait for reviews and such before I make my decision on buying it or not.

 

[Johnytomm]

I've read the leaks, looks fucking terrible. I was actually thinking about borrowing a ps4 from my friend and playing it on release day but naaaaaah

[Gladiator995]

1 hour ago, rotoninja said:

 

I feel this happens a lot when a franchise/type of hobby (Star Wars, comics, etc.) reaches critical mass. When something niche suddenly becomes overly popular, it then becomes easy to market  and put on a path to maximize it profits; this comes at a cost unfortunately as sometimes decision makers cater to the lowest common denominator vs. the original fans, who supported the product in the first place. There's some initial spin by the page view news and the IGNs, but in the end nothing is left but piles of ash. Where is Star Wars now? How many comic book stores are closing these days? What is the current state of Battlefied? All good things come an end and enjoying ND's games were fun while they lasted...but the red flags started to appear when Druckmann decided to remove Doughnut Drake from UC4 to not offend overweight people.

 

Thank God for indie game developers. 

I remember when Marvel tried that pandering to the minority shit by changing the characters that people loved into ethnic minorities/transgenders etc and that ended with their sales comics wise plummeting. When they learned their lesson they returned everything back to normal and now things seem to be back to normal again. 

[Carol]

I am a HUGE “The Last of Us” fan. Ever since I played it for the first time, in 2014, I think about it almost every day. It was a sublime, almost ethereal experience for me and one of the best things that happened in my life.

Having that in consideration, what I am still feeling is that I fell asleep on Sunday, while playing AC Odyssey, and ever since I have been trapped in an horrible inescapable nightmare. Because that’s how bad it is. The story that has been leaked and what the game makes you do is the worst sick joke you can imagine. It’s so horrific and grotesque that it seems unreal. How the hell did Neil Druckmann think it would be fine to hurt the fans like that?

My plan is still to buy the game and experience it for myself, since I have been waiting for it all these years, but if things are as bad as they seem to be, this is, probably, the last game from Neil Druckmann that I will buy full price. I really hope the game can change my mind, because what I feel right now is that I am just going to play it, platinum it, delete it and forget that a sequel to the masterpiece ever existed. And just to be completely clear, my horror towards this game has nothing to do with the sexual orientation of the characters. I couldn’t care less if the characters are lesbians or whatever. I think that shouldn’t even be a question and I already said that in the thread mentioned previously.

[GoDBoss173]

49 minutes ago, The Titan said:

Nope, People are mad that a transgender woman kills an amazing character in the dumbest way possible. Not saying who the character is but it's a huge disrespect to his legacy. Also you later play as that transgender character to kill another favorite character. No one wants to play a game like that. It's like GOT Season 8. None of the fans are happy. 

Most people have a problem with it. Games gonna flop now. 

 

Even if the majority of the fanbase hates the game after release ( extremely high chance for several reasons), it will still be successful. The names Naughty dog and TloU alone will sell millions of copies. Many people are easily triggered nowadays and are hating on stuff way too fast BUT in this case all the hate is deserved, I still cant believe what they did.

 

It is not about having a lesbian character in the game ( TloU1 has nothing to do with SJW) or tough and muscular women ( nadine doesnt make Uncharted 4 a SJW game). I defended every TloU2 trailer so far, of course women are a bit muscular/tough and arent wearing make-up or skirts. It is definitely realistic in a game like TloU BUT the game goes far, far beyond that. Unfortunately thats not even the worst part of the game.

Edited April 29, 2020 by GoDBoss173